KCRag Forum

smh wrote: ↑Thu Aug 17, 2023 10:24 am

Midtownkid wrote: ↑Thu Aug 17, 2023 10:14 am I like the brick portions at the bottom. I hate the upper floors. That cladding is going to look cheap. The window pattern is bothering me for some reason, too. Doesn't look thoughtful, looks slapped together. I wish they'd splurge for terracotta or some other more interesting material on the upper floors.

Problem with the window pattern is that the elevator core is up against Main St, which makes for an odd looking building.

I'm also curious what the sidewalk width is going to be through here. Feeling a little narrow in the pedestrian heavy zone.

It would be polarizing, but since it is the Crossroads Arts District what if they did a big mural on that Main St. side? Something like the Case building in Dallas's Deep Ellum area

They need to do something architectural that highlights that vertical 'bar' where the elevator is instead of ignoring it. Change the cladding! Make it an interesting light element at night. Do an art installation. Something!

We need some better coloring for some of these buildings. I remember when they were doing the 1914 Main building and they put the insulation board up that was purple, I believe. Then, they covered it with aluminum siding and the life sank out of the building. I wish they would have just left it off and brought some color life to downtown.

beautyfromashes wrote: ↑Thu Aug 17, 2023 1:56 pm We need some better coloring for some of these buildings. I remember when they were doing the 1914 Main building and they put the insulation board up that was purple, I believe. Then, they covered it with aluminum siding and the life sank out of the building. I wish they would have just left it off and brought some color life to downtown.

How I feel with green insulation on some of these.

beautyfromashes wrote: ↑Thu Aug 17, 2023 1:56 pm We need some better coloring for some of these buildings. I remember when they were doing the 1914 Main building and they put the insulation board up that was purple, I believe. Then, they covered it with aluminum siding and the life sank out of the building. I wish they would have just left it off and brought some color life to downtown.

Two “problems” with strong colors being used:
1) Planning staff and occasionally elected officials fight the use of unconventional colors. whether it’s because personal preference, an imagined NIMBY fight, or something else, it happens. That leads to undesirable delays on project approval. Easier to just forgo the color at the outset.

2)Bold colors = higher propensity to fading/shine = more exterior maintenance costs for the developer.

Till you resolve those challenges, neutrals & “natural” colors just offer a lot more benefits to developers and architects.

horizons82 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 17, 2023 2:48 pm Two “problems” with strong colors being used:
1) Planning staff and occasionally elected officials fight the use of unconventional colors. whether it’s because personal preference, an imagined NIMBY fight, or something else, it happens. That leads to undesirable delays on project approval. Easier to just forgo the color at the outset.

2)Bold colors = higher propensity to fading/shine = more exterior maintenance costs for the developer.

Till you resolve those challenges, neutrals & “natural” colors just offer a lot more benefits to developers and architects.

I'm usually a HUGE fan of planning staff, but if this is the case, that needs to change. Modern urban areas have color. Historic areas are not all brick. And maintenance really doesn't make sense in the 1914 Main example because that aluminum siding looked terrible from the get, all dented and seamed and bent.

beautyfromashes wrote: ↑Thu Aug 17, 2023 1:56 pm We need some better coloring for some of these buildings. I remember when they were doing the 1914 Main building and they put the insulation board up that was purple, I believe. Then, they covered it with aluminum siding and the life sank out of the building. I wish they would have just left it off and brought some color life to downtown.

Zahner makes some really cool metal panels in all kinds of different colors. I always dream about designing an apartment tower in the crossroads with metal 'scales' that start as dark purple and fade to a light blue as it rises...or something along those lines. I wish the developers in this city would make use of the creative companies and individuals we have in the city!

Midtownkid wrote: ↑Thu Aug 17, 2023 2:57 pm

beautyfromashes wrote: ↑Thu Aug 17, 2023 1:56 pm We need some better coloring for some of these buildings. I remember when they were doing the 1914 Main building and they put the insulation board up that was purple, I believe. Then, they covered it with aluminum siding and the life sank out of the building. I wish they would have just left it off and brought some color life to downtown.

Zahner makes some really cool metal panels in all kinds of different colors. I always dream about designing an apartment tower in the crossroads with metal 'scales' that start as dark purple and fade to a light blue as it rises...or something along those lines. I wish the developers in this city would make use of the creative companies and individuals we have in the city!

Right! or luminescent that "glows" in the sunlight like fire. I'll take any dense building we can get, but it'd sure be nice where just some small changes could make such a huge difference.

Don't forget that City Club exists. Lots of color there.

missingkc wrote: ↑Thu Aug 17, 2023 7:56 pm Don't forget that City Club exists. Lots of color there.

And Arte KC at 19th & Oak

beautyfromashes wrote: ↑Thu Aug 17, 2023 2:53 pm I'm usually a HUGE fan of planning staff, but if this is the case, that needs to change. Modern urban areas have color. Historic areas are not all brick. And maintenance really doesn't make sense in the 1914 Main example because that aluminum siding looked terrible from the get, all dented and seamed and bent.

To be clear, I’m not impugning KCMO’s staff. I’m speaking more broadly to jurisdictions across the metro and country when it comes to multi family and mixed use development.

At the end of the day it still comes back to the developer’s prerogative. I’m just trying to offer insight into what drive some of them to make the more staid choice.

horizons82 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 17, 2023 10:23 pm At the end of the day it still comes back to the developer’s prerogative. I’m just trying to offer insight into what drive some of them to make the more staid choice.

Correct, as mentioned above, there are a few buildings with some lively color so city staff might not be advocating for it but they aren’t discouraging it either. Perhaps, the buildings mentioned will inspire future buildings to take a small risk on different colors and materials than the typical safe ones.

The main st side looks bad, but not sure it's a huge deal. KCMO is a north south city, so they will want views from the building to the north and south and most people will view the building from the north and south. Although throwing in some fake windows might help if that's possible.

Building is nothing special but fine density added. I'm only upset they didn't save the facade.

My biggest issue is now very personal. Our building faces the back of this building and we require access to their property to swing cars into our basement garage (yes, I own my own car now). There's no easement for this, but the city allowed our building to be developed in 2003 knowing this.

We've asked Copaken to accommodate this in their design. They haven't committed, but it's a deal-breaker for us. Hopefully it's resolved before the project advances to the next step.

DaveKCMO wrote: ↑Fri Aug 18, 2023 11:18 am My biggest issue is now very personal. Our building faces the back of this building and we require access to their property to swing cars into our basement garage (yes, I own my own car now). There's no easement for this, but the city allowed our building to be developed in 2003 knowing this.

We've asked Copaken to accommodate this in their design. They haven't committed, but it's a deal-breaker for us. Hopefully it's resolved before the project advances to the next step.

And whose fault is this

I would say the city for approving a garage design that requires cars of any size swinging onto private property to enter. Then the developer, of course.

Looks like 1822 is flush to the alley, yet they seem to be able to accommodate cars entering garage. Can your garage entrance be widened or altered? Might have to trade in for smaller cars.

I like this building and wouldn't be opposed to it in Kansas City. There was a time during the art deco era when a building of this type would not be unusual.

I don't mind color. Cities have become too bland in my estimation. I say that allies to vehicle colors as well.

KCPowercat wrote: ↑Fri Aug 18, 2023 9:42 am Building is nothing special but fine density added. I'm only upset they didn't save the facade.

If I were the developer of this site, the first thing I'd say to the architect is "save and reuse that facade in your design. That's the entrance to my building."