Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Discuss items in the urban core outside of Downtown as described above. Everything in the core including the east side (18th & Vine area), Plaza, Westport, Brookside, Valentine, Waldo, 39th street, & the entire midtown area.

Does the Plaza need a drastic change or on the right path?

Keep it as is - almost entirely as a shopping/restaurant mall district.
11
16%
Mix things up just a little more such as adding neighborhood amenities, broader nightlife, lighter eats.
31
45%
Needs more drastic change with less mall focus, pedestrian only street, residential within.
21
30%
Don't care.
5
7%
Other
1
1%
 
Total votes: 69

User avatar
taxi
Valencia Place
Valencia Place
Posts: 1712
Joined: Thu Feb 08, 2007 12:32 am
Location: North End
Contact:

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by taxi »

Darlene, just wear sneakers and carry a whistle, gun and your heels in your purse. Or take an uber from Olathe.

flyingember
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8072
Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:54 am

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by flyingember »

Darlene wrote:I like the Plaza pretty good but I do want to see more parking lots. A lot of ladies are not okay with parking in the garages at night.
Which stores do you want to be shut down?

Darlene
Pad site
Pad site
Posts: 78
Joined: Mon Apr 09, 2018 4:14 pm

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by Darlene »

Shut down? I hope none of them.

empires228
Strip mall
Strip mall
Posts: 152
Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2016 2:23 pm

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by empires228 »

Darlene wrote:Shut down? I hope none of them.
I think he's referring to the fact that you're asking for more parking lots, but the only way parking lots can be added is if we destroy existing buildings.

MidtownCat
Valencia Place
Valencia Place
Posts: 1862
Joined: Fri May 07, 2004 12:05 pm
Location: ~Westwood~

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by MidtownCat »

Alright, confession time. Who’s sock is Darlene?

Darlene
Pad site
Pad site
Posts: 78
Joined: Mon Apr 09, 2018 4:14 pm

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by Darlene »

I guess some of them houses up the hill can be torn down. A lot of them are old looking and frankly I think dangerous looking. It would be a little walk but I think people need to walk more anyways.

User avatar
TheLastGentleman
Alameda Tower
Alameda Tower
Posts: 1318
Joined: Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:27 pm

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by TheLastGentleman »

Darlene wrote:It would be a little walk but I think people need to walk more anyways.
=D>

Darlene
Pad site
Pad site
Posts: 78
Joined: Mon Apr 09, 2018 4:14 pm

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by Darlene »

TheLastGentleman wrote:
Darlene wrote:It would be a little walk but I think people need to walk more anyways.
=D>
Thank you.

earthling
Oak Tower
Oak Tower
Posts: 5695
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by earthling »

Moving Plaza improvement conversation from other Plaza thread here...
kcmiz wrote:Plaza needs greater density to save it, both residential and commercial. Up-zoning of the entire Main corridor to encourage TOD must happen for streetcar Phase II to really be successful.

The NIMBY mentality of "Saving the Plaza bowl" non-sense needs to end.

:-
Agree it's time to end maintaining 'the bowl'. Highwoods tried to turn Plaza towards an office park by proposing to tear down some of the retail/residential buildings, which didn't go over very well. One tactic that might work is to propose adding just a few residential floors to existing Plaza buildings that can handle it. If I were the developer/owner, would release to media a preliminary plan to add a couple floors at first to get public reaction and then if no major backlash, release full plan for a few more floors. If too much backlash, maybe revise plan back to a couple floors. Though if public perception grows that the Plaza is 'going downhill', maybe ideas for re-inventing Plaza will gain momentum - which is why I'm planting such ideas in other thread. And well more than half of raggers think it needs to be more than just a shopping center.

But new Plaza owners are mostly mall operators so most they may do is recognize the surrounding neighborhood at best (as Nichols did), which does have more density than most of KC with all the mid/hirises - streetcar foot traffic will help. If they are not successful with Plaza (and it may struggle just as a mall in the online era), maybe they'll sell to a true mixed use owner/operator.

flyingember
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8072
Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:54 am

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by flyingember »

Highwoods still owns an office tower and the residential building they proposed tearing down.

The new owners only own the shopping + small office space. They just got Nordstrom to move to the shopping district, I don't think they'll have problems sticking around even without serving the neighborhood.

earthling
Oak Tower
Oak Tower
Posts: 5695
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by earthling »

Nordstrom will be new for Plaza but not new to metro and isn't really a top tier desirable store anymore, hence they are closing stores and transitioning to services. Some other shopping districts with Nordtrom still in downward trend.

The successful trend has been mixed use, not isolated districts dedicated to primarily one core function. The results of the poll above appear to agree.

http://money.cnn.com/2017/11/05/investi ... index.html

earthling
Oak Tower
Oak Tower
Posts: 5695
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by earthling »

With the Plaza becoming more stale as each year goes by, I'll be submitting this thread again to the newish Plaza owners. They responded last time I sent this to them, acknowledging the ideas. Re-vote if you'd like above and post more ideas below, factoring current state of retail troubles in the age of online shopping.

What are some 'services oriented' businesses that you've seen nationally that could work on Plaza?

At this point, what are thoughts on turning Nichols Rd into a pedestrian only street per examples in first post?

User avatar
normalthings
Penntower
Penntower
Posts: 2414
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 9:52 pm

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by normalthings »

earthling wrote:
Sun Dec 22, 2019 11:20 am
With the Plaza becoming more stale as each year goes by, I'll be submitting this thread again to the newish Plaza owners. They responded last time I sent this to them, acknowledging the ideas. Re-vote if you'd like above and post more ideas below, factoring current state of retail troubles in the age of online shopping.

What are some 'services oriented' businesses that you've seen nationally that could work on Plaza?

At this point, what are thoughts on turning Nichols Rd into a pedestrian only street per examples in first post?
A higher end barber shop like Buffalo Mane. A drug store live CVS. An Urban Target.

More residential density!

User avatar
TheLastGentleman
Alameda Tower
Alameda Tower
Posts: 1318
Joined: Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:27 pm

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by TheLastGentleman »

I say demolish as many garage structures as possible and replace with actual development.

A specific thing I would do if I was in control is get rid of the plaza bowl zoning and allow high rises in the core of the plaza.

This is probably controversial, but I'd make all new construction in the middle of the plaza faux Spanish to the same degree as the existing faux Spanish parts. My logic being that much of the plaza's existing faux Spanish architecture is actually from relatively late, such as the Seville Tower replica, which is from the 60s. The plaza was always supposed to be escapist, and leaning into that escapism could allow it to differentiate itself from the rest of the urban core.

User avatar
FangKC
City Center Square
City Center Square
Posts: 14476
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2003 10:02 pm
Location: Old Northeast -- Indian Mound

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by FangKC »

I just wish they would develop that damned embankment on the north side of 46th Terrace.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0434561 ... 6656?hl=en

jasty5
Pad site
Pad site
Posts: 50
Joined: Tue Aug 27, 2013 11:16 pm
Location: Hyde Park, KC

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by jasty5 »

As someone who lives nearby and frequently walks to the plaza, more neighborhood services would be nice. I like the high end barber shop suggestion. I also love the Deibel’s cigar lounge, maybe more high end and unique social settings like that? Also agreed with more residential.

Riverite
Strip mall
Strip mall
Posts: 299
Joined: Fri Apr 07, 2017 5:49 pm

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by Riverite »

I would like to see them add one-two floors of residential above any new or remodeled building on the plaza. That way it doesn’t screw up the scale, but it should go a long way to making it more of a neighborhood

earthling
Oak Tower
Oak Tower
Posts: 5695
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by earthling »

Is it time for the bowl to go away? 10 floor max? 25 floor max? The 'Save the Plaza' crowd and some in neighborhood would probably fight that one. When the Boomers move on to next realm, might be better time.

On tearing down garages mentioned, most are pretty well hidden as it is (better than new downtown garages). May as well build on top, 6-8 floors might work w/out much of a fight.

moderne
Bryant Building
Bryant Building
Posts: 4350
Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2004 2:50 pm
Location: Mount Hope

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by moderne »

The scale of the Plaza retail district Spanish-ish buildings is very carefully designed. It is like Disney's Main St. The theme of mostly 2 floor buildings with towers as landmarks is what gives the district the scale and charm that attracts people. There is plenty of residential density (and getting denser) outside of these few blocks to support the district. Adding floors to the old buildings would overwhelm them and make the scaled down from reality towers obscure and awkward.

earthling
Oak Tower
Oak Tower
Posts: 5695
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm

Re: Poll: Does the Plaza need a drastic change, some change or on the right path?

Post by earthling »

^Disagree that a few taller buildings would get in the way of the charm but many would probably agree with you. What about 6 floors on the existing garages? That's more inline with Euro neighborhoods. Part of making the Plaza mixed use is mixing in some residential.

Post Reply