UMKC projects

[AlkaliAxel]

I was walking by the intersection here at 51st & Brookside- which where the end of the streetcar will be. I was thinking that it would look really good if they built large several story apartments on top of the stores on the NE corner of 51st & Brookside (Kin Lin, Pride Cleaners, etc.) which is across the street from the Whole Foods project. That way you'd have the Whole Foods project on the left, and another project on the right side, creating a large dense small corridor leading up to either the streetcar stop or the school. They should zone for this in their plan.

They really should be heavily investing in this NE corner spot anyway because it's on the streetcar line and tons of students will be passing through daily.

[FangKC]

I wouldn't be surprised if that happens.

[AlkaliAxel]

I wouldn't be surprised if that happens.

Why wouldn’t any renderings or plans have come out by now if we’re already in 2022?

[CorneliusFB]

UMKC still doesn’t own the entire corner. The old gas station is still privately owned. I also think the lawsuit/uncertainty over the dorms to the North caused some delays in their plans.

[AlkaliAxel]

UMKC still doesn’t own the entire corner. The old gas station is still privately owned. I also think the lawsuit/uncertainty over the dorms to the North caused some delays in their plans.

Right. This would be a private project. I don’t understand why we haven’t seen or heard of any plans on this corner for development. It’s prime location, should be an easy 5 story apartment atleast or just tear down the stores and rebuild with ground floor retail.

I really do think it would make a great corridor, right they juxtapositioned between the streetcar stop and university

[chaglang]

To do something the size of Whole Foods, UMKC has to lead the development or replat and sell. In their 2021 masterplan they only show student housing to replace what was demolished. Nothing new on 51st. So it may not even be on their radar.

[normalthings]

Whats going on with the conservatory site?

[DaveKCMO]

Whats going on with the conservatory site?

Haven't heard a peep since they announced it would be built on the Volker campus.

[CorneliusFB]

UMKC still doesn’t own the entire corner. The old gas station is still privately owned. I also think the lawsuit/uncertainty over the dorms to the North caused some delays in their plans.

Right. This would be a private project. I don’t understand why we haven’t seen or heard of any plans on this corner for development. It’s prime location, should be an easy 5 story apartment atleast or just tear down the stores and rebuild with ground floor retail.

I really do think it would make a great corridor, right they juxtapositioned between the streetcar stop and university

You understand development is not that easy right? The owner of the corner parcel probably has positive cash flow from the building lease (or operations if it’s an owner operator) and a very low basis in the property. They probably don’t want to sell because of the capital gains hit and their cash flow is meeting their current needs. Meanwhile, the UMKC board of trustees doesn’t want to overpay for the parcel because they aren’t ready for a larger development there, and they don’t want to sell their parcel to a developer because they don’t want to lose long term control of their portion of the site.

Just because a project looks great in the macro or theoretical sense, the unique property owner’s unique situation is ultimately what drives the ability to develop a property or not. That’s why development is really freaking slow. It’s not uncommon for property assemblages to take decades.

[normalthings]

UMKC still doesn’t own the entire corner. The old gas station is still privately owned. I also think the lawsuit/uncertainty over the dorms to the North caused some delays in their plans.

Right. This would be a private project. I don’t understand why we haven’t seen or heard of any plans on this corner for development. It’s prime location, should be an easy 5 story apartment atleast or just tear down the stores and rebuild with ground floor retail.

I really do think it would make a great corridor, right they juxtapositioned between the streetcar stop and university

You understand development is not that easy right? The owner of the corner parcel probably has positive cash flow from the building lease (or operations if it’s an owner operator) and a very low basis in the property. They probably don’t want to sell because of the capital gains hit and their cash flow is meeting their current needs. Meanwhile, the UMKC board of trustees doesn’t want to overpay for the parcel because they aren’t ready for a larger development there, and they don’t want to sell their parcel to a developer because they don’t want to lose long term control of their portion of the site.

Just because a project looks great in the macro or theoretical sense, the unique property owner’s unique situation is ultimately what drives the ability to develop a property or not. That’s why development is really freaking slow. It’s not uncommon for property assemblages to take decades.

UMKC has plenty of other existing sites that they can develop today

[AlkaliAxel]

You understand development is not that easy right? The owner of the corner parcel probably has positive cash flow from the building lease (or operations if it’s an owner operator) and a very low basis in the property. They probably don’t want to sell because of the capital gains hit and their cash flow is meeting their current needs. Meanwhile, the UMKC board of trustees doesn’t want to overpay for the parcel because they aren’t ready for a larger development there, and they don’t want to sell their parcel to a developer because they don’t want to lose long term control of their portion of the site.

Just because a project looks great in the macro or theoretical sense, the unique property owner’s unique situation is ultimately what drives the ability to develop a property or not. That’s why development is really freaking slow. It’s not uncommon for property assemblages to take decades.

You understand it was just an idea on a forum, right?

[chaglang]

You said didn't understand why development wasn't being proposed there. He gave you some possible reasons, as have others. No call for incivility.

[Critical_Mass]

I was walking by the intersection here at 51st & Brookside- which where the end of the streetcar will be. I was thinking that it would look really good if they built large several story apartments on top of the stores on the NE corner of 51st & Brookside (Kin Lin, Pride Cleaners, etc.) which is across the street from the Whole Foods project. That way you'd have the Whole Foods project on the left, and another project on the right side, creating a large dense small corridor leading up to either the streetcar stop or the school. They should zone for this in their plan.

They really should be heavily investing in this NE corner spot anyway because it's on the streetcar line and tons of students will be passing through daily.

On the previous page of this thread was a June post by FangKC describing UMKC's plans for this spot, which included housing for 500 students + retail space. Link to Kevin Collison's CitySceneKC reporting of it at the time: https://cityscenekc.com/umkc-proposing- ... HDYYMKWUH0

[AlkaliAxel]

You said didn't understand why development wasn't being proposed there. He gave you some possible reasons, as have others. No call for incivility.

I’m just using the exact same words from his first sentence too. Nothing wrong with that.

[AlkaliAxel]

I was walking by the intersection here at 51st & Brookside- which where the end of the streetcar will be. I was thinking that it would look really good if they built large several story apartments on top of the stores on the NE corner of 51st & Brookside (Kin Lin, Pride Cleaners, etc.) which is across the street from the Whole Foods project. That way you'd have the Whole Foods project on the left, and another project on the right side, creating a large dense small corridor leading up to either the streetcar stop or the school. They should zone for this in their plan.

They really should be heavily investing in this NE corner spot anyway because it's on the streetcar line and tons of students will be passing through daily.

On the previous page of this thread was a June post by FangKC describing UMKC's plans for this spot, which included housing for 500 students + retail space. Link to Kevin Collison's CitySceneKC reporting of it at the time: https://cityscenekc.com/umkc-proposing- ... HDYYMKWUH0

Does UMKC own those stores and are just renting them? If not, then I’d assume a private firm develops this and not UMKC.

[beautyfromashes]

UMKC owns everything north of Whole Foods. Old buildings (less than 10 years old) were torn down due to terrible water leaks after university sued contractor. In plans to rebuild for third buildings on those sites in a decade. Nothing announced.

[AlkaliAxel]

UMKC owns everything north of Whole Foods. Old buildings (less than 10 years old) were torn down due to terrible water leaks after university sued contractor. In plans to rebuild for third buildings on those sites in a decade. Nothing announced.

Yes. I hope they can get something off the ground before the 2025 opening.

[FangKC]

It's probably not high on their priority list. They have to get that residential housing rebuilt where they demolished the faulty apartments to the north. They also have their plans to build the new conservatory and dance buildings.

[AlkaliAxel]

It's probably not high on their priority list. They have to get that residential housing rebuilt where they demolished the faulty apartments to the north. They also have their plans to build the new conservatory and dance buildings.

I'm curious to see what their plans are for the streetcar stop, because part of their idea for rebuilding was integrate it with the station.

[chaglang]

It looks like UMKC does not own the Pizza 51 building.

Their 2021 Masterplan would be worth checking out if you are curious about their plans for that area: https://www.umkc.edu/chancellor/initiat ... -plan.html

To Fang's point, and as I mentioned previously, there isn't much to indicate that they intend to do anything there beyond rebuild the housing that was torn down. FWIW, the pandemic has caused a lot of universities to move slowly on new residence halls. There is some uncertainty that old enrollment projection formulas are still valid. So even a replacement of the buildings that were torn down may be delayed. To think of it another way, three years from RFP to opening is a reasonable timeline for a dorm project. That already puts a new building opening into 2025.