KCRag Forum

KCPowercat wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 9:41 am Even a bad team brings in an event 81 nights a year and the atmosphere would likely draw more fans than having to shlug out to Kauffman

Ticket prices will likely be much higher in a new stadium. They always are. I'm not going to say Royals fans should be compared to Miami fans, but look at what a bad team in a new stadium did there. That place opened in 2012 and they've averaged 10K a game the past two years. There are no guarantees that people will be more willing to schlep downtown (and pay more) vs "shlugging" out to the K (you should really lay off the Yiddish if you don't have that club in your bag).

WSPanic wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 9:49 am Ticket prices will likely be much higher in a new stadium. They always are.

Maybe, but I won’t have to pay $18 to park.

You won't have to, but if my experience trying to get out of a Cards game on a MetroLink train is any indication, you will likely want to. That was a huge mess.

Of course, people actually go to Cards games because they are vastly more consistently good than the Royals have been since the 1980s.

The parking would be a definite advantage for a lot of us, but I don't think that's representative of the overall fanbase. It was only $15, btw.

mean wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 10:23 am You won't have to, but if my experience trying to get out of a Cards game on a MetroLink train is any indication, you will likely want to. That was a huge mess.

I've been in downtown StL and Minneapolis right before a game. Both systems were packed in the direction of the game.

That's a good thing, the mess would be on the streets without the train and everyone would be in it.

If you think the primary point of public transit is to reduce automobile traffic so that the people in cars are less inconvenienced, you might be part of the problem.

I assume a new DT stadium would have bike park. No public transit or car required.

WSPanic wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 9:49 am

KCPowercat wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 9:41 am Even a bad team brings in an event 81 nights a year and the atmosphere would likely draw more fans than having to shlug out to Kauffman

Ticket prices will likely be much higher in a new stadium. They always are. I'm not going to say Royals fans should be compared to Miami fans, but look at what a bad team in a new stadium did there. That place opened in 2012 and they've averaged 10K a game the past two years. There are no guarantees that people will be more willing to schlep downtown (and pay more) vs "shlugging" out to the K (you should really lay off the Yiddish if you don't have that club in your bag).

Yeah Miami isn't a good comparison for many reasons. The new Miami stadium location is not in any way a nice walkable environment from downtown. I took the bus there from downtown and woof.

I prefer the trip out to Kauffman to be considered shlugging

I agree ticket prices will go up with a new stadium. My tickets keep going up at Kauffman the way it is so not sure that's a big negative towards a new stadium.

All I care about is downtown if I'm paying for their stadium. Can they develop a stadium that contributes to the neighborhood without requiring surface parking?

If no, then stop banking land. If yes, present a plan.

"If you have no plan, don't bank the land!" -- Johnnie Cochran

KCPowercat wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 1:10 pm I prefer the trip out to Kauffman to be considered shlugging

FWIW, to me, it sounds like you're just trying to make up Yiddish words. Which is kind of insulting/demeaning for people who have that language as a part of their family's recent history.

I have been staring at google maps on this too much... LOL.... the problem I see with East Loop for a project this large is that it is not just the stadium... you will also want space around the stadium for entertainment... bars, food, etc. and east loop has lots of parking lots that could be used for the stadium but then the area is blocked from the rest of DT by the gov bldg comlplex. Not ideal in my opinion.

North Loop I think has too much potential for residential as River Market fills up.

That leaves looking south / or southeast of the loop:

1) East Crossroads (Cherry, Truman, US-71 and 18th) -

Advantages: Relative low density currently; connects CR to 18th/V; option for future east/west streetcar line; plenty of infill area for close amenities; highway access.

Disads: Ideal stadium orientation would not show of DT skyline (might have to use less ideal); US 71 side would be hard barrier to development.

2) Crossroads to Jazz (US-71, Truman, 18th and Paseo)

Advantages: much the same as above but a little closer to 18/V and further from CR. Would make Paseo more relevant; close to DT Baseball Academy

Disads: Mostly same as above, Would have to relocate bus depot and tech college/ school

3) Westside (Cesar Chavez, Madison, 20th, and I-35)

Advantages: Perfect Stadium Orientation. Coutours of elevation are potentially well suited; Makes SW Blvd more connected / better development. Highway access. Potential mass transit bi-state along SW Blvd

Disads: would displace homes / neighborhood... doesnt help eastside.. farther from streetcar

4) Crossroads West (19th, Broadway, 17th, Wyandotte)

Advantages: Ideal location for infill / best for current hotels / bars / food; close to streetcar; would have continuity with other large features like convention center, performing arts center; would activate this section of Broadway

Disads: potentially tight fit; would displace some crossroads blds (maybe some historic), off highway (may not matter)


Thoughts?

435 and 87th Street?

Sold!

mgsports wrote: ↑Wed Oct 30, 2019 11:34 am 435 and 87th Street?

Ah yes, why didn’t we consider that before /s

rokhok wrote: ↑Wed Oct 30, 2019 11:31 am I have been staring at google maps on this too much... LOL.... the problem I see with East Loop for a project this large is that it is not just the stadium... you will also want space around the stadium for entertainment... bars, food, etc. and east loop has lots of parking lots that could be used for the stadium but then the area is blocked from the rest of DT by the gov bldg comlplex. Not ideal in my opinion.

There's no way we can build enough entertainment next to the stadium to support even 10% of capacity

Let's not care if there's bars around the site or not and instead support all of downtown by scattering thousands of customers among dozens of blocks of businesses.

Unless there's parking for 10,000 cars right next to it most people will need to leave the immediate area by foot, bus and train which makes it easy for them to go elsewhere.

Also, the east loop parking lots would only hold a couple thousand people.

That leaves looking south / or southeast of the loop:

1) East Crossroads (Cherry, Truman, US-71 and 18th) -

Advantages: Relative low density currently; connects CR to 18th/V; option for future east/west streetcar line; plenty of infill area for close amenities; highway access.

Disads: Ideal stadium orientation would not show of DT skyline (might have to use less ideal); US 71 side would be hard barrier to development.

What's with all the destruction? You don't like how many bars we can place on empty land so let's tear down dozens of buildings instead

2) Crossroads to Jazz (US-71, Truman, 18th and Paseo)

Advantages: much the same as above but a little closer to 18/V and further from CR. Would make Paseo more relevant; close to DT Baseball Academy

Disads: Mostly same as above, Would have to relocate bus depot and tech college/ school

It's funny you would pick this site when the other side of 18th would be much easier to kick people out of.

3) Westside (Cesar Chavez, Madison, 20th, and I-35)

Advantages: Perfect Stadium Orientation. Coutours of elevation are potentially well suited; Makes SW Blvd more connected / better development. Highway access. Potential mass transit bi-state along SW Blvd

Disads: would displace homes / neighborhood... doesnt help eastside.. farther from streetcar

Hiway access? You're crazy, this neighborhood is really hard to get to from I-35. That's not bad from a neighborhood point of view but you're talking about a site which would create traffic like nothing else when we're talking about 10,000+ cars all at once.

4) Crossroads West (19th, Broadway, 17th, Wyandotte)

Advantages: Ideal location for infill / best for current hotels / bars / food; close to streetcar; would have continuity with other large features like convention center, performing arts center; would activate this section of Broadway

Disads: potentially tight fit; would displace some crossroads blds (maybe some historic), off highway (may not matter)

Yeah, this won't happen. It would block the Kauffman Center view of Union Station.

Because at moment land is empty but will be developed soon. Lee's Summit? southern Johnson County?

flyingmember is trigggerrrred. lol

StL_Dan wrote: ↑Wed Oct 30, 2019 1:48 pm flyingmember is trigggerrrred. lol