Status and future of the River Market area??

[im2kull]

I thought of this too, but on the field is probably the place most guaranteed to have the least amount of people.

Terrorism isn't about killing people. It's about making a statement and filling people's irrational brains with terror and fear.

I agree. I'd say the fear of someone blowing up a bomb in a baseball field in Kansas City is pretty irrational. I guess being able to drive a big delivery truck into a garage under a DT stadium during the World Series is technically possible but highly, highly improbable.

That wouldn't even be technically possible. Have you not seen the ceiling clearance heights on modern garages? Good luck getting any kind of big delivery truck inside.

[KCPowercat]

That wouldn't be done today.

[beautyfromashes]

That wouldn't even be technically possible. Have you not seen the ceiling clearance heights on modern garages? Good luck getting any kind of big delivery truck inside.

Right. So what would be the realistic fear with burying the parking garage under a stadium field area? It would be cheaper and easier than putting it under any building. We've done it under P&L. Seems a decent way to hide garage parking in a very efficient manner.

[normalthings]

That wouldn't even be technically possible. Have you not seen the ceiling clearance heights on modern garages? Good luck getting any kind of big delivery truck inside.

Right. So what would be the realistic fear with burying the parking garage under a stadium field area? It would be cheaper and easier than putting it under any building. We've done it under P&L. Seems a decent way to hide garage parking in a very efficient manner.

Stadiums are often already below ground level. It probably not cheaper or easier to dig even further

[im2kull]

That wouldn't be done today.

What wouldn't be done today?

[im2kull]

That wouldn't even be technically possible. Have you not seen the ceiling clearance heights on modern garages? Good luck getting any kind of big delivery truck inside.

Right. So what would be the realistic fear with burying the parking garage under a stadium field area? It would be cheaper and easier than putting it under any building. We've done it under P&L. Seems a decent way to hide garage parking in a very efficient manner.

Stadiums are often already below ground level. It probably not cheaper or easier to dig even further

This. It comes down to cost. Nothing else. Excavation is the most expensive part of any major project. The garage under P&L was extremely expensive and was only placed there because the taxpayers were footing the bill. Every other garage in the area is above ground.. for a reason.

[beautyfromashes]

Stadiums are often already below ground level. It probably not cheaper or easier to dig even further

I do know the K has the stadium lower than the actual field. With such a massive area under the field, you wouldn't even need it to be very deep (like P&L) to provide a significant amount of parking. I'd sure prefer this over taking a whole city block, or two, just for the same amount of spaces.

[TheLastGentleman]

That wouldn't be done today.

The convention center? The ballroom opened in like 2007 right? It spans the freeway. What has changed since then that would keep them from doing that?

[Chris Stritzel]

That wouldn't be done today.

What wouldn't be done today?

More so than just the outrageous cost, I’d say safety/security plays a role. Having a stadium where 30,000+ can get together would be a target for less than desirable people who are crazy enough to be on a mission of terror.

[beautyfromashes]

That wouldn't be done today.

What wouldn't be done today?

More so than just the outrageous cost, I’d say safety/security plays a role. Having a stadium where 30,000+ can get together would be a target for less than desirable people who are crazy enough to be on a mission of terror.

What outrageous cost? You dig the field, bury prebuilt garage forms and cover it up. Seems it'd be cheaper than building under a building for sure and likely cheaper than building up on an empty lot.

Not sure how having parking under the field portion would make a terror attack more likely or deadly than just being on the street when a game lets out or in a garage directly across from the field as is likely what there will be.

Anyway, I'll let it go.

[Anthony_Hugo98]

Our convention center lies over a busy freeway. If terrorism in kansas city was a big concern, I don’t think that would’ve been done

Not saying it’s a fear or genuine concern I have, just stating the powers in charge would very much take safety factors like that into consideration.

[normalthings]

What wouldn't be done today?

More so than just the outrageous cost, I’d say safety/security plays a role. Having a stadium where 30,000+ can get together would be a target for less than desirable people who are crazy enough to be on a mission of terror.

What outrageous cost? You dig the field, bury prebuilt garage forms and cover it up. Seems it'd be cheaper than building under a building for sure and likely cheaper than building up on an empty lot.

Not sure how having parking under the field portion would make a terror attack more likely or deadly than just being on the street when a game lets out or in a garage directly across from the field as is likely what there will be.

Anyway, I'll let it go.

Its really not that much usable parking space. Digging deeper gets more expensive the deeper you go, and you are already 50+ feet deep before the garage.

How are cars going to get in/out of the garage? They would need a tunnel to an entry on another block.


Its a pretty interesting idea. The high costs of digging just make it unrealistic

[im2kull]

What wouldn't be done today?

More so than just the outrageous cost, I’d say safety/security plays a role. Having a stadium where 30,000+ can get together would be a target for less than desirable people who are crazy enough to be on a mission of terror.

What outrageous cost? You dig the field, bury prebuilt garage forms and cover it up. Seems it'd be cheaper than building under a building for sure and likely cheaper than building up on an empty lot.

Not sure how having parking under the field portion would make a terror attack more likely or deadly than just being on the street when a game lets out or in a garage directly across from the field as is likely what there will be.

Anyway, I'll let it go.

Don't let it go. I actually agree. I think it's a great idea. Everyone who thinks terrorism or security would be some kind of roadblock is obviously forgetting the fact that we're about to build a massive city park full of people and structures on top of an existing freeway..

[KCPowercat]

That wouldn't be done today.

The convention center? The ballroom opened in like 2007 right? It spans the freeway. What has changed since then that would keep them from doing that?

Fair point.

[gfenn11]

That’s why I want the Royals to build some big parking garages. Make it better to develop those surface lots instead.

How come stadiums are never built with parking directly under the field?

Cincinnati's stadium has a parking garage/loading dock built under the western side of the structure.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0960863 ... 384!8i8192

[Eon Blue]

What outrageous cost? You dig the field, bury prebuilt garage forms and cover it up. Seems it'd be cheaper than building under a building for sure and likely cheaper than building up on an empty lot.

Not sure how having parking under the field portion would make a terror attack more likely or deadly than just being on the street when a game lets out or in a garage directly across from the field as is likely what there will be.

Anyway, I'll let it go.

Speaking purely from the engineering perspective:
- On an urban site like this you have to haul away most of the material you excavate, which adds cost.
- You've got a decent chance of hitting rock at some point, which drives the cost way up.
- As you excavate, you need to shore up the adjacent streets/buildings until your permanent structure is in place, which is expensive. It's more expensive the deeper you go. Then once your permanent structure is in place, the walls have to hold up those same adjacent features for the lifetime of the structure.
- Then, once you get to the bottom you have to worry about drainage - either from rain getting into your hole (which can be controlled to some extent), or from groundwater seepage. Either one will require some sort of pumping system, which also adds cost. (What about tying into a deep sewer for gravity drainage? All of the same costs that I noted already.)
- Then to boot, your garage has to hold up not just itself but also the structure above it. Even a field with dirt and grass and a drainage system is going to be fairly heavy.
- Probably some other factors I didn't think of the top of my head just now.

So, it's not impossible...it's just money.

[Critical_Mass]

I had no idea the parking lot next to the former 'Hammer Bros' building was so complex! Lol

[beautyfromashes]

So, it's not impossible...it's just money.

How would this be different than the P&L block? It seems it would get easier the bigger the excavation size because the force would be spread. A wider hole is always more stable then a deep narrow one, right?

[KCPowercat]

Enzo posted on instagram hanging of art and signage. Has to be close.

[KCMHGuy]

According to Enzo's IG from 11/22, they'll be opening up in a "couple more weeks or so."