KCRag Forum

Completed in 2005.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0377993 ... 384!8i8192

Completed in 2004.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.039953 ... 384!8i8192

Completed in 2008.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.166674 ... 312!8i6656

Completed in 2018.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0886482 ... 384!8i8192

Kansas City has never been ever to afford anything but all-glass buildings.

Karambit25 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 08, 2022 7:35 pm I find it strange that people can't see the glass wall similarity as a negative. Their south facing walls are nearly identical. Because our skyline is short these buildings cover the density of what's behind them. That density used to be one of the things that made our short skyline unique. From the south these buildings will BECOME the new skyline. Why can't the glass color be different? What's wrong with that? If 4 is not radically different I see it as a negative. It's not my $$ and Cordish can do what they want but come on man, do the skyline a solid and get creative on 4's design.

I agree with you and earthling:

GRID wrote: ↑Fri Apr 08, 2022 1:48 pm
Totally Agree. I think 3 Light might be okay so long as they change up 4 Light. If they build another similar building at 4 Light's location, it will look absolutely terrible. Especially from the south. And considering that those three buildings will literally block the entire CBD skyline from view from anybody at street level throughout much of the Crossroads, it will be looked on later as a pretty big urban design fail.

I guess some other developers can always erect taller buildings south of 16th Street that will block the Cordish buildings on the skyline. Something dazzling and markedly different.

To the block the skyline view point here is a current example

1500 Grand Blvd
https://maps.app.goo.gl/uxZyC5CuWkfBHC1r9

That said skylines aren't for ground level viewing in any city

FangKC wrote: ↑Sat Apr 09, 2022 2:27 am I guess some other developers can always erect taller buildings south of 16th Street that will block the Cordish buildings on the skyline. Something dazzling and markedly different.

^The capped freeway though may become a centerpoint park for downtown and have communist bloc housing as its view, especially if Cordish uses approximately same external materials for the Sky project across park.

KCPowercat wrote: ↑Sat Apr 09, 2022 8:33 am
That said skylines aren't for ground level viewing in any city

This is the point. It doesnt make any sense to say “the skyline is blocked from the xroads.” That just means there is a bunch of empty space between the two. I thought the whole point was to fill in with dense stuff. ANY building would block those views.

You all sound like you’re lobbying for a downtown loop bowl restriction like the plaza?

What ever building number goes next to Two Light will likely feature similar glass but will be the most unique shape and design yet. Mainly because it has a unique footprint to work with. I’m guessing that building will be 5 or 6.

4L will end up looking similar to One Light due to its footprint if it goes in at 14th and Main.

Calling these designs communist bloc housing is insulting to those who have worked on various aspects of the design process. As is calling deliberate decisions you don’t agree with “lazy”. Trust me, there’s not a single lazy person involved in these buildings. Decisions are made for various reasons but laziness isn’t one of them.

And for the record, I’m not in love with the final version of 2L. Early designs featured a unique parapet at the top which gave it a less squatty and bulky look. I fought to keep but the early designs were about 12% over budget.

DColeKC wrote: ↑Sat Apr 09, 2022 9:33 am Calling these designs communist bloc housing is insulting to those who have worked on various aspects of the design process.

Yes, that is somewhat intended given it's pretty much the same exterior across all Cordish cities over many years. The interiors are wonderful. Simply change up the exterior patterns/materials every couple years across all cities to avoid the warranted criticism. You'll still get economies of scale and the risk of creating communist bloc housing is taken out of the equation.

Hoping to see Cordish involved with downtown stadium!

earthling wrote: ↑Sat Apr 09, 2022 9:56 am

DColeKC wrote: ↑Sat Apr 09, 2022 9:33 am Calling these designs communist bloc housing is insulting to those who have worked on various aspects of the design process.

Yes, that is somewhat intended given it's pretty much the same exterior across all Cordish cities over many years. Simply change up the patterns/materials every couple years across all cities to avoid the warranted criticism. You'll still get economies of scale.

Hoping to see Cordish involved with downtown stadium!

This is like saying GMC keeps making cars that look like they’re made by GMC. There are certainly subtle differences between models but there’s no mistaking it’s still a GMC. The differences some people would like to see is equivalent to a GMC, FORD and Nissan sitting next to each other.

Basically, there are design differences between all the buildings but they’re on brand and not as different as some would like to see. I don’t know where personal opinions about a building one doesn’t intend to live in stops and the development communities criticism starts.

^No, not at all the same. GMC isn't creating a row of permanent buildings that lasts for 80-100+ years. And even so, GMC changes up their platform every couple years yet still gets economies of scale.

If Cordish influences pretty much same outer materials/appearance for Sky building across cap, a wonderful name for the cap park could be Cordish Communist Bloc Park, it would be so on brand.

How is it that Flaherty Collins can afford completely different high rises in each city? Or Copaken/Altus?

The designs of the Cordish towers do vary but only when it comes to facing P&L. The Main Street theatre site is no exception

You guys worry too much about the glass when we should be worried about getting retail facing the 670 deck to create an amazing park. Imagine like an ice cream shop or something.

KCPowercat wrote: ↑Sat Apr 09, 2022 8:33 am To the block the skyline view point here is a current example

1500 Grand Blvd
https://maps.app.goo.gl/uxZyC5CuWkfBHC1r9

That said skylines aren't for ground level viewing in any city

It's not about blocking the skyline, it's about only being able to see buildings that all look nearly the same because you are blocking all the diverse buildings behind them.

I'm just responding to the comment that said it will block the skyline. Any city with any density has buildings blocked at street level by other buildings. Seems like a good problem to have. I'm all for variety in these Light building designs but this is getting to be a lot of nit picking reasons.

KCPowercat wrote: ↑Sat Apr 09, 2022 2:14 pm I'm just responding to the comment that said it will block the skyline. Any city with any density has buildings blocked at street level by other buildings. Seems like a good problem to have. I'm all for variety in these Light building designs but this is getting to be a lot of nit picking reasons.

For the most part yeah I suppose. Hopefully the south side of 670 develops with new buildings and then it won't really matter.

earthling wrote: ↑Sat Apr 09, 2022 11:14 am ^No, not at all the same. GMC isn't creating a row of permanent buildings that lasts for 80-100+ years. And even so, GMC changes up their platform every couple years yet still gets economies of scale.

If Cordish influences pretty much same outer materials/appearance for Sky building across cap, a wonderful name for the cap park could be Cordish Communist Bloc Park, it would be so on brand.

Good idea on park naming. Has a ring to it.

The glass isn’t even the same glass from building to building so there was no economic benefit of going with similar materials. These buildings are bid years apart from each other and don’t often feature overlapping materials. Especially exterior. There can be some savings going with one appliance manufacturer for interiors and perhaps some electronic equipment. But no one bulk bought thousands of panes of glass in anticipation of multiple projects.

The sky buildings in Crossroads won’t be apart of the “light” series. They won’t look anything like the light buildings.

normalthings wrote: ↑Sat Apr 09, 2022 11:46 am How is it that Flaherty Collins can afford completely different high rises in each city? Or Copaken/Altus?

The designs of the Cordish towers do vary but only when it comes to facing P&L. The Main Street theatre site is no exception

Because they’re building mostly one off, low and mid rise buildings. It’s 1000 times easier and affordable to make smaller buildings design forward.

DColeKC wrote: ↑Sat Apr 09, 2022 3:03 pm

normalthings wrote: ↑Sat Apr 09, 2022 11:46 am How is it that Flaherty Collins can afford completely different high rises in each city? Or Copaken/Altus?

The designs of the Cordish towers do vary but only when it comes to facing P&L. The Main Street theatre site is no exception

Because they’re building mostly one off, low and mid rise buildings. It’s 1000 times easier and affordable to make smaller buildings design forward.

Flaherty has 28 floor building in Indy...


And completely different one, 34 floors in Columbus, same developer.