KCRag Forum

I feel like something not discussed as much is the fact it often takes as much time to even get to a bus stop as it does to just drive to the destination, or even ride the bus there.

Anecdotal story here, but this morning, my walk to the #107 stop at 47th and Mission took 21 minutes. My commute usually takes 10. The bus ride took 20 minutes to Downtown KCK. (Note, 107 pre-pandemic was a 10 minute walk with the Mission extension).

Bike share and microtransit (heck even park and rides) would be great assets to help bridge that gap. If more people knew the walk to the bus wouldn't take as long as the commute, more people would be inclined to take it.

flyingember wrote: ↑Tue Aug 03, 2021 8:12 am

WoodDraw wrote: ↑Tue Aug 03, 2021 3:50 am There's a good reason I'm not in charge of local transit, but I've always wanted to read more about the tradeoffs between prioritizing transit around urban areas with zoning reform to encourage density vs. trying to reach everyone in a sprawled mess because everyone deserves a way to work.

Look at service to the downtown KCK transit center at 7th and Minnesota

There's service 37 miles to Gardner
There isn't service 5.4 miles into Riverside where

Why wouldn't someone want to work 15 minutes from home?

Problem is there aren't as many job opportunities as there are down in South JoCo where warehouses are going up like crazy.

Another example in that same vein though. To get from Midtown KCK to Northland, it's two buses and likely over an hour of riding, I'd be curious as to what a line using I-635 to connect the two, as well as JoCo could do.

SilentSpades24 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 03, 2021 9:32 am Bike share and microtransit (heck even park and rides) would be great assets to help bridge that gap. If more people knew the walk to the bus wouldn't take as long as the commute, more people would be inclined to take it.

The cost of a bike is dramatically lower too.

There's a clear need for a local last 10 blocks downtown service. Placing 1000 bikes downtown at 100 bike racks would cost a fraction of bus service. It wouldn't cover everyone (excludes families, anyone disabled) but it's a great start.


Houston is a great example of a metro with a huge car focus, insane low density areas, but they do transit so much better than we do. They did a whole system redesign based around transit centers a few years back, and if you've ever been to Houston their transit centers aren't placed downtown, they're placed well outside of downtown since the idea is to feed everyone into one and transfer to a higher capacity, higher frequency line much closer to people.
https://www.ridemetro.org/pages/TransitCenter.aspx

they have 21 transit centers for 59,000 average daily riders
We have 11 transit centers for 50,000 (in 2015) daily riders

Not condolidating service costs money and reduces how much of the city can be served

If we copied this we would end all bus routes south of the plaza at a transit center at UMKC, another would be at the northern end of NKC and send busses further out into the suburbs instead of so much parallel service in the urban core

The same consulting team that did the Houston redesign did RideKC Next. Houston had more resources to start with and decided they wanted to add more. That makes a big difference in the outcome.

DaveKCMO wrote: ↑Tue Aug 03, 2021 12:01 pm The same consulting team that did the Houston redesign did RideKC Next. Houston had more resources to start with and decided they wanted to add more. That makes a big difference in the outcome.

One interesting thing, there's no budget documents online between either KCATA or RideKC sites. So it's hard to prove how much is being spent.

There used to be, so transparency has taken a huge step backwards.

https://ridekc.org/region/kcata
This has a link for "Annual budgets and financial statements for KCATA"
and points to a page which has none of those documents.

In fairness, RideKC Next was aimed at serving those who use the service most and need the service most, which is understandable, but limiting. Sure, the urban core has good service, but KCK, Independence, JoCo? Not so much, which unfortunately, limits those to need the service most, to where there's most service, which sadly isn't exactly where the opportunities for jobs, recreation, etc are.

The main problem in the system is that it has the bones, but it's missing a few connections that could easily elevate the system (granted, much of it is due to money), and lacks the regional cooperation.

Also, we have to remember, we aren't Houston, Dallas, Chicago, etc. We are Kansas City, and transit needs to be designed around Kansas City, and the two different versions of the city; The old streetcar city and the automobile city.

SilentSpades24 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 03, 2021 2:36 pm
Also, we have to remember, we aren't Houston, Dallas, Chicago, etc. We are Kansas City, and transit needs to be designed around Kansas City, and the two different versions of the city; The old streetcar city and the automobile city.

Houston is a giant oil grown city with downtown towers full of people dedicated to selling the product. The outer areas of the city are filled with oil refineries, oil service companies and the like. It has a section of freeway that with frontage roads and shoulders is ~30 lanes across.

The only difference is Houston took the time to get the budget. Can you imagine being the transit agency in a town built on gasoline? They still did it.

$700 million to Missouri for transit via formula grants in the new infrastructure bill

normalthings wrote: ↑Fri Aug 13, 2021 11:07 am $700 million to Missouri for transit via formula grants in the new infrastructure bill

Aren't there more grants we can compete for, like the community reinvestment fund (highway removal section)?

AlkaliAxel wrote: ↑Fri Aug 13, 2021 12:04 pm

normalthings wrote: ↑Fri Aug 13, 2021 11:07 am $700 million to Missouri for transit via formula grants in the new infrastructure bill

Aren't there more grants we can compete for, like the community reinvestment fund (highway removal section)?

Yes, but those require a local match (which we don’t have).

normalthings wrote: ↑Fri Aug 13, 2021 12:13 pm

AlkaliAxel wrote: ↑Fri Aug 13, 2021 12:04 pm

normalthings wrote: ↑Fri Aug 13, 2021 11:07 am $700 million to Missouri for transit via formula grants in the new infrastructure bill

Aren't there more grants we can compete for, like the community reinvestment fund (highway removal section)?

Yes, but those require a local match (which we don’t have).

I thought DColeKC said we do have a local match ready to go?

AlkaliAxel wrote: ↑Fri Aug 13, 2021 12:17 pm

normalthings wrote: ↑Fri Aug 13, 2021 12:13 pm

AlkaliAxel wrote: ↑Fri Aug 13, 2021 12:04 pm

Aren't there more grants we can compete for, like the community reinvestment fund (highway removal section)?

Yes, but those require a local match (which we don’t have).

I thought DColeKC said we do have a local match ready to go?

I was referring to the broader transit grant programs

Another service reduction for RideKC.

MMAX, 12, 24 29, 35, 39, 229, 233 to reduce service due to staffing issues.

You hate to see it.

SilentSpades24 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 3:51 pm Another service reduction for RideKC.

MMAX, 12, 24 29, 35, 39, 229, 233 to reduce service due to staffing issues.

You hate to see it.

These reductions are all targeted to frequency, rather than wholesale eliminations, so people still have access. Running out of options. Recruiting and hiring is a slog across all sectors.

KMBC reported the same issue with the KCPD.

FangKC wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 7:47 pm KMBC reported the same issue with the KCPD.

I’ve heard IPD is worse.

DaveKCMO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 6:01 pm

SilentSpades24 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 3:51 pm Another service reduction for RideKC.

MMAX, 12, 24 29, 35, 39, 229, 233 to reduce service due to staffing issues.

You hate to see it.

These reductions are all targeted to frequency, rather than wholesale eliminations, so people still have access. Running out of options. Recruiting and hiring is a slog across all sectors.

That's good to hear. At least there is still access. Hiring has been a pain across the board. Hopefully things get better soon. Excited for RideKC Next.

You know things are bad when you haven't seen a 39 bus come by in over 2 hours.

Has ATA or will ATA change the way it disperses drivers to make sure key routes always have a bus on it? Seems a major midtown route hasn't had a bus in over 2 hours.

I rode 47 and MMAX last week and while fewer runs per hour was OK. Google Maps not sync'd at all though, way off. Can't complain when all lines free to ride. Airlines struggling too now claiming weather but we all know it's operational/staff issues. Time for overhead robo flight attendants with remote monitoring and one manned security? And perhaps it's just a matter of time planes/busses are flown/driven remotely like a drone. Might take another generation but won't be surprising if sooner out of necessity.

earthling wrote: ↑Sun Oct 10, 2021 4:00 pm I rode 47 and MMAX last week and while fewer runs per hour was OK. Google Maps not sync'd at all though, way off. Can't complain when all lines free to ride. Airlines struggling too now claiming weather but we all know it's operational/staff issues. Time for overhead robo flight attendants with remote monitoring and one manned security? And perhaps it's just a matter of time planes/busses are flown/driven remotely like a drone. Might take another generation but won't be surprising if sooner out of necessity.

Schedules will align with actual service levels starting Sunday, Oct. 24. Hopefully this is the last reduction as hiring and training are underway.