Downtown Baseball Stadium

[AlkaliAxel]

Hopefully we get the same but I have a feeling this will be cheap cookie cutter with the same generic apartments that are now all over KC

Supposedly the architecture firms here are too good to make it shitty

[dukuboy1]

I would be floored if the world class firms in the city were not engaged in making the stadium and surrounding areas amazing. This is their chance to design a stadium and urban area that will be around for a generation and serve as a backdrop to so much branding for the city. They will have tons of free press and accolades for years if done well, which I would expect.

You know JE Dunn will be the construction firm, given their part ownership. One of the big 2 engineering firms will be on aboard as well. I guess it all comes down to Sherman and the rest of the ownership group to decide the what price tag they feel comfortable with. Doing it with minimal public money and or tax dollars will allow for less "chefs in the kitchen" so to speak when it comes to design and vision. I'm hoping for something that captures all that is charming & wonderful about the K and then goes to the next level for the stadium, and the surrounding neighborhood will be transformative and stunning as well. It most likely will not be radical from a design perspective but no less pleasing I'm sure.

[FangKC]

Don't get over-excited. The same was said when the T-Mobile Center (Sprint Center) was being planned. Just having the firms here doesn't mean that the final product will be iconic or receive accolades for years. I have a feeling that there will be cool drawings of some built-out district that will end up looking nothing like the final product. The stadium will likely get built, and then "voila," we'll never see the additional buildings in the plan. The remaining blocks will eventually get built out with 5-story apartment buildings like we are seeing built all over the City now.

[Cratedigger]

Don't get over-excited. The same was said when the T-Mobile Center (Sprint Center) was being planned. Just having the firms here doesn't mean that the final product will be iconic or receive accolades for years. I have a feeling that there will be cool drawings of some built-out district that will end up looking nothing like the final product. The stadium will likely get built, and then "voila," we'll never see the additional buildings in the plan. The remaining blocks will eventually get built out with 5-story apartment buildings like we are seeing built all over the City now.

There’s more potential here and I’m hopeful! Cordish’s Lights, 10th and Main, the Freight District plus the West Bottoms plan - these aren’t just 5 story apartments. I think this ballpark development has a great chance to be something unique

[FangKC]

There is almost an entire city block north of T-Mobile Center that has been empty since the arena opened in 2007 with not one new building on it, and no plan in sight.

It has taken 16 years (when P&L construction started) for Cordish to get to converting the Midland Building into apartments, a structure already built.

These sit right next to an existing busy arena and an entertainment district. If the East Village has so much potential, why have these languished so long given their location? The arena gets more use than a baseball stadium ever will.

[AlkaliAxel]

There is almost an entire city block north of T-Mobile Center that has been empty since the arena opened in 2007 with not one new building on it, and no plan in sight.

It has taken 16 years (when P&L construction started) for Cordish to get to converting the Midland Building into apartments, a structure already built.

These sit right next to an existing busy arena and an entertainment district. If the East Village has so much potential, why have these languished so long given their location? The arena gets more use than a baseball stadium ever will.

A couple differences I'd say
1.) Tmobile never got a full time sports tenant from NBA/NHL
2.) Baseball stadium is outdoors and open so apartments could look over into it unlike an arena. More of a demand there.

[earthling]

Is a reason why a downtown ballpark should include multiple functions as part of the core project and a stadium happens to be fused in. Rather than a stand alone stadium with the hopes of other future developments nearby.

[aknowledgeableperson]

There’s more potential here and I’m hopeful! Cordish’s Lights, 10th and Main, the Freight District plus the West Bottoms plan - these aren’t just 5 story apartments. I think this ballpark development has a great chance to be something unique

Potential yes. But the problem could be too many plans competing with each other.

[FangKC]

There is almost an entire city block north of T-Mobile Center that has been empty since the arena opened in 2007 with not one new building on it, and no plan in sight.

It has taken 16 years (when P&L construction started) for Cordish to get to converting the Midland Building into apartments, a structure already built.

These sit right next to an existing busy arena and an entertainment district. If the East Village has so much potential, why have these languished so long given their location? The arena gets more use than a baseball stadium ever will.

A couple differences I'd say
1.) Tmobile never got a full time sports tenant from NBA/NHL
2.) Baseball stadium is outdoors and open so apartments could look over into it unlike an arena. More of a demand there.

Having a sports team in the arena would have no effect on adjoining real estate development. The arena is already one of the busiest in the nation just with concerts and events. The arena management have said they have more events because there is no NBA team.

[AlkaliAxel]

There is almost an entire city block north of T-Mobile Center that has been empty since the arena opened in 2007 with not one new building on it, and no plan in sight.

It has taken 16 years (when P&L construction started) for Cordish to get to converting the Midland Building into apartments, a structure already built.

These sit right next to an existing busy arena and an entertainment district. If the East Village has so much potential, why have these languished so long given their location? The arena gets more use than a baseball stadium ever will.

A couple differences I'd say
1.) Tmobile never got a full time sports tenant from NBA/NHL
2.) Baseball stadium is outdoors and open so apartments could look over into it unlike an arena. More of a demand there.

Having a sports team in the arena would have no effect on adjoining real estate development. The arena is already one of the busiest in the nation just with concerts and events. The arena management have said they have more events because there is no NBA team.

I disagree. Even though the arena is very busy, it’s different concerts & events mostly. If it were an anchor sports team that people got behind and could see every day, I think some people would live by it. But you don’t go to every pop, country & rap concert at the arena.

[DColeKC]

There is almost an entire city block north of T-Mobile Center that has been empty since the arena opened in 2007 with not one new building on it, and no plan in sight.

It has taken 16 years (when P&L construction started) for Cordish to get to converting the Midland Building into apartments, a structure already built.

These sit right next to an existing busy arena and an entertainment district. If the East Village has so much potential, why have these languished so long given their location? The arena gets more use than a baseball stadium ever will.

It took basically 8 years after PNL opened to open the first new high rise apartment, which up until that point hadn't been done for 40 years. The midland project might seem easier because the structure exists but in many ways, it's more complicated and certainly a less desirable project from a business perspective.

T-mobile center is still towards the top of the list of best arenas in this country. Not sure I consider the exterior iconic or anything but it's a fantastic arena.

[aknowledgeableperson]

I disagree. Even though the arena is very busy, it’s different concerts & events mostly. If it were an anchor sports team that people got behind and could see every day, I think some people would live by it. But you don’t go to every pop, country & rap concert at the arena.

Basically, there are two purposes to an arena. Get people in the building via events. And make money off of those events. And T-Mobile is doing a very good job at that. Having a sports team as a tenant can bring people into an arena but as pointed out the events the team replaces may bring in more people. And in all likelihood make less money for the arena and the city. Why? Because the team will move money from the pockets of arena management and the city to the team.

[DColeKC]

I disagree. Even though the arena is very busy, it’s different concerts & events mostly. If it were an anchor sports team that people got behind and could see every day, I think some people would live by it. But you don’t go to every pop, country & rap concert at the arena.

Basically, there are two purposes to an arena. Get people in the building via events. And make money off of those events. And T-Mobile is doing a very good job at that. Having a sports team as a tenant can bring people into an arena but as pointed out the events the team replaces may bring in more people. And in all likelihood make less money for the arena and the city. Why? Because the team will move money from the pockets of arena management and the city to the team.

100% correct.

[Cratedigger]

Watching the game today, Camden Yards looks empty. Officially it's 9,438 there today (stadium has a capacity of 45,000).

I think the games we see at Kauffman being 20% full has more to do with a Bad Team + Mid Day Baseball Game than whether it is downtown or not.

Still think a downtown stadium is a great idea, but let's not kid ourselves. If the Royals suck, people won't go to the game.

[KCPowercat]

To be fair today is a rain make up game.

[DColeKC]

Watching the game today, Camden Yards looks empty. Officially it's 9,438 there today (stadium has a capacity of 45,000).

I think the games we see at Kauffman being 20% full has more to do with a Bad Team + Mid Day Baseball Game than whether it is downtown or not.

Still think a downtown stadium is a great idea, but let's not kid ourselves. If the Royals suck, people won't go to the game.

Might not be talking about thousands, but it's far more plausable for people to decide last minute to attend a game when they've just got to walk a few blocks in comparison to getting out to TSC. I for one would absolutely dip out of work on certain days if I could walk over to the game, never having to get in my vehicle or worry about parking.

[AlkaliAxel]

I don't think all downtown baseball is the same. I honestly think 70% of it comes down to how active/good your downtown is. If your downtown is mediocre like StL, Cleveland or Baltimore(?) then you're gonna have trouble. But if your downtown is Denver, San Diego, Minneapolis..or KC...then you'll do well with downtown baseball attendance.

I believe this was a big reason the Royals didn't move in 2006 when it was still dead. Going into a dead downtown does nothing. But going into an active one can literally be exponential (re Denver, SD)

[aknowledgeableperson]

I don't think all downtown baseball is the same. I honestly think 70% of it comes down to how active/good your downtown is. If your downtown is mediocre like StL, …

Let’s see, if StL downtown is mediocre then how come average attendance is around 40,000. Is it because they constantly have a competitive team?

[DColeKC]

I don't think all downtown baseball is the same. I honestly think 70% of it comes down to how active/good your downtown is. If your downtown is mediocre like StL, …

Let’s see, if StL downtown is mediocre then how come average attendance is around 40,000. Is it because they constantly have a competitive team?

Yes. But historically they’ve essentially been the opposite of the Royals. A highly consistent and competitive team averaging attendance in the top 4 of the league. They had more total attendance in 2019 than the Yankees.

STL may be a anomaly.

[AlkaliAxel]

I don't think all downtown baseball is the same. I honestly think 70% of it comes down to how active/good your downtown is. If your downtown is mediocre like StL, …

Let’s see, if StL downtown is mediocre then how come average attendance is around 40,000. Is it because they constantly have a competitive team?

Anamoly. I'd be willing to bet teams as awful as Mariners, Padres & Rockies are still get a decent crowd in bad years despite the fact they're awful franchises- all because their downtowns are active.