OFFICIAL - New KCI Terminal

[KCPowercat]

Both are alluding that the other entity has ulterior motives for how they are voting or writing editorials on the concession bid.

I do find the Star's editorials very "some losing bidder told us this so the whole process is shady" on this topic.

Just more proof the airport needs to be in a regional authority and remove this from kcmo council authority.

[DaveKCMO]

I do find the Star's editorials very "some losing bidder told us this so the whole process is shady" on this topic.

Which is why it's an "editorial" and not "news".

[phuqueue]

That Willets Point proposal was on the stove well before Cuomo was ever governor.

N Train Extension To LaG Scrapped

July 16, 2003

...
Reviewing the background of the LaGuardia connection plan, Gianaris recalled, "The community studied and recommended many options [about 20] but they were all ignored by the MTA." The one most favored by the community and elected representatives was the No. 7 train connection from Willets Point near Shea Stadium to the airport, Gianaris said.
...
State Senator George Onorato (D–Astoria) could not be reached for comment on this article, but he was on record as being a major proponent of the Willets Point–No. 7 train link to the airport. He felt that proposal was a natural because it avoided residential areas and was confined to industrial sections where it disturbed no one.
...

https://www.qgazette.com/articles/n-tra ... -scrapped/

"On the stove" is a little bit of an overstatement, there really wasn't anything "on the stove" -- N extension, Airtrain, or any of the other apparently twenty options the community offered back in Giuliani times -- until one day six or seven years ago when Cuomo more or less out of the blue announced the Airtrain (note, e.g., in this article, where someone contemporaneously describes Cuomo as "springing a new project on people"). The pushback was immediate, but it has pretty much been a fait accompli from the moment Cuomo decided he wanted it. That he didn't personally conceive the idea right before announcing it doesn't really change that, nor does it change a bad project that shouldn't be built into a good project that should be.

[kcjak]

Both are alluding that the other entity has ulterior motives for how they are voting or writing editorials on the concession bid.

I do find the Star's editorials very "some losing bidder told us this so the whole process is shady" on this topic.

Just more proof the airport needs to be in a regional authority and remove this from kcmo council authority.

Here's hoping we can move away from discussing the transportation options to/from LGA and back to KCI. If we moved to a regional authority with representatives appointed by different local/regional entities, wouldn't there be the same issues of cronyism, and underhand deals since the members of the authority wouldn't be elected and instead appointed, with them not answering to constituents?

[WoodDraw]

I do find the Star's editorials very "some losing bidder told us this so the whole process is shady" on this topic.

Which is why it's an "editorial" and not "news".

Their hard news story on it was poor as well and completely pr fed.

[herrfrank]

The LGA Airtrain is just a Cuomo vanity project and tremendous waste of billions of dollars. It runs in the wrong direction, to a little used LIRR station, where it will also link up to an already-overcrowded 7 train, ultimately taking longer than existing options for almost everyone. Even the LIRR connection is terrible, because the station is on a standalone line that doesn't connect to the rest of the LIRR network until you get closer in to Manhattan, so even the majority of Long Islanders, who geographically-speaking appear to be in the "right" direction for convenient Airtrain use, will have to travel deeper into the city, transfer trains, and double back to get to the Airtrain. It's almost impressive that they managed to design something that requires almost everybody to overshoot and then double back, no matter which direction they're coming from.

To bring this back to KC -- and speaking of doubling back -- the access to the airport from I-635, meaning much of JoCo, has been hindered by an elaborate double-back detour for more than one year now.

I usually remember this closure, and drive via Ward Parkway/ SW Tfwy/ B'way Bridge, but a few weeks ago I had to pick up my brother late at night and was already in north WyCo before I remembered the closure (it is unmarked until you cross the Missouri River). Since he had checked luggage, hence no hurry, I decided to follow the MoDoT detour to see how much pain it represented.

Well, I won't do that again -- doubled back almost all the way to the KCMO water intake facility, then north toward Smithville on 169 highway, many miles to undeveloped pastureland somewhere east of Tiffany Springs, then a long haul west, back to I-29. I would guess this was a 5-6 mile detour.
WTF ? Just surprised that this is the best that we can do in KC. A 5-mile detour with any sort of traffic could cause multiple missed flights. SMH.

[shaffe]

To bring this back to KC -- and speaking of doubling back -- the access to the airport from I-635, meaning much of JoCo, has been hindered by an elaborate double-back detour for more than one year now.

I usually remember this closure, and drive via Ward Parkway/ SW Tfwy/ B'way Bridge, but a few weeks ago I had to pick up my brother late at night and was already in north WyCo before I remembered the closure (it is unmarked until you cross the Missouri River). Since he had checked luggage, hence no hurry, I decided to follow the MoDoT detour to see how much pain it represented.

Well, I won't do that again -- doubled back almost all the way to the KCMO water intake facility, then north toward Smithville on 169 highway, many miles to undeveloped pastureland somewhere east of Tiffany Springs, then a long haul west, back to I-29. I would guess this was a 5-6 mile detour.
WTF ? Just surprised that this is the best that we can do in KC. A 5-mile detour with any sort of traffic could cause multiple missed flights. SMH.

Firstly, you didn't take the marked detour for 635 NB to 29 NB. The detour for that ramp being closed is to jump over on 29 SB and pick up 169 there, not to take 9 over to 169 via Briarcliff. See page 3 at this link (https://www.modot.org/sites/default/fil ... etour.pdf ).

Secondly, "undeveloped pastureland"? Unless you drove all the way up to 435 (which, again, isn't the detour) you took 169 to 152 which passes through normal suburban developments and not a single "undeveloped pasture". Even on 152 there's not really any "undeveloped pasture".

Thirdly, yeah it's not a great detour but it's not THAT out of the way. It adds maybe 5-7 extra minutes to your drive, tops. 10 if there's heavy traffic, which there almost never is in that area. If 10 minutes causes a missed flight then the detour ain't your problem. If you usually go via Ward Parkway/SW Trafficway/Broadway bridge you're probably already costing yourself more time than just taking the regular detour.

[flyingember]

Secondly, "undeveloped pastureland"? Unless you drove all the way up to 435 (which, again, isn't the detour) you took 169 to 152 which passes through normal suburban developments and not a single "undeveloped pasture". Even on 152 there's not really any "undeveloped pasture".

Incredibly, you're wrong to the point it tells me you don't drive 169 because one is visible from the freeway

This is why transit is so hard in the northland, because there's so much undeveloped land so close in while we sprawl out to the SW. There's empty land for homes where N 35th would cross I-35.


Just south of where N 78th would cross 169 is still undeveloped pasture. It may have been sold since it had had a sign up visible to 169 for some time, but on street view you can even see the old and new barns and farm fencing.

https://www.google.com/maps/place/North ... 94.5727598

There's a second large pasture associated with a home between the Gladstone water tower and N Broadway just south of there. The old farm fence is still up in street view from May

It's owned by a shopping center company, but there's a third one at 169 and 152. I think it might be mowed for hay. They haven't torn out the trees yet.

----

Along 152 has one really notable area, the SW corner at 435 is undeveloped pasture big enough for 800 homes.

There's another large area on the NW corner
Another just off Maplewoods Pkwy to the NE corner

----

And then there's massive undeveloped land between Tiffany Springs, 169, 152 and 435. There's a few developments but the west side of 169 north of 152 is mostly nothing

[herrfrank]

In my opinion, it was pasture land. Perhaps "undeveloped future suburbia" would also be an appropriate description.

In any case, the point is that this detour adds more than five miles to the journey. That is not trivial. Urban interstate detours that go on for more than one year should not add five miles to an important urban destination (the airport).

[flyingember]

In my opinion, it was pasture land. Perhaps "undeveloped future suburbia" would also be an appropriate description.

In any case, the point is that this detour adds more than five miles to the journey. That is not trivial. Urban interstate detours that go on for more than one year should not add five miles to an important urban destination (the airport).

So it’s ok to spend billions adding interchanges so you can save two minutes going to the airport?

[herrfrank]

^ It is a ridiculous detour. There are far more efficient ways to get someone from Parkville back onto I-29 north than a detour (almost) to Smithville. That's the primary grievance.

Secondary is better signage on the Kansas side -- this should be alerted in several parts of the metro on primary roads headed north.

[GRID]

^ It is a ridiculous detour. There are far more efficient ways to get someone from Parkville back onto I-29 north than a detour (almost) to Smithville. That's the primary grievance.

Secondary is better signage on the Kansas side -- this should be alerted in several parts of the metro on primary roads headed north.

KC has a ton of ITS message signs, more than most metros. They should use them for stuff like this. What are they doing to 635?

[flyingember]

What are they doing to 635?

https://www.modot.org/i-29-multiple-bri ... omis-drive

Crews will close the I-635 northbound ramp to I-29 northbound from 8:00 p.m. Monday, March 15 until 6:00 a.m. Wednesday, Nov. 17 for bridge work

[aknowledgeableperson]

Both are alluding that the other entity has ulterior motives for how they are voting or writing editorials on the concession bid.

I do find the Star's editorials very "some losing bidder told us this so the whole process is shady" on this topic.

Just more proof the airport needs to be in a regional authority and remove this from kcmo council authority.

In reviewing some of the news stories about the concession contract I am not sure the selection process was "shady" but I do find it unusual, especially given the limited information, from what I have reviewed, given to the council. Granted my time with the city was many years ago but I find the current bidding process, bid review process, and limited information to the council quite different than in my experience. True, back then there was politics involved by the council at both the committee and full council levels but for us staff members that was to be expected and were prepared. At least the council members knew who was was biding, what the bids composed of, how the bids were judged, and why one was selected over the others. Now it seems the council receives far less information than back in the old days. And if you were a council person would you be comfortable voting on such as large contract without knowing all of the information about not only the chosen bid but the other bids as well? Staff can have one set of criteria whereas the council, on an individual basis as well as a group basis, might have a different set of criteria to judge the individual bids.

To a point I might agree with having a regional authority over the airport but it wouldn't change much. You would still have politics and favorites involved in the decision making process.

[kcjak]

At least they didn't end up with the option containing Zarda as the BBQ choice!!

[DaveKCMO]

The main difference would be those at the table for a regional airport authority would only be focused on those issues and would probably be appointed rather than elected. The Council has a thousand issues to get cross with each other about and that spills into things that normal adults would simply debate and vote on. Add the heightened media scrutiny that only KCMO City Hall gets and here we are.

[normalthings]

Council approved the concessions contract. City Manager reported Loar to the law department over a voicemail she left earlier in the process.

[flyingember]

Council approved the concessions contract. City Manager reported Loar to the law department over a voicemail she left earlier in the process.

Piece on this. She also gave a folder of information to the mayor.
https://www.kcur.org/news/2021-10-07/ka ... eresa-loar

[herrfrank]

^Shades of Linda Tripp

[Major KC Fan]

HaHa-best line ever!