KCRag Forum

KCPowercat wrote: 500 divided by 2m does suck.  Of course 1.5M are burbs and you are right, when I'm in the burbs I never see a taxi.

My bad.  According to this, KC had 600 cabs just for KCMO in 2003.
http://www.ci.jacksonville.nc.us/opencm ... -28-03.pdf


According to this, KCMO City  intentionally capped cab permits to allow only 600 in 2001.  It says KC has 24 cab companies.  There are still probably many more than 600 that operate in KCMO.  IF you look at the license plates of cabs, many are licensed in JoCo, probably a way to get around the 600 limit.

http://archives.californiaaviation.org/ ... 14981.html


The article says only a couple hundred cabs serve STL airport but I think there are about 900 cabs or so in STL County.  I'm sure I'll get corrected (by you-know-who) before I even press the post button.


According to this, there is a limit of 1300 taxi permits in San Francisco with a 10-year+ waiting list.
http://taxi-reg.home.att.net/prop-m.htm

It's easy to get a cab in Downtown, Crown Center, Westport and the Plaza, you just have to know where they hang out.  River Market, Midtown etc, you better call in advance.

MAX should have run down Broadway, but the retailers along Broadway would have killed it and delayed it.  The want no part of restricting parking for the MAX buses, plus, I think some of Broadway is only four lanes.

But it would have been a much better route south of Crown Center.

I still don't understand why the MAX route circles around downtown.  Wouldn't it be more efficient and cut several more minutes off the wait to just have one straight path through the middle of the loop?  It's supposed to be rapid transit.  You could then have regular bus routes with transfer points on the MAX route downtown if you needed to get somewhere you couldn't walk to.  Instead we end up trying to please everyone and set up way too many stops, and have it meander all over the place.  Stupid stuff like this continues to cost the city.   :(

More about MAX's wanderings. 

Big Red Storm wrote: I still don't understand why the MAX route circles around downtown.  Wouldn't it be more efficient and cut several more minutes off the wait to just have one straight path through the middle of the loop?  It's supposed to be rapid transit.  You could then have regular bus routes with transfer points on the MAX route downtown if you needed to get somewhere you couldn't walk to.  Instead we end up trying to please everyone and set up way too many stops, and have it meander all over the place.  Stupid stuff like this continues to cost the city.   :(

Having MAX wander around downtown is a problem.  I bet before long they'll run MAX weekend service along a more direct route through downtown.  Then it'll be weekends and evenings.  Before you know it they'll have the entire downtown route straightened out.  Then maybe shift it to Broadway south of Linwood to the Plaza. 

THEN, once the route is all worked out, we can talk about light rail or streetcars.  (Hey, there's something to be said for making your route mistakes with buses first.)

At least BRT is flexible so that the route can be changed in the future.  Ideally we'd have a straight north/south route connecting to an east/west route.

It is a wash, I think.  With the bus, you've got to jog over to Broadway on Linwood, so you lose time there.  There is virtually nothing of value on that stretch for the bus to serve.  Of course, the time element of this "jog" would be eliminated by the time saved by eliminating the Main to Nichols jump, which could be a nightmare. 

The Valentine area is really the only real concentration of stuff that would warrant a stop before Westport on the line.  The stuff on Main is somewhat comparable and will probably attract the same ridership.  If you need to get to the Valentine area, get off at the Armour stop and walk 3 blocks.

The same goes for Westport, though I wish the 39th stop went a block further to Westport Road and was called "Westport" instead of "Main at 39th".  That would be much clearer to the casual user.  I fear that an outsider or suburbanite not familiar with the city will assume the line doesn't go to Westport and thus won't use it.  The walk from Main down Westport Road to Broadway is a friendly one and could benefit from increased transit-enduced traffic.  There is also a nice cluster of business at Westport and Main.

While I do think a Broadway alignment might be better, I don't see it as being that much different -- as long as we educate users.  The logic of letting people walk a little bit could definately be a benefit.  As far as downtown goes, running a straight line makes total sense.  You are never going to be more than 6 blocks from a centrally run BRT route when downtown and I think enough is right: they'll start by cutting out those extra stops on weekends when nobody is at the major employment centers -- especially in the government district.  No need to pick everyone up.  That dance routine will get old when I take the line from the River Market.

Only a couple more weeks before MAX starts.  Only a few shelters/signs are up and there are no digital mechs in them yet.  So much for testing the system before using it (typical KCMO short cuts).  Me thinks this could be running behind schedule or we'll have to expect a lot of bugs.

ignatius wrote: Me thinks this could be running behind schedule or we'll have to expect a lot of bugs.

What bugs? They're freaking buses with new stops...

trailerkid wrote: What bugs? They're freaking buses with new stops...

Trust me, there will be "bugs." My dad just had a markup where all the drivers choose routes for the next few months, and he was warned off by a friend who oversees the routes and the MAX conversion, for the time being at least.

trailerkid wrote: What bugs? They're freaking buses with new stops...

The buses are tracked by GPS and the stops will have digital signs that tell when next bus arrives. It also tracks and displays info about feeder crosstown busses.  That would need significant testing.  I've managed many jobs of similar technicality and a month or so of testing/tuning would be required by most sane companies before putting in into 'production'.

The stop at southbound Main at 31st has the digital display running now.  At the moment it just displays the time and a message about "Max coming soon..."

ignatius wrote: The buses are tracked by GPS and the stops will have digital signs that tell when next bus arrives. It also tracks and displays info about feeder crosstown busses.  That would need significant testing.  I've managed many jobs of similar technicality and a month or so of testing/tuning would be required by most sane companies before putting in into 'production'.

Dito here. And just look at how long it took them to get the Scout running right.

Max not being fully functional on the 24th isn't a big issue to me.  Maybe the vendor was slow getting parts in....nothing opening the first day in any city goes off w/o a hitch.

What's still confusing me is the stops...especially close to the plaza.

39th
43rd
45th
47th

At least the 43rd stop could be taken out.  I understand 39th and even 45th because of the Nelson and hotels right there.

29th <- WTF is this stop here for?  I've never seen 1 person board a bus at this stop.  Are they trying to push the lib memorial?

31st AND Linwood?  These stops aren't even 1/4 mile apart.

10th & Oak AND 11th & Oak<- Huh?  One or the other probably would have been fine...it's not like they are specific north or south stops.


Finally I'm still not sure how the bus is going to make that move from 47th & Main to JC Nichols....a car can't make that lane change 80% of the time.

Anyways....maybe I'm picking a little much...I"m excited for some 9 minute between buses.

29th street Federal reserve Bank???

ahhh yes, probably another reason.

ignatius wrote: The buses are tracked by GPS and the stops will have digital signs that tell when next bus arrives. It also tracks and displays info about feeder crosstown busses.

There was an electronic kiosk in shoppping centers in Sioux City, Iowa circa 1996 that did the same thing. It had a map showing the actual buses as they proceeded through their routes with times and such.

so, who's going to try to ride the BRT on the first day of operation!!!

(show of hands)

I'm out of town, but if I was there you could count on me riding it. 

hey been gone for a while, now back... hello all.

Does anyone know if the KCATA is planning on overhauling its website for MAX? Currently the website is pretty damn bleak and, in my opinion, intimidating for the first time rider or for people who are not consciously trying to give the bus a shot.

On a related note, It is an incredible shame just how little web-PR our existing transit system gets. I was looking at the Kansas City Convention and Visitors Buerau website and it took me a while to find a link and vauge description of the existing bus service we have (no mention whatsoever about MAX). If I hadnt known that Kansas City had a bus service I would never have spent that much time looking. To any of our tourists and conventioneers (a big market for MAX imho) it seems that there is no transit system here, period.

Doesn´t anyone else think it would be in the KC Visitors Beaureu, Plaza, Westport, Rivermarket, Crossroads, Downtown Council´s, Crown Center, etc interest to agressively inform people about MAX? apparently not.

It would be really nice if there was a website with the theme "Explore the Urban Core (with MAX)". Such a site could make the most of this MAX line and help people find ways to use it. It could be set up for students, tourists, as well as locals looking to "vacation in" or "rediscover" their own city. Of course another goal of the site would be to convince locals who live on the line that MAX is a worthy transit system for their needs as well. A day / weekend / bar crawl / etc planner could use the MAX line route and schedule information to make "travel itenaries" and urge visitors to not only use MAX, but to explore (and spend their money in) the urban core. It would also be a great way to educated tourists and locals about the progress being made in the urban core and get people truly excited about KCs future.

could the KCATA do this? It would probably be have to be done by another organziation or, more probably, by KC-fans and volunteers.

I can only imagine a website with a MAX info section and  travel planner that would be something like this:
Joe Blow from Olathe puts in he wants to spend a family day in the core. He puts in whether he is more interested in art, museums, theater, sports, etc as well as other general prefrences. The trip planner would spit something out like (but with more details and alternative options),
- Park at Park and ride lot in Brookside area. Get ice cream at Baskin Robbins. Wait for the bus. Take the bus to the Plaza, explore the Plaza, see these sites, walk to Nelson, see Nelson, get on bus, stop at Gates on Main for Lunch, Ride to Liberty Memorial, explore that and do Science City, etc. Of course walkign times and directions would be included, etc.

I am not sure the KCATA they even could if they wanted to, because of the potential problems of them recommending specific restaurants and attractions, etc would go against thier political prospects.

Even though I am dissapointed with the realisation of MAX I do think we need to ride it as much as possible and promote it. MAX cannot be a failure. It is a shame that info is so hard to come by. oh well.

My guess is that the KCATA and others (e.g., C&VB) won't start agressively marketing it until it launches. It's possible that all of those materials are already in place but won't be trotted out until launch.