Phase Three Streetcar Expansion

[DaveKCMO]

The first priority I think is to expand the Streetcar along the East side, either 31st and Linwood or another acceptable route. All this talk about JoCo streetcar and JoCo transit should only be viewed in the context of a larger regional vote where those residents would contribute dedicated funding to RideKC for bus and streetcar service in their area, which they do not do currently. So all this hate about JoCo stealing jobs and development from KC although it may or may not be valid points, I think having JoCo spend more money on JoCo transit to improve JoCo itself is a good thing and will make the city overall better.

This is the way.

[normalthings]

STL pushing their north/south light rail or BRT line again. Now includes north/south into the county. Tax already approved and now hoping to get it lined up for the infrastructure bill. Let’s get going y'all. Gets some more rail projects in KC proposed.

[Anthony_Hugo98]

STL pushing their north/south light rail or BRT line again. Now includes north/south into the county. Tax already approved and now hoping to get it lined up for the infrastructure bill. Let’s get going y'all. Gets some more rail projects in KC proposed.

We need a comprehensive light rail plan or need to get some official plans from the North rail and Next-rail plans to be able to put a vote together id imagine

[normalthings]

STL pushing their north/south light rail or BRT line again. Now includes north/south into the county. Tax already approved and now hoping to get it lined up for the infrastructure bill. Let’s get going y'all. Gets some more rail projects in KC proposed.

To add, sounds like they think they are going to get all of the state’s infrastructure bill transit funds.

[alejandro46]

The best thing going for them is that it sounds like they already have a dedicated Metrolink sales tax. We need some kind of dedicated revenue source like that. It's also notable that they have connected their airport and hope to connect another airport in STL to Metrolink but at the same time have cut bus service due to lack of drivers, just like here.

[normalthings]

The best thing going for them is that it sounds like they already have a dedicated Metrolink sales tax. We need some kind of dedicated revenue source like that. It's also notable that they have connected their airport and hope to connect another airport in STL to Metrolink but at the same time have cut bus service due to lack of drivers, just like here.

2nd airport extension is funded with construction starting shortly. I agree we need county transit taxes but at least come up with a "menu" map of rail lines to get people excited. Bus does not get the average voter excited

[Anthony_Hugo98]

I agree we need county transit taxes but at least come up with a "menu" map of rail lines to get people excited. Bus does not get the average voter excited

This could do enough to excite people, I never remember it being SUPER publicized back at the last vote either. Just toss on the current riverfront extension as well and the NKC extension option. This map also shows how viable a Prospect LRT or SC line could be

[normalthings]

I agree we need county transit taxes but at least come up with a "menu" map of rail lines to get people excited. Bus does not get the average voter excited

This could do enough to excite people, I never remember it being SUPER publicized back at the last vote either. Just toss on the current riverfront extension as well and the NKC extension option. This map also shows how viable a Prospect LRT or SC line could be

Yea, give people a map with Jackson County/Stadium, Waldo, KU Med, NKC or Airport, and maybe a JoCo line. Give people something to aspire to.

[Anthony_Hugo98]

I agree we need county transit taxes but at least come up with a "menu" map of rail lines to get people excited. Bus does not get the average voter excited

This could do enough to excite people, I never remember it being SUPER publicized back at the last vote either. Just toss on the current riverfront extension as well and the NKC extension option. This map also shows how viable a Prospect LRT or SC line could be

Yea, give people a map with Jackson County/Stadium, Waldo, KU Med, NKC or Airport, and maybe a JoCo line. Give people something to aspire to.

Exactly. Visualization is the key here, people need to see the options that can be had.

[beautyfromashes]

I'd give up all those miles of different extensions for one extension to the airport.

[Anthony_Hugo98]

I'd give up all those miles of different extensions for one extension to the airport.

God I’m with you there. Denver is a prime example of viable LRT to a far flung airport. It was one of their main drivers of foot traffic for their new district they developed around their downtown station. We run a line to US from the airport and we’ll have very little problem attracting events in the future. We’d probably be a guaranteed lock for WC2026 if we already had it.

[normalthings]

I would take KU-Stadiums and UMKC-Waldo over the airport. A lot more ridership and just as good if not better for events.

[Anthony_Hugo98]

I would take KU-Stadiums and UMKC-Waldo over the airport. A lot more ridership and just as good if not better for events.

I will honestly take anything at this point. We just need more rail

[AlkaliAxel]

STL pushing their north/south light rail or BRT line again. Now includes north/south into the county. Tax already approved and now hoping to get it lined up for the infrastructure bill. Let’s get going y'all. Gets some more rail projects in KC proposed.

To add, sounds like they think they are going to get all of the state’s infrastructure bill transit funds.

I fucking hate Missouri so much.

[AlkaliAxel]

That's a tough call...airport or urban line. I think I slightly lean towards the airport line, mostly because then people coming in for events could get straight downtown and then just take the streetcar at that point to get their "event" or wherever. And again, this would really start reorienting things back towards KC and not the suburbs.

[alejandro46]

Hot and probably bad take is that I also somewhat selfishly think an airport rail line would be a huge win for the city. Not just because of the airport, but because it has the chance to create actual density in the Northland and connecting struggling Zona Rosa and re-developing Metro North to Downtown along with the countless lots along those areas that could have walkable apartments.

In addition, this would be important for visitors to come in and have a transit option without having to rent cars. Dave will tell you that not enough riders justify expanding to the airport, and hes right, but looking at a total network being voted on by every county, imho I think Northland voters would be ableto get behind a plan that included such an extension up N Oak to KCI with potentially a longer-longer term solution to connect Liberty. I don't really see how that could be easily done as there's really not much density and the road network isn't as direct except just highways or connection via heavy-rail tracks.

The first priority is to get East-West funded by fed stimulous money and a TDD of some kind, the next is to get a regional vote on the ballot.

[normalthings]

As I understand it, moving people around once at their hotel is a bigger issue then getting them from the airport to hotel. But your points for the northland I can agree with. It’s not the best route but it might guarantee future suburban development is built “right” and I think it would be a good way to fight the secession movements. I guess my issues with it are that we build 3 miles per decade, so we should probably prioritize the highest need routes first and that it wouldn’t score well for grants. Also looks like a lot of the KCI route walkshed has been developed now


Random Musings

The bigger priority is connecting hotels with trip generators (convention center, stadiums, employment centers) and activities/culture (museums, food, art, parks). We loose points for having all these things spread pretty far out. Crown Center was a complete other world from the convention center until streetcar opened. Soo much so they considered building their own convention center at one point. Thankfully, a lot of the routes we discuss here (JoCo, KU-Truman, etc) check those boxes and are useful for daily riders. Streetcar is good at connecting but it’s overwhelmed or flat out closed during big events. I also go on and on about the need for more mid sized downtown hotels. Condense our rather spread our hotel stock.

STL: Stadium and Convention Center are connected. 4 Seasons and convention hotels nearby. All are next to the CBD with LRT to other hotel and employment centers, forest park, etc. horrible walkability but the base for something good is there.

Nashville: Entertainment district is next to the convention center/ hotels and a short walk to the stadium. Not a far walk to the office towers of CBD. Major museums sprinkled around their downtown loop. All very walkable, winning tons of events for various reasons

Cincinatti:Repeat of the others

[DaveKCMO]

Airport route won’t score federal funding, so double the local investment.

[Anthony_Hugo98]

Airport route won’t score federal funding, so double the local investment.

Could BRT to the airport?

[beautyfromashes]

As I understand it, moving people around once at their hotel is a bigger issue then getting them from the airport to hotel. But your points for the northland I can agree with. It’s not the best route but it might guarantee future suburban development is built “right” and I think it would be a good way to fight the secession movements. I guess my issues with it are that we build 3 miles per decade, so we should probably prioritize the highest need routes first and that it wouldn’t score well for grants. Also looks like a lot of the KCI route walkshed has been developed now

Has a rail route to KCI even been proposed? Just announcing the route could spur development along it, building up future density that would help with federal funds requirements. The city/counties need to cast some vision here.