KCRag Forum

The bridge movement had a lot to do with it. It was the first place the track slab deterioration started well before 2020. That's when they started using the grout, which was not part of the original design. You can see it all over the alignment now (darker gray and plastic looking).

For those that don't remember, the city had to take ownership of the two interstate bridges in exchange for embedding track in them. The 670 bridge was reconstructed because it was past its useful life. MoDOT insisted the profile be modified to allow more clearance for the freeway below. This resulted in a slimmer structure. I think that, coupled with the materials chosen (low profile rail, concrete mix) is what led to the failure. The heat was just the trigger. It wasn't even that hot, and certainly hadn't been hot for that long.

If you watched the repair, they removed basically all of the track slab, reset the rail, installed new rebar, and poured new concrete that is the same spec as the Main Street Extension. They also addressed a small spot in the River Market that was also of concern, but this really was about the bridge and that has been addressed. The rest of the alignment is fine IMO and will be monitored, as it was before the failure.

Appreciate the additional detail, especially for those of us who can't come down and check it out. Thanks!

Dedicated lanes passed. Is there any discussion signal priority on existing or expansion?

langosta wrote: ↑Tue Aug 08, 2023 8:24 pm Dedicated lanes passed. Is there any discussion signal priority on existing or expansion?

Signal priority exists on the starter line and will be installed on the expansion. TSP is a knob, not a switch, and can be set for each signal. The city will evaluate settings, which will be too conservative. At that point we can lobby for turning the knob to 11.

I still can't figure out tsp downtown. The light at 19th and main always stops it. And the streetcar immediately stops again after the light for the stop.

I assume this is because drivers are trash and would end up tailgating the streetcar and blocking the intersection.

It's a tough job, I understand, but there are strange decisions.

WoodDraw wrote: ↑Tue Aug 08, 2023 10:37 pm I still can't figure out tsp downtown. The light at 19th and main always stops it. And the streetcar immediately stops again after the light for the stop.

I assume this is because drivers are trash and would end up tailgating the streetcar and blocking the intersection.

It's a tough job, I understand, but there are strange decisions.

Changing car culture is hard. It's really embedded.

DaveKCMO wrote: ↑Wed Aug 09, 2023 10:04 pm

WoodDraw wrote: ↑Tue Aug 08, 2023 10:37 pm I still can't figure out tsp downtown. The light at 19th and main always stops it. And the streetcar immediately stops again after the light for the stop.

I assume this is because drivers are trash and would end up tailgating the streetcar and blocking the intersection.

It's a tough job, I understand, but there are strange decisions.

Changing car culture is hard. It's really embedded.

Automated policing is the answer but I know state laws blah blah. I'm just complaining. You can't change culture by always reverting to what drivers want.

Another solution which would take money and education, but I think would work on main street is having different lights for different people.

You release pedestrians and streetcars differently than you release cars. I know public works and the traffic engineers will hate this, but it's something to think about.

I apologize if this has been answered elsewhere but does anyone have any information about what differences (if any) the new streetcars will have vs the old ones?

Squishypeas16 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2023 7:42 pm I apologize if this has been answered elsewhere but does anyone have any information about what differences (if any) the new streetcars will have vs the old ones?

Dave, correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe that the vehicles will have the ability, either out of the box or with the purchase/installation of equipment, for off wire operations for a short distance. Tom had mentioned something of the sort in the event they do go ahead with the NKC extension, as not building catenary across the HOA would significantly reduce cost.

Anthony_Hugo98 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2023 9:07 pm

Squishypeas16 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2023 7:42 pm I apologize if this has been answered elsewhere but does anyone have any information about what differences (if any) the new streetcars will have vs the old ones?

Dave, correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe that the vehicles will have the ability, either out of the box or with the purchase/installation of equipment, for off wire operations for a short distance. Tom had mentioned something of the sort in the event they do go ahead with the NKC extension, as not building catenary across the HOA would significantly reduce cost.

The Urbos 3 vehicle platform has an option to add a battery pack for short stints.

Very interesting, thanks so much!

Anthony_Hugo98 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2023 9:07 pm

Squishypeas16 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2023 7:42 pm I apologize if this has been answered elsewhere but does anyone have any information about what differences (if any) the new streetcars will have vs the old ones?

Dave, correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe that the vehicles will have the ability, either out of the box or with the purchase/installation of equipment, for off wire operations for a short distance. Tom had mentioned something of the sort in the event they do go ahead with the NKC extension, as not building catenary across the HOA would significantly reduce cost.

But wouldn't adding battery packs, charging systems etc to vehicles be expensive, and then you have to maintain them. I'm just not a fan of the battery streetcars as they look too bulky and the overhead wires actually gives the corridor more of a "transit" corridor look to it. I really like how sleek the KC streetcars are. Anybody have a pic of what one of KC's streetcars would look like with an added battery pack?

GRID wrote: ↑Sat Aug 19, 2023 3:24 pm

Anthony_Hugo98 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2023 9:07 pm

Squishypeas16 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2023 7:42 pm I apologize if this has been answered elsewhere but does anyone have any information about what differences (if any) the new streetcars will have vs the old ones?

Dave, correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe that the vehicles will have the ability, either out of the box or with the purchase/installation of equipment, for off wire operations for a short distance. Tom had mentioned something of the sort in the event they do go ahead with the NKC extension, as not building catenary across the HOA would significantly reduce cost.

But wouldn't adding battery packs, charging systems etc to vehicles be expensive, and then you have to maintain them. I'm just not a fan of the battery streetcars as they look too bulky and the overhead wires actually gives the corridor more of a "transit" corridor look to it. I really like how sleek the KC streetcars are. Anybody have a pic of what one of KC's streetcars would look like with an added battery pack?

The Urbos 3 platform was built with "plug and play" battery as an optional addition. The battery recharge when the train reconnects to the catenary. Looks-wise, the vehicles look almost identical.

2018 the Birmingham/Midlands transit agency in the UK launched battery Urbos 3 service. 5 segment Urbos 3 traveled 30kilometers between charges at 50 kmph, stopping at stations. All future LRT lines there are based on battery-powered Urbos with catenary as needed. I would imagine batteries have only improved since.

Close up of the 2018 Battery Pack




Front View of Urbos 3 w/ Battery Pack


Side view of Urbos 3 w/ Battery Pack

Okay, those look fine. I think it was OKC or Milwaukee where they have the battery ones and they just look bulky or top heavy or something to me.

Did the WOF car break down at US?

langosta wrote: ↑Tue Aug 22, 2023 5:12 pm Did the WOF car break down at US?

An operator got into it last night and drove it back to the shop while I was out on a walk. They might just park it down there

A lot of expansion work being done at VMF, might be better for them to keep it out.

Tom Gerend mentioned on Twitter once that they are storing a car at Union Station sometimes during expansion of the VMF.

Isnt there a 2 hour parking limit right there. Hope they have the park mobile app.