Proposition: A downtown Macy's department store

[advocrat]

If Macy's were to consider locating a store downtown, where could it be located?

Is there any existing building that could be developed into a department store?

Are there any news or rumors about a department store downtown? (MKB said that another downtown department store was one of her Mayoral dreams).

Advocrat

[KCMax]

I'd rather get a Gimbel's.

Do people go to department stores anymore? I'd rather see a Target to be honest.

[lock+load]

I'd rather get a Gimbel's.

Do people go to department stores anymore? I'd rather see a Target to be honest.

Someone does, there seem to be a lot of them around.  But, no one is going to come downtown to shop at Macy's.  It would have to be something exclusive to the area.

[LenexatoKCMO]

Someone does, there seem to be a lot of them around.  But, no one is going to come downtown to shop at Macy's.  It would have to be something exclusive to the area.

Actually that market segment has taken a huge hit the last decade+.  Younger people all like to shop at the smaller branded chains like the Gap and Aeropostale, J Crew, etc.  The demographic that still shops at department stores is getting older and deader every year.  People who used to shop at the more "affordable" department stores like Pennys, Sears, Montgomery Wards, have mostly converted to Target and Wal Mart so that market is dwindling fast too.  This is a big part of why traditional indoor malls are having a hard time - it is getting harder and harder to find strong, viable tennants to fill the anchor department store locations.  What is a mall like Oak Park, with 5 large anchor spaces, going to do when there are only three or four national chains left in the market?

Downtown would be better off with a half dozen or so gaps, old navys, etc. than it would be with some doomed dinosaur taking up a block.  How is a Macy's going to survive DT when all of the nursing homes housing its customer base are so far away?

[beautyfromashes]

I'd personally like to see a Zara...

www.zara.com

[advocrat]

I use Macy's as an example, but what I'm really asking is where would your put a downtown department store, or, where could one be located?

Macy's, Dillards, Target, Gimbles, JC Penney, doesn't make a difference to me. Maybe nobody shops downtown (at least in Kansas City) because there is no place to shop. Nearest thing to it is Halls, still in business after all these years, and perhaps subsidized by the Inc.

More people are moving downtown, and I would think that if a department store was there, they would shop there rather than drive to Metro North. And tourism and business travelers will drop in to shop in a downtown department store as well, if there is one.

[staubio]

I'm with Lenexa here.  Besides, we don't want activity disappearing into a big-box eating up a block of downtown when we could have people floating from shop to shop and bringing some street life with them.  If it is a drive up and disappear inside type of store, it might as well be in the suburbs.

[DaveKCMO]

yup... department stores are the original big boxes. bring on the specialty retailers!

[heatherkay]

Tiny bit off topic -- we were in DT MPLS this summer and we needed toothpaste.  Target has a downtown store adjacent to its world headquarters.  It had about the same sq foot as a std Target, over two floors. 

The best part of the store?  The shopping cart escalator!

[KC0KEK]

Besides, we don't want activity disappearing into a big-box eating up a block of downtown when we could have people floating from shop to shop and bringing some street life with them.  If it is a drive up and disappear inside type of store, it might as well be in the suburbs.

That's a legit concern, but it doesn't have to be that way. Case in point: The Macy's and Filene's Basement in Boston. Every time I've been there, the stores are packed, and so are the sidewalks around them. In fact, when I was there a couple of weeks ago, they seemed to be a lot busier than the H&M and Eddie Bauer stores down the street.

[lock+load]

You say only old farts shop at department stores.  Is there any evidence that our generation will not gravitate toward department stores when we're old?

As for street life, downtown seemed to have plenty of it in the 40s and 50s when there were many department stores downtown.

[bbqboy]

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f ... LHT301.DTL

[LenexatoKCMO]

You say only old farts shop at department stores.  Is there any evidence that our generation will not gravitate toward department stores when we're old?

The only way they survive is if they can find away to attract some brands that actually offer some social cachet.  Generations under 40 have become much more brand conscious about their clothing and department store lines like Dockers and Claiborne aren't doing anything to draw in brand conscious shoppers.  Even the handful of department store brands that have a half an ounce of brand cachet, like Levis, Ralph Lauren, Hilfiger, have all started operating stand alone stores to ween themselves out of the department stores.  The high end department stores like Nordstroms and Halls may be able to continue to attract enough high end designer labels that will carry enough social cachet to keep them alive in that small niche, but the writing is on the wall for the main stream stores - they just don't have what people want. 

[kcdcchef]

You say only old farts shop at department stores.  Is there any evidence that our generation will not gravitate toward department stores when we're old?

As for street life, downtown seemed to have plenty of it in the 40s and 50s when there were many department stores downtown.

thank you for pointing out the part about the 40's and 50's lock. in that era in kc, macys, jones, emery bird and thayer, all had huge department stores in dtkc and they were PACKED, and there was plenty of foot traffic to boot.

macys has a downtown department store here in pittsburgh, and like 8 floors or something. same thing with the macys in lower manhattan. 6,7,8 story department stores that do not eat a whole block, and are VIBRANT.

the thing is, too many of you associate a dt department store with what you see in the burbs presently, and or what we just tore down. the downtown jones store was a MONSTER, one of the few department stores left that still did furniture, and further, had the bridal department for all of the area stores. you picked out your gowns and what not say in prarie village, yet still had to come dt to get it. and they also handled the catalog orders out of half the store. in the end, jones was not even using 70% of the building.

so, i think a dt department store done right, like in other cities, would be a blessing. and a great addition.

[AndrewN]

I do not believe the statement that only old people go to mainstream department stores like Macy's.  Federated has done a good job of reinventing themselves.  I think you will notice a big change (for the better) in the spark Macy's has versus Jones Store.  Jones got tired after May took them over. 

[kcdcchef]

I do not believe the statement that only old people go to mainstream department stores like Macy's.  Federated has done a good job of reinventing themselves.  I think you will notice a big change (for the better) in the spark Macy's has versus Jones Store.  Jones got tired after May took them over. 

i agree. i am not an old fart by any stretch of the imagination, and every time i go into a department store they are busy, with tons of people in them, and further, they are usually younger then me. my wife is younger then me, and knows how to dress, believe me, and she shops in department stores AND the other aeropostale types too.

[shaffe]

anybody ever been to downtown chicago?  they don't seem to suffer too much with marshall fields taking up so much space on state street and water tower place taking up a big spot of space on the north part of michigan avenue.

now to suggest that kansas city is chicago is ludicrious, but i figured i'd point it out.  and for what it's worth, i made most of my actual purchases at water tower place two months ago when i was there.  downtown kc could definately survive if there was a 4-6 story department store down there, IMO.

[KC0KEK]

anybody ever been to downtown chicago?  they don't seem to suffer too much with marshall fields taking up so much space on state street and water tower place taking up a big spot of space on the north part of michigan avenue.

Agreed. I was there last weekend and the weekend before that. The Filene's Basement across from Water Tower Place is one of my favorite stores. It's always packed.

On a side note, one of the upscale department stores in Water Tower Place -- Lord & Taylor, I think -- might not have its lease renewed because the building's owner wants to bring in Target or another retailer willing to pay higher rates.

[warwickland]

i honestly dont know too many people in my age group (~25) that shop at the old school department stores. in many nuevo-successful downtowns i see a smattering of the smaller places like the gap, etc. in any case, i tend to think more-smaller scale vs fewer-larger scale stores are better in general for the vitality of a re-emerging urban center.

[skim82]

Has anyone seen the Target/Best Buy combo in Los Angeles near the Walk of Fame? 

It is in a somewhat urban area, and they have I believe 3 levels of parking for both stores on the backside of the building as well as street parking.  Very well done, and I have to admit it was very friendly to the walkability of the area.