KCRag Forum

Highlander wrote:

kboish wrote:Vision for the garage wrapped w/ apartments at 13th and Baltimore.

So are these part of the general P&L building renovation or is it something that will be built later?

On a separate issue - what's with all the apartments? I would be very interested in a condo where I could
recover part of my investment but these and the Cordish development promise to be pretty high rents
for apartments in KC. I have no interest in that. I don't understand what is driving that market.

$40k/year millionaires who can't afford a down payment on a condo.

Highlander wrote:So are these part of the general P&L building renovation or is it something that will be built later?

On a separate issue - what's with all the apartments? I would be very interested in a condo where I could
recover part of my investment but these and the Cordish development promise to be pretty high rents
for apartments in KC. I have no interest in that. I don't understand what is driving that market.

The north building is part of the same overall project as the renovation. It has a parking garage that will serve both wrapped in the new apartments shown in that rendering.

Highlander wrote:partments? I would be very interested in a condo where I could
recover part of my investment but these and the Cordish development promise to be pretty high rents
for apartments in KC. I have no interest in that. I don't understand what is driving that market.

Financing for condos is still difficult and financing to build condos is pretty much non-existent, in KC, at least. With no one buying condos and downtown vacancy so low, there is no reason for any developer to build condos. But I expect some of these projects are being built with a future conversion to condos in mind.

taxi wrote:

Highlander wrote:partments? I would be very interested in a condo where I could
recover part of my investment but these and the Cordish development promise to be pretty high rents
for apartments in KC. I have no interest in that. I don't understand what is driving that market.

Financing for condos is still difficult and financing to build condos is pretty much non-existent, in KC, at least. With no one buying condos and downtown vacancy so low, there is no reason for any developer to build condos. But I expect some of these projects are being built with a future conversion to condos in mind.

There is also a large market segment that is made up of renter-types. They are reasonably adverse to owning real estate, as their lives are decidedly mobile. Staying flexible to take advantage of career opportunities, changing interests and relationship status. These are both young professionals and to some degree empty-nesters. The general economic and real estate roller coaster of the past six years, has caused many to view real estate ownership as a noose.

You mention the high rents.... Concrete, drywall, glass, plumbing and wiring all cost about the same to buy, whether you are in NYC, LA, Portland, Miami, or KC. You factor in the cost of these items, the underlying land value and some variation on labor and new apartments that are not stick-built, have to lease for $1.50-2.00 per square foot in Kansas City (2.75-10.00+psf in the other cities).

One also has to add the cost of garage parking to the cost of the apartment. Building a parking garage adds a lot of expense to a project, so the rents have to be higher.

FangKC wrote:One also has to add the cost of garage parking to the cost of the apartment. Building a parking garage adds a lot of expense to a project, so the rents have to be higher.

After many years of trying, I still cannot wrap my head around the fact that multi-level parking garages come at an average price of $27,000-$34,000 per parking space....

How much does it cost to build a new detached one- or two-car garage on a single family house lot?

I assume an attached garage is a bit cheaper, but how much additional cost does it add to a new house to add a two-car garage--versus a new house with no garage?

I assume costs for home garages also vary when a developer is building a lot of houses at one time, versus someone living in an older house--say in Midtown--without a garage who decides to have one built on their lot. I'm guessing a one-off garage would cost more to build than adding one in a housing development where you are building in volume.

FangKC wrote:How much does it cost to build a new detached one- or two-car garage on a single family house lot?

I assume an attached garage is a bit cheaper, but how much additional cost does it add to a new house to add a two-car garage--versus a new house with no garage?

I assume costs for home garages also vary when a developer is building a lot of houses at one time, versus someone living in an older house--say in Midtown--without a garage who decides to have one built on their lot. I'm guessing a one-off garage would cost more to build than adding one in a housing development where you are building in volume.

Hodges Garages quoted me about $15K for a single car detached garage that fit the style/architecture of my Tudor style house. That includes a side door, useable attic, electricity, slab and footings.

Haven't done it yet.

Highlander wrote:On a separate issue - what's with all the apartments? I would be very interested in a condo where I could
recover part of my investment but these and the Cordish development promise to be pretty high rents
for apartments in KC. I have no interest in that. I don't understand what is driving that market.

Renting is a national trend lately. Developers are reluctant to build more condos. In KC, the condo occupancy appears to have improved but not necessarily resale. A lot of apts went condo several years ago, especially on Plaza, and now some individual condo units are leasing when they can't sell. The local condo market seems to be improving a bit but probably not enough to be building/renovating to hirise condos. loftguy probably has better insight.

Would think any new luxury apt being built/converted lately is intended to be fairly short term with intention to go condo when market conditions are right.

PumpkinStalker wrote: Hodges Garages quoted me about $15K for a single car detached garage that fit the style/architecture of my Tudor style house. That includes a side door, useable attic, electricity, slab and footings.

That sounds really cheap, especially to include matching style, running electricity and such.

I can't help but wonder what the catch is?

Hodges Garages quoted me about $15K for a single car detached garage that fit the style/architecture of my Tudor style house. That includes a side door, useable attic, electricity, slab and footings.

No roof?

That really isn't that bad of a price. On new home construction adding a 3rd car garage isn't that much less from what I have been told. 15 or so years ago is was $10,000 to add in my development.

What size are you talking about? That's kinda important. On some new houses out here the garage bays are not all that deep and close to the car doors on the sides.

aknowledgeableperson wrote:What size are you talking about? That's kinda important. On some new houses out here the garage bays are not all that deep and close to the car doors on the sides.

Speaking as someone who lives in a new-ish house, we can barely fit a Silverado in the garage. It actually has to be angled. The 3rd garage is even worse. An inch on either side of the door and you have to back in because you're parking two inches from the wall.


... and to actually be on topic, any idea how much has been spent on just parking structures downtown?

longviewmo wrote:

aknowledgeableperson wrote:What size are you talking about? That's kinda important. On some new houses out here the garage bays are not all that deep and close to the car doors on the sides.

Speaking as someone who lives in a new-ish house, we can barely fit a Silverado in the garage. It actually has to be angled. The 3rd garage is even worse. An inch on either side of the door and you have to back in because you're parking two inches from the wall.


... and to actually be on topic, any idea how much has been spent on just parking structures downtown?

there was a biz journal article years ago that detailed all of the public and private costs for buildings garages downtown, in the context of having continually voted down light rail. i believe the end result was we could have built light rail for the cost of all of the garages and then some.

longviewmo wrote:

aknowledgeableperson wrote:

... and to actually be on topic, any idea how much has been spent on just parking structures downtown?

the number thrown out for new is $10,000 per garage spot.

There's 40,000+ public spots. Think of how many private spots there are on top of that. I would bet 120,000-150,000 easily across all the buildings.
80-90% are in garages.

So let's say 165,000 spots. So that's easily $1.5 billion for garage spaces if spent today.

Intriguingly, that's the cost of 11 blocks of the 2nd avenue subway line in NYC

flyingember wrote:
the number thrown out for new is $10,000 per garage spot.

I like this number better, but again, I am hearing repeatedly that multi-story garage spaces are upwards of $27,000 per car.

loftguy wrote:

flyingember wrote:
the number thrown out for new is $10,000 per garage spot.

I like this number better, but again, I am hearing repeatedly that multi-story garage spaces are upwards of $27,000 per car.

I bet it's all the ground-level retail that the neighborhood demands adding on that extra $17k per spot.

Eon Blue wrote:

loftguy wrote:

flyingember wrote:
the number thrown out for new is $10,000 per garage spot.

I like this number better, but again, I am hearing repeatedly that multi-story garage spaces are upwards of $27,000 per car.

I bet it's all the ground-level retail that the neighborhood demands adding on that extra $17k per spot.

Heyo!

But yeah, I've always heard ~$27k/spot.

.

And if the go below grade the cost goes higher.

Some industry lit from 2013

http://www.cityofeastlansing.com/Docume ... /View/1594

median 17.5k

KC - 18+

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