Talk of anchoring Big 12 championships

[KCPowercat]

after what I saw from okc this weekend, there is zero doubt in my mind which is the perfect site.

hell spartan okc couldn't even sell out the men's tournament last year...

I'll give a full review later but as one who volunteers for these events in kc, okc needs to come north and pick up tips on how to host an event.

[Spartan65]

I'm hearing that we should polarize the Big XIII between Dallas and KC, because there is nothing in Oklahoma? There's just two problems with that..

One


Two


And the Ford Center/Cox Center setup is still superior to what any other city can do for two tournaments that go together. Having the two superblocks neighboring might have killed downtown, but it ended up being great for the Big XII. And while the women's championship only drew 4,300 last year, the first year in OKC it got 9,000 (although OU was in it). The numbers for the men's tourney in KC can only be sustained if KU wins the championship every single year, which is a situation that nobody outside Lawrence or KC want. Putting the tournament in the Kansas City metro virtually assures a home crowd for Kansas, while south teams have to drive 5-10 hours.

I think from a hospitality standpoint, OKC and KC are on pretty even footing. The two are relatively even for downtown hotels, and both could still use a lot of work on their downtowns. OKC has Bricktown near the Ford, KC has P&L near the Sprint. The reality though is that KC is too far north for south teams, and it's not as if the Sprint is the "JerryWorld" of basketball arenas. And the Ford is being upgraded right now.

[KCPowercat]

I went into this weekend with an open mind....there is no way it's even a question now...of course I am biased but the arenas being next to each other could be the most overblown positive I have ever heard....and a nice 4 block walk to the closest anything (restaurant, bar, etc)

[shaffe]

I went into this weekend with an open mind....there is no way it's even a question now...of course I am biased but the arenas being next to each other could be the most overblown positive I have ever heard....and a nice 4 block walk to the closest anything (restaurant, bar, etc)

And it's not like the walk from 13th and Grand to 12th and Wyandotte (5 whole blocks!) is really insurmountable.

And Spartan, a tournament in KC absolutely does not need ku to win it every year to be successful.  To think otherwise is flat wrong.

[Highlander]

I'm hearing that we should polarize the Big XIII between Dallas and KC, because there is nothing in Oklahoma? There's just two problems with that..

One


Two


And the Ford Center/Cox Center setup is still superior to what any other city can do for two tournaments that go together. Having the two superblocks neighboring might have killed downtown, but it ended up being great for the Big XII. And while the women's championship only drew 4,300 last year, the first year in OKC it got 9,000 (although OU was in it). The numbers for the men's tourney in KC can only be sustained if KU wins the championship every single year, which is a situation that nobody outside Lawrence or KC want. Putting the tournament in the Kansas City metro virtually assures a home crowd for Kansas, while south teams have to drive 5-10 hours.

I think from a hospitality standpoint, OKC and KC are on pretty even footing. The two are relatively even for downtown hotels, and both could still use a lot of work on their downtowns. OKC has Bricktown near the Ford, KC has P&L near the Sprint. The reality though is that KC is too far north for south teams, and it's not as if the Sprint is the "JerryWorld" of basketball arenas. And the Ford is being upgraded right now.

OU being in the final it is why it drew 9000.  That's the key factor for women...proximity and how the men's team does.  The Ford Center Cox Center setup is absolutely not superior to KC's setup.  You have Municpal auditorium and the Sprint center on opposite sides of the Power and Light District.  Municipal Auditorium is a great venue for b-ball.  The south being at a disadvantage is an issue but it is also an issue in OKC as OSU and OU will obviously have the home crowd advantage over any northern team and all the Texas teams.  The only argument there is that it's a shorter drive.  But if you are flying which is probably what most Texans do outside of the Dallas area, KC is just as convenient (I live in Houston and I know I'd never make that drive to either city for a b-ball game, it's a pain in the ass).

[beautyfromashes]

You got your NBA team.  Now you want our Big 12 tourney?  Greed.

[Highlander]

I'm hearing that we should polarize the Big XIII between Dallas and KC, because there is nothing in Oklahoma? There's just two problems with that..

It will all be for naught if this pundit turns out being right...

http://www.rivalryesq.com/2010/2/16/131 ... conference

For the record, I'd rather see an OKC - KC split on the tournament than see the death of the conference.  The latter screws up rivalries and does KC no good at all. 

[KCPowercat]

interesting article in the okc newspaper talking about increased discussion of seperaring men's and women's tournaments in both date and city.  This would increase the exposure of the women's tournament many think and put it in smaller metros where it would gain more interest and exposure.

I think this is a great idea.  The women's tournament is obviously dwarfed here and honestly I wouldn't mind seeing it go as almost every women's bball fan I've experienced is an old grumpy couple.

...and an additional lol at the article..any chance they get they try to pimp the fact that their arenas are across the street and somehow have settled that sprint is 6 blocks away from municipla...i guess the truth of 4 blocks doesn't sound far enough away....

http://www.newsok.com/article/3463070

[KCMax]

interesting article in the okc newspaper talking about increased discussion of seperaring men's and women's tournaments in both date and city.  This would increase the exposure of the women's tournament many think and put it in smaller metros where it would gain more interest and exposure.

I think this is a great idea.  The women's tournament is obviously dwarfed here and honestly I wouldn't mind seeing it go as almost every women's bball fan I've experienced is an old grumpy couple.

...and an additional lol at the article..any chance they get they try to pimp the fact that their arenas are across the street and somehow have settled that sprint is 6 blocks away from municipla...i guess the truth of 4 blocks doesn't sound far enough away....

http://www.newsok.com/article/3463070

My only concern is that having two arenas close to each other was a huge advantage for KC in landing the two tournaments. If they separate, that advantage is mitigated.

[kcjak]

You got your NBA team.  Now you want our Big 12 tourney?  Greed.

Maybe we need to go after OKC's softball world series 

[LenexatoKCMO]

interesting article in the okc newspaper talking about increased discussion of seperaring men's and women's tournaments in both date and city.  This would increase the exposure of the women's tournament many think and put it in smaller metros where it would gain more interest and exposure.

I think this is a great idea.  The women's tournament is obviously dwarfed here and honestly I wouldn't mind seeing it go as almost every women's bball fan I've experienced is an old grumpy couple.

...and an additional lol at the article..any chance they get they try to pimp the fact that their arenas are across the street and somehow have settled that sprint is 6 blocks away from municipla...i guess the truth of 4 blocks doesn't sound far enough away....

http://www.newsok.com/article/3463070

It seems like there are several schools who send a lot of those "grumpy old couple" fans who wind up going to both the mens and womens games for their school.  If you split them up, wouldn't you risk attendance at both events by forcing those fans to choose?

[MidtownCat]

I've gone to the Big XII Tournament the last two years (07',09') it was held in OKC as well as the OKC NCAA regional this past Spring.  

In the three visits out of the last five years and the last two tournaments in KC, I've experienced enough to draw an objective conclusion and I can tell you without a shred of doubt, there is no comparison between Kansas City and Oklahoma City as host sites for these major college basketball events.  None whatsoever and there isn't bias in that statement.

There is simply no comparison in the entertainment/accommodation package we offer with Sprint Center/Power & Light, combined with Crown Center, Westport and the Plaza compared to the Ford Center/Bricktown.

This isn't intended as a slight, but Oklahoma City is essentially Wichita on steroids.  That’s the only way I can describe it.  Their downtown has a LONG way to go even with some of the revitalization efforts with the arena and minor league ballpark.  Bricktown is fine - there are a few decent bars and restaurants.  The little river walk they've created is ok (when the weather is decent).  The biggest obstacle, however, is that it simply is not a college basketball town and try as they might, this cannot be overcompensated.  The pageantry and excitement simply is not part of the culture for this event.  There isn't the same level of public interest and outside of groupings of fans, there is very little activity and energy around the arena pre and post-event, not to mention the actual attendance at the games themselves.  It's just a completely different atmosphere.

Unfortunately for KC, with Mizzou most likely jumping ship and a bigger shift of power to the South in this league on the horizon, there basically is no chance of the Big XII tournament now being anchored here and we'll likely be sharing the tourney with OKC and Dallas for the forseeable future.  Reality is though, there is not even a comparison between the other host sites this league has to offer.  None even come close.

[NDTeve]

think of the crowds this year in the PanL and on the streets with the worst imaginable weather...It was a zoo at 40 degrees and rainy...Don't think OKC could match that..

[KCPowercat]

lenexa...the article states only an estimated 1000 crossover fans.

max...true but I think even w/o that 2 arena factor kc still does the best job hosting overall.

[KCPowercat]

nd..you are right.  Okc had the same weather last year and the place was barren and ticket sales were dallas-bad.

[LenexatoKCMO]

lenexa...the article states only an estimated 1000 crossover fans.

1000 fans isn't a big deal for the men - especially not in KC where the arena is going to fill with fans no matter what.  But +/- 1000 heads is kind of a big deal for the womens games, and maybe even for the mens games in cities with lesser support. 

[KCPowercat]

that's why it is proposed as two different weekends....i guess the acc does it that way.

I guess it would probably have to be as many big 12 officials do the same job for mens and womens.

[kcmetro]

It seems like there are several schools who send a lot of those "grumpy old couple" fans who wind up going to both the mens and womens games for their school.  If you split them up, wouldn't you risk attendance at both events by forcing those fans to choose?

I would be grumpy too if I had to sit through a women's basketball game.

[LenexatoKCMO]

that's why it is proposed as two different weekends....i guess the acc does it that way.

I guess it would probably have to be as many big 12 officials do the same job for mens and womens.

How many of those fans don't make the trip for one or both if they are on seperate weekends?  If a grumpy old couple travels from college station to KC to watch the men's tournament one weekend, are they going to hop right back in the car and head out for the women's three or four days later? 

It doesn't really matter to me much personally as I will probably never go to the women's games anyway, but I have to think that seperate weekends and/or locations will definitely hurt attendance for the women's games.  The current set up seems to work well for the fans that like both. 

[KCPowercat]

yeah I would think so too but this is coming from the women's side...they want their own weekend and city...at least some of them do.

my guess is that grumpy old couple would ust hit the women's tourney...which would be just fine by me.