Bannister Mall/Cerner

[GRID]

Wow. This sucks for KC bad. They seem to be all in on Austin and Nashville right now, so that's likely where many KC employees would go. KC and MO needs to lobby hard to keep them and if they did, it would be a nice change. They are culturally a lot different from Cerner and would probably want to be in the urban core somewhere.

[AlkaliAxel]

I have 2 takes on this

1. I’m kinda glad we don’t have to deal with their selfish asshole ownership anymore who was one of the biggest feeders of sprawl in this metro, and honestly at this point I’m willing to roll the dice and let another owner maybe change them up. Cerner never helped the urban core. They were the most suburbanized company we have. They *never* helped us. They only gauged.

Don’t forget- Cerner just put 75% of their employees on a permanent work remote basis, and laid off thousands. They didn’t even plant their companies OR their employees here anymore. They left their office building and want to sell them ALL. Fuck them…I really don’t care if selling out gets the management to leave.

To use a sports reference, it’s like Texas leaving the Big 12. Yes they have all the money, but having to live under their influence and their awful selfish decisions for a decade+ nobody really shed a tear when finally left for the SEC and actually things started looking more optimistic.

2. I don’t think it would make sense for them to relocate Cerner given all the new infrastructure they have here and given that every employee there is from KC area. They have a great pipeline from KU students too, and the area is very affordable If they want to go urban core, they have KC right there too (which would be great).

I heard the same things about Sprint two years ago and we ended up with one of the best worker campuses in the region (or more) out of it. But I’ve been on Rag long enough now to understand the freak outs. It. Will. Be. Fine. R-e-l-a-x.

[brewcrew1000]

I'm assuming Oracle has a healthcare division, maybe they move all the oracle healthcare people to KC and we benefit big time

[AlkaliAxel]

I'm assuming Oracle has a healthcare division, maybe they move all the oracle healthcare people to KC and we benefit big time

Exactly. Who knows. Doomers always doom. And again, it’s not like they were friend to our city or our goals.

The only one of these that was dagger was Waddell Reed because they were gonna spark downtown office spec for us. That one actually hurt our goals.

[earthling]

If it goes through the immediate loss is another KC F1000 company, which does suck. Oracle acquired Peoplesoft a while back. While based in Bay Area, there are hundreds if not thousands of jobs transitioning to Austin. I couldn't find how many employed in Austin but over 500 Peoplesoft development jobs currently open in Austin showed up in a quick search.

The good news is that it's an entirely new division with probably not much overlap, not like Sprint/Tmobile with almost entirely all overlap. But jobs could still move elsewhere over time. Or maybe they build up KC base. All kinds of impact from housing to airport demand impacted if Cerner slowly moves out so City needs to not only try to save Cerner jobs but should be pursuing other positions in other Oracle divisions that would be a good fit for KC.

[Cratedigger]

I'm assuming Oracle has a healthcare division, maybe they move all the oracle healthcare people to KC and we benefit big time

Oracle has been pushing Work From Anywhere hard. I wouldn't bet on this happening.

Tough losing so many major corporate headquarters. Sprint, DST, Cerner...Not saying KC won't be just fine long-term. Hopefully some of the people Cerner attracted start the next C2FO or Bardavon or RX Savings in KC.

[dukuboy1]

regardless how you may feel about Cerner the impacts will have a ripple effect for sure. I hope that they are positive as Cerner is the largest Private Employer and biggest company in the metro. I'm intrigued by what Oracle could bring to the table and the mindset, culture, and ideas they could bring to the area. I agree that this could have minimal impacts to employment figures and overall be a net positive for the region. Given the infrastructure in place and talent established it would be great for them make KC the healthcare sector HQ for operations. Plus with the huge data center planned and the investment by Google in a similar data center for their needs and others looking at the area as the perfect spot for future projects, there is a lot that could benefit a company like Oracle to establish a strong foothold. I hope that it works out this way

[CorneliusFB]

There is a 0% chance this is a net positive for KC. Cerner‘s story is just an accelerated version of Sprint’s two-decade long death spiral. Oracle may retain a presence in KC, but the region is definitely worse off if the sale is finalized.

[AlkaliAxel]

There is a 0% chance this is a net positive for KC. Cerner‘s story is just an accelerated version of Sprint’s two-decade long death spiral. Oracle may retain a presence in KC, but the region is definitely worse off if the sale is finalized.

You don't know that. Nobody does. With a company as selfish as Cerner, if Oracle even acts somewhat rationally it could be a net-benefit.

Cerner was already doomed to die because of an antiquated business they have of digitizing paper. They literally fed sprawl and were selling off everything. Now they have new life and a new mindset. That could very well be a good thing, maybe it won't. But what I do know is the way Cerner acted towards KC & civic pride was abysmal, and I'm open minded towards this and hopeful that it won't get any fucking worse.

Jesus, some of you people just give up like half the fans did when the Chiefs started 3-4 this year. Just chill out and let things play out. We've heard this apocalypse story too many times.

[AlkaliAxel]

KC needs to read the writing on the wall and start focusing on growing our own small businesses and startups here instead of worrying about giant dying dinosaurs like Cerner, Sprint, Railroads, etc....I mean come on, railroads? That's not our future.

Keep as many jobs and presence as you can from the Giant Dinosaurs, then move on and focus all our time on growing & retaining these small startups into big tech. That's where we'll find 5 Cerners- if we can keep them. That's the future play. Not to mention, these smaller companies that come up these days tend to care *alot* more about civic pride than the Cerners of the world. These small companies have all the jobs. Look at Creative Planning...that company grew from just ten years ago as a small office in Leawood into a behemoth that's still booming. *That* is the type of company we need to be focusing on- not dying companies.

Make this a friendly place for startups, grow our *existing* small businesses and tech that we have. Honestly I get more concerned about losing small businesses and tech that has potential to be a player in the 21st century than I'm worried about some motherf***ing railroad company. The city needs to be pouring more money into the incubators like LaunchKC. I read an article last year about a couple startups here that were blossoming and left for Dallas, and another one left for Tulsa. We didn't have the tools to keep them. That's more concerning than anything else. Those companies can be our next F500's. Have to retain them at all costs.

Zohr starup ditches KC for Dallas: https://www.startlandnews.com/2020/02/zohr-dallas-2/

Getting these small tech firms and startups to collaborate and locate in the Crossroads or downtown instead of having them incubate in Kansas is much more important long term than worrying about Cerner or Sprint. This is the real battle.

TLDR- stop clinging to the past companies and industry and focus on winning the future with real homegrown tech and startups, most of which have civic pride more than these dying behemoths

[Cratedigger]

Jesus, some of you people just give up like half the fans did when the Chiefs started 3-4 this year. Just chill out and let things play out. We've heard this apocalypse story too many times.

TLDR- stop clinging to the past companies and industry and focus on winning the future with real homegrown tech and startups, most of which have civic pride more than these dying behemoths

Agreed. Need to keep celebrating people like Darcy Howe of the KCRise Fund/Lesa Mitchell of Techstars/the Kauffman Foundation who promote KC Startups and bringing talent back to the area.

Also important to think about the people that were in KC to start their businesses because they worked for a big company like Sprint or Cerner. It's all a balance.

Maybe the money from all the big acquisitions goes back into new investment in the area. Who knows?

[CorneliusFB]

Fortune 500 companies drive a region’s economy (not small businesses). You look at the biggest differences between KC and our aspirational peer cities, and major non-governmental employers is alway toward the top of the list. Cerner was the unicorn home grown company (like Marion Labs and Sprint before it and Garmin is shaping up to be). You may decry their focus on the suburbs, but Cerner has done more good for this region (in terms of creating wealth and benevolent actions) than all but a few companies in the city’s history.

Focusing energy on growing the next wave of companies is great, but don’t for a minute kid yourself that losing the headquarters of a company with 13,000 employees is a good thing

[AlkaliAxel]

Fortune 500 companies drive a region’s economy (not small businesses). You look at the biggest differences between KC and our aspirational peer cities, and major non-governmental employers is alway toward the top of the list. Cerner was the unicorn home grown company (like Marion Labs and Sprint before it and Garmin is shaping up to be). You may decry their focus on the suburbs, but Cerner has done more good for this region (in terms of creating wealth and benevolent actions) than all but a few companies in the city’s history.

Focusing energy on growing the next wave of companies is great, but don’t for a minute kid yourself that losing the headquarters of a company with 13,000 employees is a good thing

In this instance, the ownership is irrelevant for Cerner.

Look, the job growth is this metro isn't coming from Cerner, the Railroad, or any other dying company. They're cutting jobs. We will grow the economy and population from job growth (duh) which is coming from small businesses and startups. Oracle will come in and stabilize it, we hope, and then that's it. If Oracle can't stop the dying of Cerner, then there's nothing the KC Cerner execs were gonna be able to do to stop the bleeding either. Ironically it's the best shot to keep/grow Cerner jobs here.

St. Louis is home to *8* Fortune 500 companies and has lost 100,000 residents since 1990. An awful economy.

Kansas City has 2 F500's and has gained 70,000 residents. The overall metro results are similar to this as well.

Having eight Fortune 500 companies hasn't helped STL grow at all *for fourty years*. The job growth we're gonna get in the future is collectively from all the small businesses and forward thinking companies in this region like Creative Planning. Instead of hinging onto old industry and complaining about dying companies like "muh Cerner! muh railroads!!" help the *next* Cerner amongst our crop before it moves to Dallas.

TLDR- whoever owns Cerner at this point is irrelevant. Job growth comes from small business, not dying companies

[missingkc]

AlkaliAxel. Do you read the business journal? If so, then you know that the purchase of promising, growing young KC companies by companies from elsewhere is nearly a weekly occurrence. Unfortunately, it seems that building and selling has become a prevalent cultural norm in KC. Sell it and say adios to headquarters and jobs. Maybe we get the bone of a “dual headquarters” for a bit but that never lasts and KC pretty much always loses. That dates back all the way to Michael Brown and Innovative Software in the 1980s. I don’t have much hope that small businesses will be KC’s savior unless there is a change of culture.

[AlkaliAxel]

AlkaliAxel. Do you read the business journal? If so, then you know that the purchase of promising, growing young KC companies by companies from elsewhere is nearly a weekly occurrence. Unfortunately, it seems that building and selling has become a prevalent cultural norm in KC. Sell it and say adios to headquarters and jobs. Maybe we get the bone of a “dual headquarters” for a bit but that never lasts and KC pretty much always loses. That dates back all the way to Michael Brown and Innovative Software in the 1980s. I don’t have much hope that small businesses will be KC’s savior unless there is a change of culture.

That's exactly the thing- I think there has been a change of culture. It's trending the right way towards a much realer startup culture. I think alot KC stereotypes from the 80's and 90's are still burned into many heads that aren't as prevalent anymore. There are many great young startups here that are super civic minded and have a ton of KC pride, just from following them in articles and social media. You'll also see a KCBJ article every week about Creative Planning acquiring some new out of town firm too. If we're losing a startup nowadays, they choose to leave because we don't have the tools here for them (which needs to be fixed) but not as much from being bought and forced out.

[Highlander]

Not a good thing for Kansas City regardless how of the deal is packaged. Acquisitions of KC companies by outsiders have never worked out well for Kansas City. At worse, KC loses a major employer, the jobs, the corporate presence - everything associated with Cerner. At best, KC probably loses some of the influence of having a major corporate HQ but keeps the management of a large division of Oracle and the operational center of its health care software company. I would suspect that since Oracle does not really have (as far as I can tell from their prospectus) any explicit health care software division, Cerner could stay in KC as a nearly completely unchanged division of Oracle. The only difference is that the shots ultimately would be called from outside the metro leaving KC to mercy of an outside master which can be bad news when there are market forces that push consolidation and/or shedding of assets.

The bigger concern is not moving jobs to Austin (as I understand it, Oracle brought their HQ but not many overall jobs to Austin) but rather to the massive operational center Oracle is planning in Nashville Tennessee to house 8500 people. That center could be altered or expanded to include Cerner and would benefit Oracle by consolidating many operations in a single location. The timing of the acquisition in that sense could be very bad for KC.

[AlkaliAxel]

Not a good thing for Kansas City regardless how of the deal is packaged. Acquisitions of KC companies by outsiders have never worked out well for Kansas City. At worse, KC loses a major employer, the jobs, the corporate presence - everything associated with Cerner. At best, KC probably loses some of the influence of having a major corporate HQ but keeps the management of a large division of Oracle and the operational center of its health care software company. I would suspect that since Oracle does not really have (as far as I can tell from their prospectus) any explicit health care software division, Cerner could stay in KC as a nearly completely unchanged division of Oracle. The only difference is that the shots ultimately would be called from outside the metro leaving KC to mercy of an outside master which can be bad news when there are market forces that push consolidation and/or shedding of assets.

The bigger concern is not moving jobs to Austin (as I understand it, Oracle brought their HQ but not many overall jobs to Austin) but rather to the massive operational center Oracle is planning in Nashville Tennessee to house 8500 people. That center could be altered or expanded to include Cerner and would benefit Oracle by consolidating many operations in a single location. The timing of the acquisition in that sense could be very bad for KC.

Yeah because the current Cerner execs are real civic heroes who want to do what’s best for KC. Gee, I hope the new outside ownership won’t screw us by doing layoffs, selling off the campuses, and sending everyone to WFH anywhere in country. Oh wait..

[ztonyg]

Not a good thing for Kansas City regardless how of the deal is packaged. Acquisitions of KC companies by outsiders have never worked out well for Kansas City. At worse, KC loses a major employer, the jobs, the corporate presence - everything associated with Cerner. At best, KC probably loses some of the influence of having a major corporate HQ but keeps the management of a large division of Oracle and the operational center of its health care software company. I would suspect that since Oracle does not really have (as far as I can tell from their prospectus) any explicit health care software division, Cerner could stay in KC as a nearly completely unchanged division of Oracle. The only difference is that the shots ultimately would be called from outside the metro leaving KC to mercy of an outside master which can be bad news when there are market forces that push consolidation and/or shedding of assets.

The bigger concern is not moving jobs to Austin (as I understand it, Oracle brought their HQ but not many overall jobs to Austin) but rather to the massive operational center Oracle is planning in Nashville Tennessee to house 8500 people. That center could be altered or expanded to include Cerner and would benefit Oracle by consolidating many operations in a single location. The timing of the acquisition in that sense could be very bad for KC.

Yeah because the current Cerner execs are real civic heroes who want to do what’s best for KC. Gee, I hope the new outside ownership won’t screw us by doing layoffs, selling off the campuses, and sending everyone to WFH anywhere in country. Oh wait..

That's why I have a glass half full look at this. Cerner in its current form probably wouldn't exist for much longer either way. This might actually save jobs. Overall it's not great but it also isn't horrible.

I live in Phoenix. We don't have many F500 companies based here (and the ones we do seem to contribute very small to the overall jobs picture and economy). I don't think F500 HQs mean as much as they used to be.

[GRID]

Another thing that might just might help KC's chances are the current incentives to build out the campus in SKC. It's a massive incentive package that few other cities would offer, especially fast growing cities like Austin and Nashville where Oracle is expanding.

The problem is the original plan for that campus is so bad that I'm not sure Oracle would be interested, but if they were and they have a vision, they could take what has already been started there and build it into something much better than what Cerner was going to do.

However, I honestly think this will not end well for KC. It won't only delete one of KC's biggest companies and recruiters of new residents to the area, but if they do leave, they will leave behind millions of sq ft of suburban office space that will need to be leased. That will really hurt Downtown just like the Sprint Campus has done.

[AlkaliAxel]

Cerner debated putting towers in downtown as high as 60 floors.

Why did this never happen?
https://twitter.com/dhenrich/status/147 ... 50050?s=21