OFFICIAL - Corbin Park (135th and Metcalf)

[phxcat]

People are all taking a stand against these suburban developments, but everytime someone tries to make another "Plaza of the ________" two things are garaunteed- it will not be the Plaza of the _______ and it will have intersting architecture. I just got back in tow nthe other day, and after spending too much time in the desert, two things jumped out at me- Kansas City is freakin green! And Phoenix has absolutely no architecure- every freakinstrip mall looks like every other one. Here, they are all different. That's not all a bad thing.

[KCK]

People are all taking a stand against these suburban developments, but everytime someone tries to make another "Plaza of the ________" two things are garaunteed- it will not be the Plaza of the _______ and it will have intersting architecture. I just got back in tow nthe other day, and after spending too much time in the desert, two things jumped out at me- Kansas City is freakin green! And Phoenix has absolutely no architecure- every freakinstrip mall looks like every other one. Here, they are all different. That's not all a bad thing.

Thats cool. We take all the trees and grass for granted. I have seen pics of green lawns and trees in Phoenix though, although it looked unnatural.

[KCK]

Ok, revisions have been made to the layout of this development. Get this, it will be BIGGER.

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascit ... 902966.htm

Developers for open-air mall seek changes

Proposal for 135th and Metcalf would have revised layout

By ERIN FITZGERALD

The Kansas City Star

Plans for an open-air mall in south Overland Park are continuing to move forward.

The Overland Park Planning Commission on Monday endorsed a revised preliminary plan for the more than 1 million-square-foot project at 135th Street and Metcalf Avenue.

The changes include increasing the square footage of the project and changing the layout of the project to a more grid-like orientation.

“The overall design approach really hasn't changed,â€

[trailerkid]

two-story junior anchor of 36,000 square feet = Crate & Barrel...

C+B go two levels in many of their newer stores and they are always close to this amount of squarre footage in their new stores. I would say there's a 70% chance of this being C+B...

[eomaha.com]

I'll be impressed if Cormac lures a C+B... you know to this point all they've done is strip centers in Omaha for the most part (although their Shops of Legacy appears to have some promise).

[trailerkid]

I'll be impressed if Cormac lures a C+B... you know to this point all they've done is strip centers in Omaha for the most part (although their Shops of Legacy appears to have some promise).

The incomes down there are off the chains. I believe that some of the retailers and restaurants were already lined up to go in before Cormac took over. It has been widely speculated for years now that Von Maur will enter the KC market with a store there.

I've seen some of the stuff that Cormac has done and they seem about like RED or maybe even lower on the totem pole. Regardless, they are developing at one of the most high profile locations in one of the biggest retail developments in decades (not counting the Speedway). In order to survive and prosper in the Jo Co retail heavy market, they're going to need the big names. C+B is also entering StL so I think a KC store(s) can't be far behind.

[LCDSI]

if this mall is going to survive it'll really have to differntiate itself by attracting high end retailers that are not present in the rest of the metro. it's great that there's a possibility to get more shops in the metro but it could be bad news for the plaza.

in terms of possible additions, i agree that one is probably c&b and a possible restaurant is p.f. changs..(they were looking around for a second location a few years ago).

department store wise...i really hope it's not a von maur...hopefully it's a bloomingdales, lord and taylor or neiman marcus.

[trailerkid]

if this mall is going to survive it'll really have to differntiate itself by attracting high end retailers that are not present in the rest of the metro. it's great that there's a possibility to get more shops in the metro but it could be bad news for the plaza.

in terms of possible additions, i agree that one is probably c&b and a possible restaurant is p.f. changs..(they were looking around for a second location a few years ago).

department store wise...i really hope it's not a von maur...hopefully it's a bloomingdales, lord and taylor or neiman marcus.

In my opinion, Town Center Plaza was a flop when it came to being a "Plaza of the South" because the stores they have aren't unique to Johnson County much less unique to Kansas City. It's design was also terrible.

So, what if Corbin Park used its demos and incomes to truly attract the higher end brands that don't even have stores in KC. Luxury retailers don't care about being in the suburbs as long as they're in areas with money. What if Corbin Park offered many of the stores like Louis Vuitton, Cartier, Burberry, Diesel, etc. that aren't in KC? Because Town Center already houses many of the middle-brow names like Abercrombie and Gap and they wouldn't need two stores within 15 blocks-- I could see this development becoming full of the more exclusive and luxury retailers that fit so well with the Jo Co lifestyle. But 1 M square feet is A LOT of retailers and restaurants regardless of whether they are upscale or not.

If this place really did become a first class upscale center...it would send shockwaves through the retail world in KC. I know that C+B spends A LOT of time and research picking locations, so if they go to OP it was probably an intense selection process. The Plaza need to build a major expansion with more retail space so they can put to rest the question of any suburban development filling their upscale niche.

[chrizow]

if this OP mall can score those super high-end luxury tenants, good for them. i think the louis vuittons and diesels and cartiers belong on the plaza, but if they go to corbin place, that means the plaza failed to lure them.

but yeah, one MILLION square feet is WAY too much to actually be entirely high-end, especially in KC. all the high-end retailers in the metro combined wouldn't acheive that much sq. footage.

if anything, i bet it will be a "typical" upscale mall (i.e. oak park) plus some unique stuff (crate + barrel perhaps). if we're lucky, maybe they'll devote one "wing" to the super-luxury stuff. like one wing could be anchored by a neiman-marcus, then outside the N-M would be a small Diesel (like the ones in Denver and Dallas), perhaps an LV, a Cartier, a Coach, a Kate Spade (hellooooooo, Kate, where arrrre you???), and other stores like that.

1 million square feet of luxury is a Rodeo Drive or Fifth Ave or Houston Galleria sort of figure. no way.

[eomaha.com]

There's always room for Claires.

[UMKCgal]

Is it final that they aren't going to have lofts above these stores? I really hope they include those. but while we're on tenants...they should get an H&m here instead..and i'd also like to see a body central, rampage, united colors of benetton among those super luxury boutiques the plaza doesn't have.

[cdschofield]

As I was reading this thread I thought of an outdoor version of the Houston Galleria. The exclusive stuff clustered together in one area like it is at the Houston Galleria near NM. The clustering of stores was even mentioned in the article.

Speaking of Benetton, what is the story. I remember at least in the late 80's they seemed to be in every mall, then they disappeared, now they are considered an exclusive store. I specifically remember they were located at the Plaza and Mission Center, and I could have swore they were in Bannister.

[LCDSI]

if this mall is going to survive it'll really have to differntiate itself by attracting high end retailers that are not present in the rest of the metro. it's great that there's a possibility to get more shops in the metro but it could be bad news for the plaza.

in terms of possible additions, i agree that one is probably c&b and a possible restaurant is p.f. changs..(they were looking around for a second location a few years ago).

department store wise...i really hope it's not a von maur...hopefully it's a bloomingdales, lord and taylor or neiman marcus.

In my opinion, Town Center Plaza was a flop when it came to being a "Plaza of the South" because the stores they have aren't unique to Johnson County much less unique to Kansas City. It's design was also terrible.

So, what if Corbin Park used its demos and incomes to truly attract the higher end brands that don't even have stores in KC. Luxury retailers don't care about being in the suburbs as long as they're in areas with money. What if Corbin Park offered many of the stores like Louis Vuitton, Cartier, Burberry, Diesel, etc. that aren't in KC? Because Town Center already houses many of the middle-brow names like Abercrombie and Gap and they wouldn't need two stores within 15 blocks-- I could see this development becoming full of the more exclusive and luxury retailers that fit so well with the Jo Co lifestyle. But 1 M square feet is A LOT of retailers and restaurants regardless of whether they are upscale or not.

If this place really did become a first class upscale center...it would send shockwaves through the retail world in KC. I know that C+B spends A LOT of time and research picking locations, so if they go to OP it was probably an intense selection process. The Plaza need to build a major expansion with more retail space so they can put to rest the question of any suburban development filling their upscale niche.

realistically i don't think the plaza will do a major expansion within the near future. since that's the case our best bet for those exclusive retailers is in this new development. like my earlier comment i just think it's unfortunate that the plaza wil lose it's sense of exclusivity

[cdschofield]

Actually I think this project will have a more negative effect on Oak Park Mall than the Plaza. The Plaza is an attraction in and of itself. I would venture to guess that alot of people go to the Plaza for an experience and end up buying something. Converesly, people go to Oak Park Mall to buy something and the thought of an experience never crosses their mind.

Sometimes I don't know whether to blame Highwoods or stores that you would think would want to be on the Plaza. I thought a Dean & Deluca on the Plaza would be a no brainer, but evidently Dean & Deluca talked to Highwoods but it didn't go anywhere. Did Highwoods just screw things up or did D & D find the demos or available locations didn't work? The Plaza has lots of cache but the surrounding demos would require many chains to bend their rules since it is a truly economically diverse area. Probably the most affluent zip codes in the city lie right next to some of the poorest zip codes in the city. In southeastern JoCo the demos are some of the best in the country so stores don't have to think about it much, they just need the retail space.

Crate & Barrel seems to like affluent suburban locations rather than urban so this project seems to be their cup of tea. Until the recent location in Cherry Creek the C & B stores were located on the far southern and northern ends of Denver.

[GRID]

If that mall gets built, it will be the beginning of the decline of Oak Park Mall and the overall decline of retail north of 435.

[Tosspot]

If that mall gets built, it will be the beginning of the decline of Oak Park Mall and the overall decline of retail north of 435.

This brings up a question...These Zona Rosa-like "Lifestyle Centers" seem to becoming more and more popular, and I wonder if this spells the doom of the ever ubiquitous big box indoor mall, such as Oak Park.

Personally I'd rather go to a place like Zona Rosa or any other "Lifestyle Center" than some dipshit big box indoor mall, so I can't say I'm sad that the final death knell could be approaching for the traditional mall.

[ComandanteCero]

retail survives by cannibalizing other retail, so it's no wonder "lifestyle centers" is the new buzz word for trying to boost the retail cannibalizing process. If it weren't these centers, they'd be building malls, so i guess it works out somewhat. Now if the next wave in cannibalizing places were true pedestrian neighborhoods/retail centers......

[DanCa]

I agree that the Zona Rosa type developments are preferable but in KC I'd prefer an indoor mall simply to get out of the weather. When it's 10° outside, who does more business? Oak Park or the Plaza?

[KCPowercat]

it's not that cold that often here. Your 70* daily temps in Cali have softened you to real weather

[DanCa]

Oh, I know. I get cold on a 65° day. And to think I might be moving back to Denver after 10 years in the O.C. I'll need blood thickeners!