OFFICIAL - Main Street Streetcar Extension

[Anthony_Hugo98]

I was just curious as to how many vehicles the system will have and I guess they are ordering eight more for a total of 14? Wouldn't that be one of the largest in the country?

The yard seems kid of small for that many vehicles even if they expand it, but I guess they have it all figured out.

Likely 6 operating at any given time, a double length bay and 3 single length bays, and two siding storage tracks. The VMF will likely still have some capacity even after the addition

[FangKC]

Am I the only person underwhelmed by the shelter structures for the streetcar stations? Not much better than a typical bus stop. Would like to see something that offers more shade, more enclosure from winter winds. People waiting on transit in KC always look so forlorn.

The transit shelter situation in this city SUCK. There are better transit shelter structures in some third-world countries.

The bus shelters at 12th and Grand are the worst. They don't provide any shade when it's really hot in the summer, and are useless when it's raining because the overreach is not enough if there is even a mild wind. There is no real protection from sub-zero wind. I've gotten completely soaked here on a cold, rainy day. I don't understand this concept of them having a glass roof either that allows the sun to hit transit users.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0998424 ... 384!8i8192

The old shelters at the 10th and Main transit center were vastly superior for transit riders. They provided more shade and protection from wind and rain.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.102231 ... 312!8i6656

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.101971 ... 312!8i6656

But I guess anything is better considering that most bus stops in Kansas City have no shelter at all, or even a place to sit.

[DaveKCMO]

The fact that shelter roofs are glass does not mean that 100% of the sun's heat hits people underneath. They have a coating and anyone standing underneath one in full sun can step outside and feel the difference. It is not 100% shade, but that's the balance with security. Shit happens in bus shelters downtown -- literally and figuratively -- and the city's cameras are above.

The previous shelters at 12th & Grand created a major chokepoint for pedestrians and wheelchairs.

Valid criticism, but it's only gotten harder to maintain security in the public right-of-way and there's only so much space available for amenities. Vandalism alone has created a situation where the agencies are even less likely to want to add shelters. The response to that increased vandalism comes from the same pot of money that supports the service on the street.

As a transit user and someone involved in all of these designs, I can tell you there was a very real intent to balance customer and safety/access needs.

This thread is about the streetcar extension.

[moderne]

Since this thread is about the Main St Extension, those planned shelters are what I am talking about. This past autumn I saw much larger enclosed glass shelters on the Cleveland BRT. If such a notorious sketchy place can have such with safety why not at least a major station such as the planned Plaza station(that does not have space limitations)?

[DaveKCMO]

Since this thread is about the Main St Extension, those planned shelters are what I am talking about. This past autumn I saw much larger enclosed glass shelters on the Cleveland BRT. If such a notorious sketchy place can have such with safety why not at least a major station such as the planned Plaza station(that does not have space limitations)?

Here's the Plaza station. It's a center island. The bus lane is to the east. General northbound travel lane to the west.

[beautyfromashes]

They aren’t keeping the middle island greenery/bushes are they? That’s the #1 place for panhandling in the area and is very dangerous? Plus, the greenery always looks terrible.

[DaveKCMO]

They aren’t keeping the middle island greenery/bushes are they? That’s the #1 place for panhandling in the area and is very dangerous? Plus, the greenery always looks terrible.

I believe that is permanently gone.

[KCPowercat]

Where is the overhead view of this stop and how people will walk to it? I like the center island that first shot just seems ped isolated from the front?

[smh]

Good opportunity here as well to eliminate some of the high-speed turns along this section of the route...something I suspect is in the plans.

[DaveKCMO]

Good opportunity here as well to eliminate some of the high-speed turns along this section of the route...something I suspect is in the plans.

At Linwood, but not Cleaver. #sad

[smh]

Good opportunity here as well to eliminate some of the high-speed turns along this section of the route...something I suspect is in the plans.

At Linwood, but not Cleaver. #sad

ugh, #sad indeed. Cleaver sux.

[Jblanco]

Am I the only person underwhelmed by the shelter structures for the streetcar stations? Not much better than a typical bus stop. Would like to see something that offers more shade, more enclosure from winter winds. People waiting on transit in KC always look so forlorn.

The transit shelter situation in this city SUCK. There are better transit shelter structures in some third-world countries.

Saturday at both City Market stops there were dozens of people standing in direct sunlight. No where to sit, no shade. This is embarrassing and what's worse is whoever is in charge of the shelters is clueless. 100%. The $$ for better design and larger shelters was there but in typical KC fashion the money was probably used for pet side projects so they redesigned smaller shelters.

[FangKC]

I wish the Feds and State would provide funding to transit organizations for the installation of more shelters and seating. The lack os seating at most stops is problematic especially when buses are running behind schedule because of driver shortages. Many seniors, and people with medical conditions that make standing for long periods painful, are affected by this.

I have noticed that bus stops at 12th and Grand and 11th and Grand both need more seating.

I also personally hate the shelters that face away from the street. You have to crane your neck constantly to the side to keep looking to see if the bus is coming.

I have also noticed that there have been benches removed at stops on Independence Avenue that weren't broken. I can't understand why KCATA would remove seating. It's like the transit administrators are deliberately trying to make people hate taking the bus even more.

I wish some group that represented seniors and the disabled would sue transit systems, the Feds, and State for not providing seating. What happened to ADA? It really pisses me off.

Perhaps the City and KCATA could initiate a program where businesses can donate benches to transit stops for tax benefits.

[beautyfromashes]

Saturday at both City Market stops there were dozens of people standing in direct sunlight. No where to sit, no shade. This is embarrassing and what's worse is whoever is in charge of the shelters is clueless. 100%. The $$ for better design and larger shelters was there but in typical KC fashion the money was probably used for pet side projects so they redesigned smaller shelters.

The solution shouldn't be bigger shelters, it should be quicker streetcars or more to cut down on time at the stop. If your typical stop is 5 minutes than that is the most you would be spending in the sun. In all likelihood, a streetcar would arrive sooner. But, if there are long delays in the system, the elements becomes an issue. Speed up the system.

[gfenn11]

I wish the Feds and State would provide funding to transit organizations for the installation of more shelters and seating. The lack os seating at most stops is problematic especially when buses are running behind schedule because of driver shortages. Many seniors, and people with medical conditions that make standing for long periods painful, are affected by this.

I have noticed that bus stops at 12th and Grand and 11th and Grand both need more seating.

I also personally hate the shelters that face away from the street. You have to crane your neck constantly to the side to keep looking to see if the bus is coming.

I have also noticed that there have been benches removed at stops on Independence Avenue that weren't broken. I can't understand why KCATA would remove seating. It's like the transit administrators are deliberately trying to make people hate taking the bus even more.

I wish some group that represented seniors and the disabled would sue transit systems, the Feds, and State for not providing seating. What happened to ADA? It really pisses me off.

Perhaps the City and KCATA could initiate a program where businesses can donate benches to transit stops for tax benefits.

They recently removed all seating at the 11th/Grand bus stops (probably the busiest platforms outside of the transit center). I noticed it a few weeks ago before the Draft.

So we're down to no seating at the majority of the bus stops, and no seating around city market (the benches were removed last year). People wonder why no one walks or hangs out downtown- you can't sit outside and enjoy it. It's wild that half of the MAX stops in the crossroads have no shelters or seating at all.

[langosta]

I wish the Feds and State would provide funding to transit organizations for the installation of more shelters and seating. The lack os seating at most stops is problematic especially when buses are running behind schedule because of driver shortages. Many seniors, and people with medical conditions that make standing for long periods painful, are affected by this.

I have noticed that bus stops at 12th and Grand and 11th and Grand both need more seating.

I also personally hate the shelters that face away from the street. You have to crane your neck constantly to the side to keep looking to see if the bus is coming.

I have also noticed that there have been benches removed at stops on Independence Avenue that weren't broken. I can't understand why KCATA would remove seating. It's like the transit administrators are deliberately trying to make people hate taking the bus even more.

I wish some group that represented seniors and the disabled would sue transit systems, the Feds, and State for not providing seating. What happened to ADA? It really pisses me off.

Perhaps the City and KCATA could initiate a program where businesses can donate benches to transit stops for tax benefits.

They recently removed all seating at the 11th/Grand bus stops (probably the busiest platforms outside of the transit center). I noticed it a few weeks ago before the Draft.

So we're down to no seating at the majority of the bus stops, and no seating around city market (the benches were removed last year). People wonder why no one walks or hangs out downtown- you can't sit outside and enjoy it. It's wild that half of the MAX stops in the crossroads have no shelters or seating at all.

The design theory as I understand is that service is frequent downtown and so you are not waiting long on average. Doesn’t work great when you just miss a bus or service gets cut.

[TheLastGentleman]

Feels like the bus system is at war with its own bus riders. Reason you see like 5 buses in a row and there are as many passengers between them

[FangKC]

The design theory as I understand is that service is frequent downtown and so you are not waiting long on average. Doesn’t work great when you just miss a bus or service gets cut.

Or if you are disabled or old, and can't tolerate standing for long periods waiting, or a worker who has been on their feet all day (cashiers, wait staff, custodial staff, nurses). The other problem with that calculation is some riders might be carrying bags of groceries; or have to take two or three buses and have wait time between each.

[FangKC]

Feels like the bus system is at war with its own bus riders. ...

It does appear that way at times.

[smh]

Am I the only person underwhelmed by the shelter structures for the streetcar stations? Not much better than a typical bus stop. Would like to see something that offers more shade, more enclosure from winter winds. People waiting on transit in KC always look so forlorn.

The transit shelter situation in this city SUCK. There are better transit shelter structures in some third-world countries.

Saturday at both City Market stops there were dozens of people standing in direct sunlight. No where to sit, no shade. This is embarrassing and what's worse is whoever is in charge of the shelters is clueless. 100%. The $$ for better design and larger shelters was there but in typical KC fashion the money was probably used for pet side projects so they redesigned smaller shelters.

My recollection is just the opposite. The initial streetcar project spent MORE money and time on designing shelters due to downtown business interests that insisted they be visually compelling. Now...how much of that consideration involved a need for shade is probably debatable.