Nashville?

[AlkaliAxel]

Why don’t we do something like that in our own Crossroads by the tracks and make the yards?

[normalthings]

Why don’t we do something like that in our own Crossroads by the tracks and make the yards?

We don’t have amazon and other giants trying to build in our city.

[alejandro46]

Why don’t we do something like that in our own Crossroads by the tracks and make the yards?

We don’t have amazon and other giants trying to build in our city.

So many local companies are used to cheaper, lower density offices in JoCo. Amazon is building here, just big wearhouses and data centers on the outskirts.

[normalthings]

Why don’t we do something like that in our own Crossroads by the tracks and make the yards?

We don’t have amazon and other giants trying to build in our city.

So many local companies are used to cheaper, lower density offices in JoCo. Amazon is building here, just big wearhouses and data centers on the outskirts.

Yea we aren't getting local HQs or national back or regional offices to go downtown like Nashville is.

[Riverite]

We don’t have amazon and other giants trying to build in our city.

So many local companies are used to cheaper, lower density offices in JoCo. Amazon is building here, just big wearhouses and data centers on the outskirts.

Yea we aren't getting local HQs or national back or regional offices to go downtown like Nashville is.

I don’t really understand this, especially as the northland is growing. Downtown is so much more central, it’s a nice area isn’t really that much more expensive and you can probably attract more young dynamic employees. One of the reasons I moved from KC was not being able to find a good job in the city

[dukuboy1]

We don’t have amazon and other giants trying to build in our city.

So many local companies are used to cheaper, lower density offices in JoCo. Amazon is building here, just big warehouses and data centers on the outskirts.

Yea we aren't getting local HQs or national back or regional offices to go downtown like Nashville is.

that's a shame because we can offer a lot of what Nashville offers, maybe even with better access to downtown from our surrounding areas. IMO the one big thing going for Nashville is the focus the entire state puts on it. It's the capital and a lot of development dollars and political dollars flow through it. Memphis is next in line and has it's fair share but I think with Nashville having that capital focus makes a huge difference. KC will always have to compete with STL within its own state for attention and with other cities in the region. Even with smaller metros like Des Moines and Omaha they pose a challenge to KC, as again those states are hyper focused on the development of those areas and taking advantage of having the centric view. KC gets hurt by the politics at times that it doesn't get the attention it needs from it's home state and it has to work in a unique way within the metro as the KS side of KC is every bit as important and influential as the MO side of the metro

[earthling]

Nashville has the music culture, state capitol, higher tier university, better winters, better natural beauty/recreation. KC is fortunate to have the momentum it has but probably won't draw many high profile F500 companies with upper tier roles. Could change over time but with some exceptions most deep winter cities aren't getting the draw as much as they used to, not like the South does now.

KC needs a new Big 5 regional strategy drive now that airport and other targets have hit the mark. The new top 5 should include addressing crime as #1 as a regional concern, raise bar of UMKC and other universities, continue to improve regional transit. Others?

[normalthings]

Nashville has the music culture, state capitol, higher tier university, better winters, better natural beauty/recreation. KC is fortunate to have the momentum it has but probably won't draw many high profile F500 companies with upper tier roles. Could change over time but with some exceptions most deep winter cities aren't getting the draw as much as they used to, not like the South does now.

KC needs a new Big 5 regional strategy drive now that airport and other targets have hit the mark. The new top 5 should include addressing crime as #1 as a regional concern, raise bar of UMKC and other universities, continue to improve regional transit. Others?

KC metro violent crime rate is below that of Nashville. In fact, KC doesn't even make the top 50 list. Just need to make sure it is managed and doesn't become a reputation (warranted or not) as the case is in St. Louis, Chicago, and Detroit.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/433 ... rime-rate/

We are missing regional rapid transit and a tier 1 university. Nashville has the latter and will build the former in the next decade or two. Building a tier 1 university will take the cooperation of all our businesses leaders and local billionaires. Even then, I don't think enough corporate and private wealth exists to build a top-20 uni here. General MO and KS public doesn't seem to care about goign big on our universities. As mentoned before, KC lacks large spec space downtown but that can be changed quickly if the will power is there.

KC winters are bearable for the most part but Nashville summers are completely unbearable. We may shift closer to the a "warm winter city" as the globe heats

I agree that we need to include regional rapid transit and tier 1 uni on the Big 5 list. I think transit is and hope to see a push over the next few years.

[earthling]

^I meant KCMO's crime problem impacts the region but point taken. It needs to be a top 5 even from economic strategy concerns, not just a social concern. Trend of site selection that factor weather seems to favor unbearable summers over deeper winters.

[normalthings]

^I meant KCMO's crime problem impacts the region but point taken. It needs to be a top 5 even from economic strategy concerns, not just a social concern. Trend of site selection that factor weather seems to favor unbearable summers over deeper winters.

I edited my comment above a little. I generally agree.

[moderne]

Nashville only has marginally milder winters. It is about the same latitude as Eureka Springs or Fayetteville ARK or the MO boot heel. Was there once in late April and all the trees and blossoms were brown from a late freeze.

[normalthings]

^ I don't understand Nashville either for all the opposite reasons. 30 story hotels go up there like weeds and they don't seem to have any impact. More just keep getting proposed and built.

I know Nashville is the exception to the rule, especially for an inland city, but what is happening there is just insane. That city might look like Atlanta in another 30 years. Not that that is a good thing, but it just amazes me how a sleepy town like that can just take off like they did.

Nashville was a sleepy backwater that redeveloped their dead downtown into one of the hottest tourism districts in America. They got their act together and blew away from their state competitor. What differentiates us from them is (1) top tier research university and (2) they developed a vision in the late 80s/90s and haven't let off the gas pedal since.

I think that there was a clear path for us to get on a Nashville like track by 2030 if Lucas had not won. Letting off the gas pedal is killing momentum in every area and there isn't really any clear leadership or vision to get us there now.

This is VERY true actually. Nashville had just opened their arena a few years prior to KC voting to build Sprint. That was really the first thing they really did. But they JUST DID NOT STOP after that. That city wanted to do great things with downtown and they made it happen. Downtown Nashville was just as bad as KC's in the 80's and 90's.

Moving to Nashville thread.

Strong growth of high paying jobs has allowed Nashville to support many towers. Look at the difference in average rents for Central KC vs Nashville.

From Colliers.....

Central KC effective rent psf: $1.479
Central Nashville: $2.83

TN, TX, etc have no income taxes which are a big benefit for job relocations. I am theoretically against that system but if it is balanced by higher property taxes than maybe it is worth Missouri looking into a switch.

[earthling]

^Nashville also doesn't have a second economic center on other side of state line to compete with. Is rare for a smallish market like KC to have a secondary economic center in the burbs (a mini version of San Jose's to San Fran or Orange County to LA). The state line job hopping for incentives have really set KC back yet as a whole doing very well relative to most of Midwest. Is good that KC won't become Nashville or Austin. Steady growth is ultimately better than insane boom growth. KC is still an easy place to live and easy going, Austin and Nashville no longer are.

"Keep KC Sane"

[GRID]

^Nashville also doesn't have a second economic center on other side of state line to compete with. Is rare for a smallish market like KC to have a secondary economic center in the burbs (a mini version of San Jose's to San Fran or Orange County to LA). The state line job hopping for incentives have really set KC back yet as a whole doing very well relative to most of Midwest. Is good that KC won't become Nashville or Austin. Steady growth is ultimately better than insane boom growth. KC is still an easy place to live and easy going, Austin and Nashville no longer are.

"Keep KC Sane"

All true. Still way too much emphasis on Johnson County, especially the corporate community. I know you keep saying things are getting better for the MO side, I hope that stays that way. KC needs a few decades of MO side dominance to even begin to correct the damage done.

Downtown KC would be a totally different animal if even 10-20% of the jobs and wealth that left KCMO for JoCo were to ever come back. And the entire metro would be better off too, including JoCo.

It's fun watching a city like Nashville transform, but I think KC is a far more interesting city and all the new skyscrapers won't change that.

[earthling]

JoCo's 'emphasis' is their own success. So it goes. Any time there are two+ balanced economic centers, of course those downtowns will represent less % of metro jobs compared to metros that only have downtown as only major economic center. Is surprising downtown has over 100K jobs with so much office space elsewhere in metro, way more than similar metros.

[FangKC]

Johnson County is now starting to have some of the problems that KC has experienced. The infrastructure in the northern part of the county is aging. There are increases in poverty. It won't be a free ride forever.

[earthling]

^And as often mentioned MO side gaining more jobs than KS side recently, including higher paying pro biz jobs. JoCo is still a notable secondary economic center that most other metros KC's size don't have to deal with. N JoCo flight to S JoCo isn't as bad of impact as it used to be but they still have aging infrastructure to deal with lower relative avg income than past. Downtown OP momentum is a start and at least JoCo doesn't appear to have a high vacancy issue.

[FangKC]

One thing that goes unsaid a lot is that Johnson County does pay more than its share of the weight funding the State of Kansas.

[FangKC]

^And as often mentioned MO side gaining more jobs than KS side recently, including higher paying pro biz jobs. JoCo is still a notable secondary economic center that most other metros KC's size don't have to deal with. N JoCo flight to S JoCo isn't as bad of impact as it used to be but they still have aging infrastructure to deal with lower relative avg income than past. Downtown OP momentum is a start and at least JoCo doesn't appear to have a high vacancy issue.

There might be a new metro with a competing economic center. Buckhead is attempting to secede from Atlanta.

...
White is the chief executive officer of the Buckhead City Committee (BCC), a group trying to convince lawmakers and voters that the neighborhood should split—or de-annex—from Atlanta and become a city unto itself. There are many political hurdles, but White’s group has already cleared a few of them, and a bill has been introduced in the Georgia legislature to allow the de-annexation to come up for a vote next year. If all goes in the BCC’s favor, White expects the new city to be up and running by June 2023.
...
A split could be devastating for Atlanta financially. Buckhead isn’t small—it stretches over 24 square miles—and the proposed new city would take with it nearly 90,000 residents, about one-fifth of Atlanta’s current population. Atlanta would lose an estimated 38% of its tax revenue if Buckhead leaves, according to the Buckhead Community Improvement District.
...
According to a fiscal analysis conducted by the Committee for a United Atlanta, de-annexation would cost Atlanta as much as $116 million annually, while Atlanta’s school district could lose almost $232 million every year. A feasibility study undertaken for the BCC found that de-annexation would be a huge boon for Buckhead City. It would bring in an estimated $203 million in revenue annually, vs. $90 million in expenses, according to Valdosta State University’s Center for South Georgia Regional Impact. Some of the expenses would go toward a police department, with at least 250 officers at a starting salary of $55,000, the BCC says.
...

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features ... Cs9cBhpAJg

This should be watched closely, because there are parties in the Northland who might attempt the same, and legislators in Jeff City willing to help them.

[normalthings]

600,000 sqft spec office tower in Nashville.
lincoln Property's Circle South









https://www.bizjournals.com/nashville/n ... pdate.html