KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

KC topics that don't fit anywhere else.
flyingember
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 9862
Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:54 am

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by flyingember »

WoodDraw wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:59 am https://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/ ... erger.html

Rival bid for kcs with Kansas City becoming the combined us hq.
CN has a D- for Amtrak on time performance compared to CP's A rating
dukuboy1
Alameda Tower
Alameda Tower
Posts: 1031
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 12:02 pm

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by dukuboy1 »

Curious, is CN D- based on having more Amtrak capacity and thus a higher frequency/chance to perform less than on time? Also would KCS be attractive as a way to improve this? Obviously the teeth of this deal is not centered around passenger traffic at all, but squarely of the shipping and freight aspects of the companies. Still just curious.

Also, Normalthings. You have mentioned before that you are aware of either behind the scenes news and or solid rumors' of other developments involving KC and railway business. Does this announcement play into it or can you share any more details? Again, just curious. I would love to see KC become a major player for transportation and logistics business in the US. Really build a nice industry and geographical business draw for the area to create maybe even a "boom town" of sorts around it such as Dallas, Atlanta, Phoenix, etc. did in the 80's & 90's
User avatar
normalthings
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8018
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 9:52 pm

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by normalthings »

dukuboy1 wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:05 am Curious, is CN D- based on having more Amtrak capacity and thus a higher frequency/chance to perform less than on time? Also would KCS be attractive as a way to improve this? Obviously the teeth of this deal is not centered around passenger traffic at all, but squarely of the shipping and freight aspects of the companies. Still just curious.

Also, Normalthings. You have mentioned before that you are aware of either behind the scenes news and or solid rumors' of other developments involving KC and railway business. Does this announcement play into it or can you share any more details? Again, just curious. I would love to see KC become a major player for transportation and logistics business in the US. Really build a nice industry and geographical business draw for the area to create maybe even a "boom town" of sorts around it such as Dallas, Atlanta, Phoenix, etc. did in the 80's & 90's
I think Amtrak shows the CN delays are far worse than competitors (iirc). I ride Amtrak fairly often and my worst non random delays (random being things like weather, forest fire, train wreck, etc) are on Canadian National.

My insights are more so transportation and new office buildings in the works but they are not necessarily overlapping.
earthling
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8519
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm
Location: milky way, orion arm

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by earthling »

Of interest to the metro area, CN said it would make Kansas City the headquarters of the combined company’s U.S. and Mexico operations, retain the KC Southern name in the U.S. and offer a direct link to Detroit for the area’s auto plants.
https://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/ ... years.html

This also could be better for KC than CP deal that would still keep operations in Minneapolis that KC might have to compete with for jobs long term.
User avatar
beautyfromashes
One Park Place
One Park Place
Posts: 7189
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2005 11:04 am

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by beautyfromashes »

earthling wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 1:17 pm
Of interest to the metro area, CN said it would make Kansas City the headquarters of the combined company’s U.S. and Mexico operations, retain the KC Southern name in the U.S. and offer a direct link to Detroit for the area’s auto plants.
https://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/ ... years.html

This also could be better for KC than CP deal that would still keep operations in Minneapolis that KC might have to compete with for jobs long term.
Does our city government have anything they can use as leverage in the decision between the two? Not even something that we would necessarily use but would be seen as beneficial for one or the other to give something back to the city, like a US HQ building DT or direct Amtrak service to Denver. Just thinking out loud. Seems big market moves like this are an opportunity to get something we want for the everyday citizen instead of just the stockholders.
WoodDraw
Hotel President
Hotel President
Posts: 3348
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2004 8:53 pm

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by WoodDraw »

earthling wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 1:17 pm
Of interest to the metro area, CN said it would make Kansas City the headquarters of the combined company’s U.S. and Mexico operations, retain the KC Southern name in the U.S. and offer a direct link to Detroit for the area’s auto plants.
https://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/ ... years.html

This also could be better for KC than CP deal that would still keep operations in Minneapolis that KC might have to compete with for jobs long term.
CP was going to keep a headquarters in Mexico too right?

I’m sure with this offer they’d still have jobs there, but if they reported up through Kansas City and not Canada that could be meaningful.
User avatar
normalthings
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8018
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 9:52 pm

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by normalthings »

earthling wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 1:17 pm
Of interest to the metro area, CN said it would make Kansas City the headquarters of the combined company’s U.S. and Mexico operations, retain the KC Southern name in the U.S. and offer a direct link to Detroit for the area’s auto plants.
https://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/ ... years.html

This also could be better for KC than CP deal that would still keep operations in Minneapolis that KC might have to compete with for jobs long term.
Unsure. CP wanted to move the non-yard operations jobs to KC pending union approval anyways. CP would have to use the routes in/out of KC as the system's mainline. CN can bypass KC using the KCS Meridian Speedway which helps to connect Mexico with their existing n/s mainline in Louisiana.

Google searches are not coming up with any CN offices in the US at present. KCS appears to be requirering that an acquiring firm keep an HQ or major office in KC. The CN deal is not contigent on regulator approval. If it isnt approved, they will spin KCs off or sell it to another railroad. A resale could see KCS taken by someone else, maybe even CP, and the office moved out.
User avatar
normalthings
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8018
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 9:52 pm

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by normalthings »

beautyfromashes wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 1:52 pm
earthling wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 1:17 pm
Of interest to the metro area, CN said it would make Kansas City the headquarters of the combined company’s U.S. and Mexico operations, retain the KC Southern name in the U.S. and offer a direct link to Detroit for the area’s auto plants.
https://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/ ... years.html

This also could be better for KC than CP deal that would still keep operations in Minneapolis that KC might have to compete with for jobs long term.
Does our city government have anything they can use as leverage in the decision between the two? Not even something that we would necessarily use but would be seen as beneficial for one or the other to give something back to the city, like a US HQ building DT or direct Amtrak service to Denver. Just thinking out loud. Seems big market moves like this are an opportunity to get something we want for the everyday citizen instead of just the stockholders.
Union Pacific has been rumored to be considering a move out of Omaha. The current deal has them there till 2024. I think it would be great if we tried to land 2 major railroads in our city. If the worst happens and KCS is obliterated, UP could swipe the existing KC workforce.
User avatar
beautyfromashes
One Park Place
One Park Place
Posts: 7189
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2005 11:04 am

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by beautyfromashes »

normalthings wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 2:05 pm Union Pacific has been rumored to be considering a move out of Omaha. The current deal has them there till 2024. I think it would be great if we tried to land 2 major railroads in our city. If the worst happens and KCS is obliterated, UP could swipe the existing KC workforce.
I understand trying to keep the jobs, but this is a major acquisition. We should get something better than what we already have. If we don’t get some major concession locking the partner to KC long term, they might keep the jobs in the short-term but would likely consolidate them somewhere else in the future. I’m tired of KC companies merging or being acquired and having nothing to show for it.
User avatar
normalthings
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8018
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 9:52 pm

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by normalthings »

beautyfromashes wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 2:21 pm
normalthings wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 2:05 pm Union Pacific has been rumored to be considering a move out of Omaha. The current deal has them there till 2024. I think it would be great if we tried to land 2 major railroads in our city. If the worst happens and KCS is obliterated, UP could swipe the existing KC workforce.
I understand trying to keep the jobs, but this is a major acquisition. We should get something better than what we already have. If we don’t get some major concession locking the partner to KC long term, they might keep the jobs in the short-term but would likely consolidate them somewhere else in the future. I’m tired of KC companies merging or being acquired and having nothing to show for it.
That's what I am saying. CP has a sizable US HQ/office that they would be moving here. Kansas City would physically be the center of their new route network. C-level CP leadership has been in KC and meeting with the mayor and governor which I think solidifies their desire to move jobs to KC.

I can not find any CN office in the US and there are no Google results for a US HQ. I think the CN version of US-Mexico HQ in KC means to keep everyone who is here now in place for the time being. I don't think that KC would be the center of this new Mexico-US-Canda RR
earthling
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8519
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm
Location: milky way, orion arm

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by earthling »

CN network
Image

KC Southern network
Image

edit: KCS with Mexico...
Image
Last edited by earthling on Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
beautyfromashes
One Park Place
One Park Place
Posts: 7189
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2005 11:04 am

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by beautyfromashes »

They're going to take the W&R HQ building aren't they? Proving that spec office space in this city is viable.
dukuboy1
Alameda Tower
Alameda Tower
Posts: 1031
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 12:02 pm

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by dukuboy1 »

normalthings wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 2:05 pm
beautyfromashes wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 1:52 pm
earthling wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 1:17 pm

https://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/ ... years.html

This also could be better for KC than CP deal that would still keep operations in Minneapolis that KC might have to compete with for jobs long term.
Does our city government have anything they can use as leverage in the decision between the two? Not even something that we would necessarily use but would be seen as beneficial for one or the other to give something back to the city, like a US HQ building DT or direct Amtrak service to Denver. Just thinking out loud. Seems big market moves like this are an opportunity to get something we want for the everyday citizen instead of just the stockholders.
Union Pacific has been rumored to be considering a move out of Omaha. The current deal has them there till 2024. I think it would be great if we tried to land 2 major railroads in our city. If the worst happens and KCS is obliterated, UP could swipe the existing KC workforce.
That would be very nice get if UP would come to KC along with this deal/ I agree that having 2 major railroad players in town would be a nice boost, and one that could be a catalyst for other businesses, especially in logistics, transportation, and freight. May even spur complementary business and new start ups. But a boost is a boost regardless. Getting the best deal for 1 should be impactful, if both than that is an even sweeter deal. KC should really work to get this done.

Plus I was always a fan of controlling all the railroads in Monopoly :)
User avatar
normalthings
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8018
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 9:52 pm

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by normalthings »

Image
earthling
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8519
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm
Location: milky way, orion arm

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by earthling »

According to CommercialEdge KC ranks about 14th for industrial space under construction and 7th for % of total space to be added (UC and planned). KC, Indy and Columbus are the hot industrial growth markets in Midwest (and Chicago in raw numbers).

Image

https://www.commercialedge.com/blog/wp- ... l-2021.pdf
earthling
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8519
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm
Location: milky way, orion arm

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by earthling »

According to CBRE, KC is in top 3 for industrial construction in Midwest. The fact that pre-leased is low and construction activity high while vacancy also manageable means speculative approach and more confidence in KC market by developers. It also means a good amount of space is available for tenants (perhaps looking at new markets to enter) who need space quickly.

Image
earthling
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8519
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm
Location: milky way, orion arm

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by earthling »

A Canadian supply chain solutions company opens a fullfilment center in KC. Perhaps per attention of KCS deal? More Canadian connections to follow?

https://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/ ... lment.html
earthling
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8519
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm
Location: milky way, orion arm

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by earthling »

This is getting interesting... KC Southern accepts bid from Canadian National over Canadian Pacific..

https://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/ ... l-bid.html
The abrupt shift by KC Southern comes on a day when Canadian National COO Rob Reilly and Chief Legal Officer Sean Finn were in town to make their case to area government and business officials. Reilly and Finn said they spoke with Kansas City Mayor Quinton Lucas and officials with the Chamber of Commerce of Greater Kansas City and KC SmartPort. They wanted to reassure local officials that Kansas City will remain an important center, and Canadian National an important local player, after an acquisition of KC Southern.
User avatar
beautyfromashes
One Park Place
One Park Place
Posts: 7189
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2005 11:04 am

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by beautyfromashes »

earthling wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 7:56 pm This is getting interesting... KC Southern accepts bid from Canadian National over Canadian Pacific..

https://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/ ... l-bid.html
The abrupt shift by KC Southern comes on a day when Canadian National COO Rob Reilly and Chief Legal Officer Sean Finn were in town to make their case to area government and business officials. Reilly and Finn said they spoke with Kansas City Mayor Quinton Lucas and officials with the Chamber of Commerce of Greater Kansas City and KC SmartPort. They wanted to reassure local officials that Kansas City will remain an important center, and Canadian National an important local player, after an acquisition of KC Southern.
I get the impression that this outreach to the city and interest in continued business here is a major factor in the decision to go with CN. I know that CP has stuck by their statement that the CN bid won't meet regulatory approval, but I think the major power brokers here have a lot of sway with the decision and CP needs to not just up their bid but also give assurances to the city that we as a community will benefit and not just shareholders outside the city.
User avatar
normalthings
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8018
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 9:52 pm

Re: KC metro gaining as a major distribution hub

Post by normalthings »

CP Ceo had been meeting with KC and Gov
Post Reply