KCRag Forum

Based on the size , that's the corner of quality hill. So that would be resident parking.

And as a corner no one would purposefully walk to today, it will fit in fine.

This is the type of apartment building I wish was being built on that site. A parking garage would be placed in the center of the block with this apartment building on the corner of 10th and Jefferson, and townhouses wrapped around the garage on all other sides of the block.

Perspectives directly applicable to both these developments:

http://bettercities.net/news-opinion/bl ... ruly-urban

Worn Copy wrote:Perspectives directly applicable to both these developments:

http://bettercities.net/news-opinion/bl ... ruly-urban

reminds me of French Quarter New Orleans

Ran by this site yesterday. This building needs to have some retail element to it. Lots or residential back on that hill and nothing serving the current and future residents.

KCPowercat wrote:Ran by this site yesterday. This building needs to have some retail element to it. Lots or residential back on that hill and nothing serving the current and future residents.

broadway is too far? existing commercial corridor already built for retail.

Not talking anything big but yeah its what 4-5 blocks to Broadway? Just a coffee shop or small eatery would be nice up there I bet.

KCPowercat wrote:Not talking anything big but yeah its what 4-5 blocks to Broadway? Just a coffee shop or small eatery would be nice up there I bet.

Yea I agree, a shop or two would be nice to mix in. Maybe even more. If you have to go at least 4 blocks just reach any commercial, you could argue that the area is not even really urban. I mean this neighborhood is in the downtown loop.

Demosthenes wrote:

KCPowercat wrote:Not talking anything big but yeah its what 4-5 blocks to Broadway? Just a coffee shop or small eatery would be nice up there I bet.

Yea I agree, a shop or two would be nice to mix in. Maybe even more. If you have to go at least 4 blocks just reach any commercial, you could argue that the area is not even really urban. I mean this neighborhood is in the downtown loop.

A serious suggestion. Find a way to communicate this to the developer, in writing. It's called guerilla lobbying. Some development entities are oblivious to the placemaking element of urban housing solutions. And their lenders (especially in this region) are key opponents to any such mixing of commercial into a residential plan.

loftguy wrote:

Demosthenes wrote:

KCPowercat wrote:Not talking anything big but yeah its what 4-5 blocks to Broadway? Just a coffee shop or small eatery would be nice up there I bet.

Yea I agree, a shop or two would be nice to mix in. Maybe even more. If you have to go at least 4 blocks just reach any commercial, you could argue that the area is not even really urban. I mean this neighborhood is in the downtown loop.

A serious suggestion. Find a way to communicate this to the developer, in writing. It's called guerilla lobbying. Some development entities are oblivious to the placemaking element of urban housing solutions. And their lenders (especially in this region) are key opponents to any such mixing of commercial into a residential plan.

I tried to do this when we met with the developer. His response was essentially that he put some commercial space in the first rehab he did in downtown Indianapolis 20 years ago and it didn't take off. Therefore: single-use. Which isn't to say his mind couldn't be changed, but it will take a touch of effort.

i think we'd all be better off focusing retail development on broadway, where at sliver of it already exists. start with downtown council and DST realty.

DaveKCMO wrote:i think we'd all be better off focusing retail development on broadway, where at sliver of it already exists. start with downtown council and DST realty.

Agreed in a larger sense, but I'm talking a corner coffeeshop or cafe. It's the kind of thing that will make that area more lively and interesting instead of a deadzone that happens to have people sleeping in it.

smh wrote:

DaveKCMO wrote:i think we'd all be better off focusing retail development on broadway, where at sliver of it already exists. start with downtown council and DST realty.

Agreed in a larger sense, but I'm talking a corner coffeeshop or cafe. It's the kind of thing that will make that area more lively and interesting instead of a deadzone that happens to have people sleeping in it.

Agreed. Nothing huge or complete line of ground level retail. That should be focused on Broadway as Dave suggests.

smh wrote: I tried to do this when we met with the developer. His response was essentially that he put some commercial space in the first rehab he did in downtown Indianapolis 20 years ago and it didn't take off. Therefore: single-use. Which isn't to say his mind couldn't be changed, but it will take a touch of effort.

Do they not realize that times have changed quite a lot in those 20 years? Those were dark times for downtown development.

Demosthenes wrote:

smh wrote: I tried to do this when we met with the developer. His response was essentially that he put some commercial space in the first rehab he did in downtown Indianapolis 20 years ago and it didn't take off. Therefore: single-use. Which isn't to say his mind couldn't be changed, but it will take a touch of effort.

Do they not realize that times have changed quite a lot in those 20 years? Those were dark times for downtown development.

Precisely.

The latest City Plan Commission with Staff Reports document available at the KCMO Data site has much more detailed plans for this site. I don't have the time to extract all of the information from this PDF but here is the link: City Plan Commission with Staff Reports. This file is 170+ MB, so it takes forever to download. Start on page 337 for this development.

KCDowntown

Downtown Development Map

Demosthenes wrote:

smh wrote: I tried to do this when we met with the developer. His response was essentially that he put some commercial space in the first rehab he did in downtown Indianapolis 20 years ago and it didn't take off. Therefore: single-use. Which isn't to say his mind couldn't be changed, but it will take a touch of effort.

Do they not realize that times have changed quite a lot in those 20 years? Those were dark times for downtown development.

Not exactly. There was a lot going on and it was exciting and fun, though a relatively private playground for the folks who were clued in.

1968-1983 was the dark age. (people leaving properties for good and turning out the lights)

Loftguy, since the historic tax credit program in Missouri didn't start until 1998, what motivated private developers to do historic renovations? Was it just the federal tax credits (which started in 1976)? Did just the federal historic tax credits motivate developers alone?

And, did the renovation movement really take off after Missouri started the tax credits for historic redevelopment?

Insanity and desperation crossed paths, Fang.

The federal credits were a bit of help, but initially they were so restrictive and unreliable that their use was questionable.

Downtown KC had millions of square feet of empty buildings. Owners were frantic to find relief from carrying costs, insurance, taxes, utilities, maybe some upkeep. They were willing to take huge risks in contributing the property toward a development, to sell them at amazing low prices, or to try to give them away (often unsuccessfully).

Enter in the insane..... there a few hardy bands of entrepreneurs who stepped in to tackle redevelopment of some of these sorry relics. And there was a lending group headed by Frank Morgan and Sherman Dreiseszen, who were willing to bank on character, vision, a good plan and by instilling the 'fear of Frank'.

The main reason these early projects found success, was low cost matching pockets of the community desiring something that was not 'normal'.

In response to the DNA's objections, the CPC today directed the developer to make it more pedestrian friendly and responsive to Case Park.