KCRag Forum

E. Thomas McClanahan offers a vision for what Barney Allis Plaza should look like today in the occasional Fantasy Retrofits in The Star. He said it looked like a "medieval fort" because of its concrete walls disconnected with the street level of the city. Basically the entire plaza would be street level with the two levels joined by a rolling hill complete with boulders, trees and even a stream.

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascit ... 180766.htm

I guess I think McClanahan's idea is pretty much the "duh" factor. Of course BAP needs to be visible instead of looking like a concret fortress. It looks like it's a half-built parking garage from the outside--basically what it is.

I agree that the Barney Allis could be far more inviting on the south and east sides. I think that the new park (Illus Davis?) in the govt district is a complete waste of space. It is disgusting looking and I have never seen one person in the park when walking by it. Maybe there are people there around lunchtime?

LyRiCaL GanGsTa wrote:I agree that the Barney Allis could be far more inviting on the south and east sides. I think that the new park (Illus Davis?) in the govt district is a complete waste of space. It is disgusting looking and I have never seen one person in the park when walking by it. Maybe there are people there around lunchtime?

What about it looks "disgusting"? It's a nicely landscaped park.

And it's packed with people at lunchtime.

The new Civic Center park is not a waste of space, would you rather that part of town be like what the south loop and east loop are now?
Civic Center is a beautiful addition and is surely not a waste of space. The thing is, the east loop just needs to be developed more. Because I doubt people in the adjacent skyscrapers like City Hall, Oak Tower, and the Federal Courthouse would take an elevator down 30 floors (10 in Charles Whittaker FC) and then walk across the street during their break. This can become a big event space if we develop it properly. We could even make it so City Hall can make different sort of announcements.

Also, just be thankful we have Barney Allis Plaza, the people at 1KCP, City Center Square, and the other office towers and hotels are.
It has important parking which cannot be removed, unless you want the park replaced by a parking structure. Because we ARE NOT demolishing any single building next to it for another garage. And that area is badly in need of parking space.

It is poorly designed and looks stupid with little rolling hills. The rolling hills' design is cheesy and suburban-looking. They needed to add more concrete and urban looking stairs leading to and from the fountain, like an east-coast city does thier urban parks. Also... there are no people there which prooves it's a waste. if the city would have had it designed by a reputable architect instead of one of thier kick-back cronies, it may have worked.

You have some very weird views but since they are YOUR opinion I will back down from bashing them...
Civic Park in NO WAY is a waste. There aren't any people there because you aren't going to get people from the three nearby skyscrapers because of their size, AND you can't get anyone from the east loop because it is DEAD, and the rest of the area around it is filled by tiny lowrise buildings, which don't generate very many people.
Like I said, WOULD YOU RATHER have parking lots and rundown building like the east loop in there? Or would you rather have an open, green area with trees and water there? Like what is there now.

With all your talk of concrete and stairs it sounds like you want an impromptu skate park for skateboarders to tear up.

Barney Allis would get a major redo in the sweeping plans put forth by HNTB...
[quote]The south end of Barney Allis Plaza, now a stark concrete wall, would be shaved down to street level and then terraced with a block-long tier of steps that would flow toward the art deco facade of Municipal Auditorium, which, Achelpohl thinks, “is the most beautiful building in Kansas City.â€

.

BAP has been redone so many times since the 70's that my guess is if it is saved one more time the saving will last around 7 to 8 years and then it will be redone again. So leave it alone and work on other things that need work downtown.

it was Andy Udris who wanted to level the Presidnet Hotel and put in yet another one of these urban wasteland parks!

Does anyone else support the idea of getting rid of BAP all together? I think it's kind of a piece of shit that serves no purpose. I like the idea of integrating it into part of the convention center so that a convention could hold outdoor events there, but other than that itsn't it just dead space? It looks especially out of place when viewed from above. Did a major or significant architect design it? I thought I heard that somewhere.

Although, Bartle could build a massive indoor/outdoor garden plaza on its roof for events therefore making BAP totally void in that respect.

Now the city is talking about taking off the top level of parking on the sound end, in order to lower it to street level.

I like the BAP. The Hispanic Festival last year was pretty fun there.

Some of the proposals for BAP are imposable unless they tear it to the ground in my opinion. All it really needs is some repairs to concrete here and there. Also they will soon have to replace all the lancaping there. Because the area with dirt are not as deep as you think and the roots from all those large plants will soon start suffacating themselves killing each othere off one by one. Beside landscaping is not forever you need to constantly replace and change to keep it looking good.

The garage holds less than 1,000 cars. If they are going to lower the south end to street level that will eliminate quite a few spaces that are needed. Maybe what they need to do it wipe out the whole facility and construct a modern garage with more spaces in its place with a park-like setting at street level above it. The new top could take into account any plantings, public space, etc. that would be needed to accomodate conventions and outdoor events.

When it comes to plantings they can not add any more dirt then is already there because it would be to heavy fo any structure on that site.

they should have an architectural competition to make this area live up to its potential.  Just recently, the Project for Public Spaces released a list of the best squares/plazas in the country.... needless to say BAP isn't on there, but it really should.  Hold an architectual competition in 2006, find winner by 2007, go immediately into planning, raise funds so that we can break ground in 2008, and hopefully be open to the public by late 2009.

In Detroit it was a private non-profit organization that spearheaded the movement towards making Campus Martius (it's on the list of best squares/plazas).  We need a similar group to do the same thing here.

Interestingly, Holly Whyte, the founder of PPS was brought in late to the redesign process of Barney Allis Plaza back in 1982. A few of his comments were acted on by the city. Steps were removed from the access point at 11th and Wyandotte to provide more vision into the park. For many years there were movable chairs throughout the park.

scooterj wrote: With all your talk of concrete and stairs it sounds like you want an impromptu skate park for skateboarders to tear up.

Barney Allis Plaza is still one of the hot spots to skate, if you can get there in the dead ofnight. We used to tear shit up there back in the day, before the rentacops started patrolling.