Jan 9, 2007 Tenant Announcement

[chrizow]

but I was under the impression that the retail in P+L was going to be a little more upscale then discount menswear.

yeah.  let's see:  Chipotle, Lucky Strike, Famous Dave's, Jos A Bank...Kate Spade.  nope! 

[beautyfromashes]

true but when they boast 30 percent locals it would be reasonable to assume a bbq local in the bbq capital

This is like putting a Joe's Crab Shack in Baltimore's inner harbor.  Pure ignorance!  Why would they want to insult the city like that?  

[Highlander]

absolutely, but i think it's understandable that Famous Dave's would elicit some groans.

i think most of us are resigned to the fact the P+L will be chains...but it would be nice to have some that distinguish P+L from, say, Village West.  other than simple neighborhood eateries like Chipotle, i would think it would be possible to make the entire district exclusive.  

it'll be fine though.  Mosaic, "Vin," Gimme Sum, etc. will be more or less exclusive - at least initially.

there are two menswear stores downtown - Michaels and another one i cant remember.  

Ordinarily I would not think that Famous Daves would last a month but last time I was out at the Legends, the place was packed.   To me, its kind of like going to the grocery store and buying Krafts BBQ sauce.....Why???

I really expected HRC to be in this announcement.  Although I am no real fan of HRC, it is for better or worse, kind of an applause-O-meter for one's city.  Those cities that have one are regarded as  "happening" and those that do not are just "wanna-be's".    

[scooterj]

Wow, it will be awesome that out-of-towners will visit Kansas City, the BBQ Mecca and get to try some authentic Famous Dave's St. Louis style BBQ based in Minneapolis, MN!

When I was in Minneapolis last summer I asked a bartender to recommend someplace for dinner.   She said "Famous Da... oh wait, you're from Kansas City.  Never mind, you have much better than that back home."

[Joe KC]

yeah.  let's see:  Chipotle, Lucky Strike, Famous Dave's, Jos A Bank...Kate Spade.  nope!   :lol:

In fact, a Cordish guy told me that the retail part was going to be "what the Plaza used to be" -- i.e., upscale boutiques.  I was thinking Kate Spade, Burberry, etc.  Instead, the first retailer they roll out is Jos A Bank.  Wa-Wa-Waaaaaaaaaaa:

[kard]

Not to sound like a jerk here, but Famous Dave's has stepped up and put their money down where Gates and others would not.  I wish it were Bryant's but looks like they and the other KC institutions feel they're fine where they are.

[chrizow]

well, i understand Cordish is putting a lot of money into this and wants a return, but Gates (and Bryants?) were interested in the P+L but the rents were too high.  it seems to me that having a KC icon in there like Gates would be worth reduced rent, but of course this idea requires thinking about something other than the bottom line.

[LenexatoKCMO]

This is like putting a Joe's Crab Shack in Baltimore's inner harbor.  Pure ignorance!  Why would they want to insult the city like that?  

Because this nation is filled with plenty of dipshits that would happily go to Joe's Crab Shack while visiting the Inner Harbor and go home and brag about the great Baltimore seafood dinner they had on their trip - despite the fact that the crabs were probably flown in frozen from taiwan instead of the delicious chesapeake blues swimming outside in the harbor.  Just be prepaired for the fact that there will inevitably be plenty of folks that head back to Omaha raving to their neighbors about the great BBQ they had in KC at Famous Daves.  Welcome to America! - those of us who give a shit about unique local flavor are a tiny minority.  

[scooterj]

well, i understand Cordish is putting a lot of money into this and wants a return, but Gates (and Bryants?) were interested in the P+L but the rents were too high.  it seems to me that having a KC icon in there like Gates would be worth reduced rent, but of course this idea requires thinking about something other than the bottom line.

I bet what ends up happening is once this is up and running, you see the local places (Bryants, Gates, whatever) start setting up shop in vacant storefronts right outside the official P&L boundaries.

[bahua]

Forced development = out of town indistinct businesses. The P&L needs to be accepted for being that, because it's not real. It's not natural. It's a planned area, to the point that they even refer to it with the clinically cold "district." That's one step up on the warmth scale from "prospekt."

That said, I'm totally pumped. It's going to be awesome.

[beautyfromashes]

I thought Cordish was smart before this move.  I'm all for rebuilding the city, but, if that means building it so it looks like every other city, then I'll pass.

[bahua]

I bet what ends up happening is once this is up and running, you see the local places (Bryants, Gates, whatever) start setting up shop in vacant storefronts right outside the official P&L boundaries.

Exactly.

[chrizow]

I bet what ends up happening is once this is up and running, you see the local places (Bryants, Gates, whatever) start setting up shop in vacant storefronts right outside the official P&L boundaries.

this prospect is the main thing that excites me about the P+L.  

That said, I'm totally pumped. It's going to be awesome.

really?  

[kcmetro]

Here we were, all about to nut in our pants, and they give us Famous Daves.  :lol:

[Joe KC]

this prospect is the main thing that excites me about the P+L.  

Agreed, but I think the theatre will be a great addition, and I also think that Lucky Strike could be fun depending on the clientele.  I really could care less about the food they get (I am happy with my current "rotation").  I want destination-type retail - that is missing from downtown.  We already have great restaurants and great bars!

[lock+load]

Not to pick nits, but there are shirt + tie places downtown - Slobotsky & Sons, Michael's - Hall's if you use the MODESA definition of downtown. 

I am not crazy about the restaurants (esp. Famous Dave's - wtf), but I was under the impression that the retail in P+L was going to be a little more upscale then discount menswear.

The loop.  Not sure where Slobotsky is, but Michael's isn't in the loop.

As for the rest of the announcement....I'm not sure why a big deal was made about announcing these five tenants.  They do not create excitement.  Famous Dave's would be better buried in an announcement of 15 tenants.  Don't hold a press conference unless you have something truly exciting or unique to announce.

[KCMax]

I bet what ends up happening is once this is up and running, you see the local places (Bryants, Gates, whatever) start setting up shop in vacant storefronts right outside the official P&L boundaries.

I agree. My hope is that we see a ton of local places filling up the Crossroads and creating density. That's where the locals are going to hang out.

I expected national chains for the P&L. And I even warned about getting bummed about national chains. But Famous Dave's?!!??!?!? I'd rather have an Applebee's.

[bahua]

I still can't believe anyone was surprised with Famous Dave's. What do you expect from an out-of-town developer charging premium rents? I honestly thought it had already been announced.

I definitely think it's going to be awesome. This will bring more people downtown. Residents. With residents come local flavor. It just won't be in the P&L, and that's fine.

[jimb]

When they built the Tony Roma's Ribs on 119th in Leawood, I was very pleased to see the place didn't last much over 6 months.  I would hope the same for Famous Dave's, but the apparent success at VW is disheartening.

Face it - chains are everything these days, especially in the high rent locations.  Every American city looks like every other American city (or small town, or highway interchange - you get the idea).  When you are travelling, you have to work at it to find something unique and local.  We've got plenty of that in KC - hopefully more to come.  People who are interested in the local flavor will expend the effort to find it - I've never found it to be that hard.  People who want the familiar will find that as well.

[kcmetro]

The loop.  Not sure where Slobotsky is, but Michael's isn't in the loop.

As for the rest of the announcement....I'm not sure why a big deal was made about announcing these five tenants.  They do not create excitement.  Famous Dave's would be better buried in an announcement of 15 tenants.  Don't hold a press conference unless you have something truly exciting or unique to announce.

Yeah, it was very surprising those were the only tenants announced. I already knew about Gordon Biersch and the others seemed like fillers, besides Mosaic.