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Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 8:25 pm
by Chris Stritzel
Interesting to see in Lauren Arthur's tweet a mention of $5 million for flights to Europe from the airport.
https://twitter.com/SenLaurenArthur/sta ... 4659331072
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 8:44 pm
by Cratedigger
What exactly does that mean? Missouri is subsidizing those flights?
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 8:48 pm
by Chris Stritzel
freedog wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 8:44 pm
What exactly does that mean? Missouri is subsidizing those flights?
Correct. Was included in the state budget.
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 8:50 pm
by normalthings
freedog wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 8:44 pm
What exactly does that mean? Missouri is subsidizing those flights?
Wow. $5 million is how much St. Louis put up for their 3/weekly Lufthansa deal.
St. Louis
$2.5 million from Port Authority
$2.5 million from Local Business
$500K waived landing fees
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 8:51 pm
by normalthings
freedog wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 8:44 pm
What exactly does that mean? Missouri is subsidizing those flights?
Airlines usually ask for marketing, landing fees waivers, revenue guarantees, etc
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 8:54 pm
by Chris Stritzel
normalthings wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 8:50 pm
freedog wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 8:44 pm
What exactly does that mean? Missouri is subsidizing those flights?
Wow. $5 million is how much St. Louis put up for their Lufthansa deal.
Word from JShank on UrbanSTL (the forum's airport aficionado) says that the inaugural flight to Frankfurt from St. Lousi is "sold out" according to the airport commission. I imagine if numbers hold up, they'll add more flights. It makes sense for KC to land some flights to Europe, just maybe to somewhere like Paris, London, or maybe even Barcelona.
jshank83:
Via airport commish meeting
Inaugural outbound LH flight is sold out. (you can still buy tickets so maybe they meant expected to be sold out?)
Inbound is booked to 170, which is much higher than I expected.
Said that STL is one of the better booking stations so far.
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 1:43 am
by Anthony_Hugo98
A transatlantic is a no brainer with the new terminal. The lounges alone lead me to believe it’ll happen sooner rather than later
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 2:20 pm
by normalthings
It’s now only a question of who/where. We have more funds available than IND or STL used to buy flights
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 3:15 pm
by Anthony_Hugo98
normalthings wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 2:20 pm
It’s now only a question of who/where. We have more funds available than IND or STL used to buy flights
We’re still the largest direct market unserved by international if I’m not mistaken; however we have a fairly mid tier catchment area. Regardless a true transatlantic is in our future methinks
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 4:21 pm
by WoodDraw
With that much money, they have to go after Delta/af/KLM. Launch it with the new lounge. I'll book now
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 4:24 pm
by Anthony_Hugo98
WoodDraw wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 4:21 pm
With that much money, they have to go after Delta/af/KLM. Launch it with the new lounge. I'll book now
Agreed. My bet would be Amsterdam or Paris.
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 4:47 pm
by WoodDraw
Doesn't American still have a shortage of widebodies? I don't see ba coming in.
I really hope it's one of the big ones and not a narrow body.
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 5:02 pm
by normalthings
WoodDraw wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 4:47 pm
Doesn't American still have a shortage of widebodies? I don't see ba coming in.
I really hope it's one of the big ones and not a narrow body.
BA wants to add another US city but is slot restricted in London. They requested additional slots to serve IND this summer but the request was denied. We are likely competing with IND for LHR service.
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 5:07 pm
by WoodDraw
normalthings wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 5:02 pm
WoodDraw wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 4:47 pm
Doesn't American still have a shortage of widebodies? I don't see ba coming in.
I really hope it's one of the big ones and not a narrow body.
BA wants to add another US city but is slot restricted in London. They requested additional slots to serve IND this summer but the request was denied. We are likely competing with IND for LHR service.
Yeah my thought was that would be a huge slot for ba to use on kci.
I'm also super biased because I prefer Schengen access and not the UK.
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 5:50 pm
by trexel94
Hi all, new here!! also trexel94 from Airliners.net and Loschner94 from Urbanstl.
About time KC got serious with landing TATL. Quite astounding the state is willing to front $5 million and should be plenty for a full service carrier (or 2). Is this in addition to the existing $1.2 million that's largely comprised of local/private money?
If KC is to land a TATL, does the airport have a kitchen? When Icelandair flew the meals in first class had to be provided by a local restaurant.
For those suggesting DL, not so fast. Justin Meyer and I had a call last year and while tight lipped about potential service overall, he refused to comment on DL launching a long haul route but did state that RDU and CVG etc could be added. Not saying impossible but hardly a given. Reading between the lines, BA and Icelandair (pov) appear to be our best bet as LHR is the most popular route. Justin is a friend of mine and I intend to reach out to him about the incentives package this coming Monday. Does anyone here have any questions they'd like me to ask him?
Lastly, it should be noted that this package doesn't automatically mean it all goes to European service. From a (somewhat dated) publication in 2014, Central America/Caribbean and Asia were faster growing than Europe so flights to MEX, GDL and SJU could work as well. Whatever the case, I just hope we don't splurge the entire package on one airline. Imagine spending $5 million only to end up with the likes of Aer Lingus or Icelandair again.
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 7:36 pm
by normalthings
Indianapolis paid $5.5 million for 5-6 weekly to Paris. STL is paying $5 million for 3 weekly to Frankfurt.
We are going to have to pay around that
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Sun May 08, 2022 7:08 am
by hartliss
trexel94 wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 5:50 pm
Hi all, new here!! also trexel94 from Airliners.net and Loschner94 from Urbanstl.
About time KC got serious with landing TATL. Quite astounding the state is willing to front $5 million and should be plenty for a full service carrier (or 2). Is this in addition to the existing $1.2 million that's largely comprised of local/private money?
If KC is to land a TATL, does the airport have a kitchen? When Icelandair flew the meals in first class had to be provided by a local restaurant.
For those suggesting DL, not so fast. Justin Meyer and I had a call last year and while tight lipped about potential service overall, he refused to comment on DL launching a long haul route but did state that RDU and CVG etc could be added. Not saying impossible but hardly a given. Reading between the lines, BA and Icelandair (pov) appear to be our best bet as LHR is the most popular route. Justin is a friend of mine and I intend to reach out to him about the incentives package this coming Monday. Does anyone here have any questions they'd like me to ask him?
Lastly, it should be noted that this package doesn't automatically mean it all goes to European service. From a (somewhat dated) publication in 2014, Central America/Caribbean and Asia were faster growing than Europe so flights to MEX, GDL and SJU could work as well. Whatever the case, I just hope we don't splurge the entire package on one airline. Imagine spending $5 million only to end up with the likes of Aer Lingus or Icelandair again.
Hi trexel, I see you on a.net as well! I, too, pester Justin about this stuff as well - lol. He probably thinks I'm an aviation stalker but have had the opportunity to meet him once.
I would be curious about the incentive packages as well. I think you also posted about early bookings on B6 so would be curious to see how he feels the routes are performing.
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Sun May 08, 2022 9:48 am
by WoodDraw
Personally I don't consider Iceland to be a service that justifies $5 million+ in incentives. Aer Lingus has a better network than I expected, but it Isn't ba, KLM, air France level.
Really needs to be part of a big network to justify that fee. At kci that means skyteam or oneworld.
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Sun May 08, 2022 9:52 am
by WoodDraw
Also, Justin Meyer is a super nice guy and any information he can share is great. But anything specific he knows will certainly be under nda so let's not all pester him too much.
I'd ike to see the specific legislative language if anyone has it.
Re: KCI Flight Schedule Adjustments
Posted: Sun May 08, 2022 1:46 pm
by langosta
Portland has 15 weekly flights to Europe on 4 airlines while KC has none.
https://simpleflying.com/portland-welco ... -recovery/
