Union Station

[rxlexi]

Denver's Union Station renovation is amazing, but honestly I'm far more impressed with what they've done with DIA. Regional cooperation on land to get it built, big vision, midcontinent hub, new LRT connection, giant new hotel that we'd kill for downtown.

Certainly DIA has had far greater implications for the growth of the metro and it's rising status than Union Station/FasTracks, as well-executed as that project has been.

[AlbertHammond]

Denver's Union Station renovation is amazing

I visited Denver's Union Station last week and all the associated transit nearby. They really have something to be proud of. Our Union Station is nice, but suffers a bit as an island. I rode into our Union Station as an Amtrak rider earlier this year and felt like a back-door loser as I came into the building. That is not how one enters a great building in a great city.

[loftguy]

Denver's Union Station renovation is amazing

I visited Denver's Union Station last week and all the associated transit nearby. They really have something to be proud of. Our Union Station is nice, but suffers a bit as an island. I rode into our Union Station as an Amtrak rider earlier this year and felt like a back-door loser as I came into the building. That is not how one enters a great building in a great city.

Yesterday in the Denver Post.....

http://www.denverpost.com/business/ci_2 ... en-30-year

....hate Denver. Hate it.

[FangKC]

When said I thought Union Station might become a transit hub again, I was talking more intermodal than a rail station. The building complex would serve as a place for people to access Amtrak, as well as access the streetcar and KCATA, and the Greyhound/Jefferson bus lines. In addition, a taxi cab station, and people might rent cars, bikes, and scooters there.

As for as a commuter train route goes, there might be some flexibility with the trench situation on the stretch between Truman Road and Union Station. There appears to be a former right-of-above the trench on the north side that used to service warehouses. It's not in the trench itself, but up above it. You can barely make it out now on Google Aerial. If engineers could reclaim that rail spur for one line of track, it might avoid the need to expand the trench for one direction of travel. One might need to rework some street bridges to accommodate this.

The south side of the trench is more problematic. However, there are even stretches on the south side that appear to have room for another new track going in the opposite direction. That is assuming you can realign some of the existing track to the north side in areas where there appears to be additional room.

Sure there do appear to be parts of the trench that will need to be widened, but not the entire trench.

[KCroots]

When said I thought Union Station might become a transit hub again, I was talking more intermodal than a rail station.

That's what I also meant too. I would never try to convince myself that Union Station could ever return to its glory simply with only rial service. A true transit center where many forms of transportation come together, yes that could and would work out well if properly executed.

[flyingember]

When said I thought Union Station might become a transit hub again, I was talking more intermodal than a rail station.

That's what I also meant too. I would never try to convince myself that Union Station could ever return to its glory simply with only rial service. A true transit center where many forms of transportation come together, yes that could and would work out well if properly executed.

let's see.

Bike Share
streetcar
Jo
KCATA
Amtrak

that's five systems already right there

I would say that the major holes would be to move megabus and add commuter rail.

[KCroots]

let's see.

Bike Share
streetcar
Jo
KCATA
Amtrak

that's five systems already right there

I would say that the major holes would be to move megabus and add commuter rail.

Yes I agree and even setting aside room and planning for a future long distance high speed rail line would be neat. I think a rail line from KC to Dallas that connects to Houston and then goes to Mexico and south will one day be a reality. You know the super north American Highway system and this being the rail part of it.

I also see one day Union Station being the hub where light rail from all the metropolitan area converge. As mentioned before a line directly to the airport wherever the new airport will be.

not sure Bikeshare is going to add all that much to the numbers but anything is better than nothing.

Another option to get people to go to Union Station would be to house some sort of government office there where people were required to go there for a particular program or need. For example if the building and planning or zoning office or any such department opened a small annex there where it was the office of initial contact for developers then it would create a little more traffic as well and at least help the businesses and restaurants already inside. Just thinking aloud really

[chaglang]

The physical limitations of getting trains through the trench and into Union Station will always be the major hurdle to creating a rail hub there.

[FangKC]

Moving the Greyhound / Jefferson Lines bus terminal to the area around Union Station would help a lot. Perhaps if the post office handling facility ever moves out of the old freight house, that could be the bus station.

There already is an IRS advocate service office at 333 West Pershing, across from Union Station in the former Post Office Building, and a Taxpayer Assistance office inside Union Station.

Among the other tenants of Union Station are the Greater Kansas City Chamber of Commerce, The National Archives, Kansas City Election Board, the US Post Office, The International Visitors Council of Greater Kansas City, Kansas City Area Development Council, The Kansas City Life Sciences Institute. KC Smartport, World Trade Center Kansas City, KC STEM Alliance, Entertainment Properties Trust, the Kansas City Ballet, and the Convention and Visitors Bureau of Greater Kansas City.

The Federal General Services Administration, which provides space for many federal agenices, is moving into the Pershing Square building next to Union Station on Main.

I think the last thing I read is that all the office space inside Union Station is fully rented out now.

[beautyfromashes]

I just don't understand why they made it so you can arrive and depart on Amtrak at Union Station and never even step foot in the grand hall. You have to find a way to get people walking through that area to make it have the energy that it was built to have.

[shinatoo]

I just don't understand why they made it so you can arrive and depart on Amtrak at Union Station and never even step foot in the grand hall. You have to find a way to get people walking through that area to make it have the energy that it was built to have.

The Grand Hall is often closed off for events like Makers Fair.

[beautyfromashes]

The Grand Hall is often closed off for events like Makers Fair.

The Grand Hall should not be a ballroom for rent.

[longviewmo]

The Grand Hall is often closed off for events like Makers Fair.

The Grand Hall should not be a ballroom for rent.

So it should just be empty? Until there's enough transit going through there to justify the need to use it for moving people, it makes more sense to use it for events that bring thousands to Union Station.

[flyingember]

The Grand Hall is often closed off for events like Makers Fair.

The Grand Hall should not be a ballroom for rent.

why not?

if you want to hold two ballroom-type events at the same time (say Bartle's is taken) where does the second event go?

Overland Park?

The Grand Hall is way underutilized as a space except during big events. it's a tough space to make work for anything except a large waiting room with thousands of people in it

[beautyfromashes]

It's underutilized partly because it's rented out. It can't be a connection between Freighthouse/Crossroads and Crown Center because many times it's roped off for an event. It should be open all the time and they should redevelop the space on the west instead of a gift shop and open up the east side to give reasons to be in the Hall. Right now it's a big cave that very few people experience.

[flyingember]

It's underutilized partly because it's rented out. It can't be a connection between Freighthouse/Crossroads and Crown Center because many times it's roped off for an event. It should be open all the time and they should redevelop the space on the west instead of a gift shop and open up the east side to give reasons to be in the Hall. Right now it's a big cave that very few people experience.

the freighthouse connection is blocked by the science toy store, not the hall events

it would have a dedicated path without this shop. there's some exhibits but they leave the path free along them

there already is a gift shop between a combination of that store and the train-focused store

the east side behind the hall is primarily blocked by the restrooms

[rxlexi]

Albert Hammond and Beautyfromashes, I disagree somewhat re: the percieved "dignity" of Amtrak access at Union Station. When I have taken Amtrak in/out of US, I have been dropped off at the front entrance, walked through the Main Hall to the Amtrak space, admiring the beauty of the station, and then walked down the nice covered path to the north train platforms, enjoying a great skyline view at the end of the elevated platform. While it would certainly be preferable to board trains immediately from the main structure (i.e. not walk the length of the building outside), I think the solution used is relatively elegant, considering the low-volume of traffic.

Enjoying a coffee at Parisi one will often see folks arriving via Amtrak, wheeling bags across the main hall in Union Station, marvelling at the space while utilizing it as a functioning rail hub. Again, given the low-volume of Amtrak travel, I think it is nonetheless given a rather visible and prominent treatment in the building.

Secondly, Loftguy thank you for the Denver Post article; a very informative and detailed look at Denver's rise from a true KC peer to one of America's urban darlings. We have a long way to go to catch up, but I think looking at Denver and also Minneapolis provides an excellent blueprint, particularly as it applies to regional cooperation and infrastructure investment in Denver.

[beautyfromashes]

^^^
There shouldn't even be a covered walkway. You should walk through the Grand Hall to the trains. And, the gift shop shouldn't be there. There should be a nice restaurant that brings walking traffic and noise to fill the Hall. You have to get more people in the Hall, otherwise it doesn't feel alive. It feels like a museum. Get people moving through to trains and the Crossroads and mingling after dinner and having drinks.... something, all of it. Right now it's a waste.

[FangKC]

Beautyfromashes, I think you under-estimate the volume of people moving through Union Station because of Amtrak.

[beautyfromashes]

Beautyfromashes, I think you under-estimate the volume of people moving through Union Station because of Amtrak.

No, I understand it's probably 100 people, twice a day at most. But, that would probably double the number that visit the Great Hall now. But, you have to start someone. Add 100 to 100 to 100.... A space so beautiful shouldn't make you sad when you walk in and realize that no one is seeing it.