KCRag Forum

DaveKCMO wrote:They are NOT moving quickly. The project started in January 2013.

I was more thinking of the RFP. That's a little over a month.

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pash wrote:So I thought Delaware was getting converted to two-way traffic. But now that the rails and the new back-in parking is striped, that's obviously not happening. Right?

I probably would have preferred a two-way street with one lane of parallel parking rather than the new configuration, but I don't really care. Just thought I had heard repeatedly that Delaware was going two-way. ...

The plan all along has been to move the track to the SB side of the street so that the street is "future proofed" should it eventually be converted to two-way. Two-way conversion at this time was not part of that discussion.

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Abatements hammered out for 2nd and Delaware project.

http://tinyurl.com/ouwg97w

pash wrote:Ah, I see. Good luck ever getting rid of (half of) those enormous back-in parking spots to put in a north-bound traffic lane!

I would argue this is the easiest two blocks in the city to remove parking entirely.

flyingember wrote:

pash wrote:Ah, I see. Good luck ever getting rid of (half of) those enormous back-in parking spots to put in a north-bound traffic lane!

I would argue this is the easiest two blocks in the city to remove parking entirely.

Possibly the easiest 2 blocks in the city to remove the road entirely.

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We're only getting a sharrow on EB Third Street because of angst over parking loss.

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Yes - what's the deal with the south side of Third behind the Market? That "sidewalk" is basically impassable with people parked behind the building. I can't count how many times I've had to walk in the street there.

Eon Blue wrote:Yes - what's the deal with the south side of Third behind the Market? That "sidewalk" is basically impassable with people parked behind the building. I can't count how many times I've had to walk in the street there.

That is not a sidewalk. It is loading docks and a parking lot. And ultimately the fact that vehicles pull out from this block of docks and parking is what caused a sharrow to replace the plan for a dedicated east bound bike lane on the south side of 3rd street.

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pash wrote:Can we just say it? The 1940s market buildings, and especially the way they address the surrounding neighborhood, are relics of a previous age, and they're starting to keep the River Market from being as good as it could be.

"It's not a sidewalk, it's a loading dock"—right, and that's a huge problem. Two sides of the City Market are loading blocks. Two linear blocks of city streets right in the middle of one of the city's most bustling neighborhoods are dedicated to unloading trucks! (But let's be clear, the Third Street side is effectively a parking lot, with vehicles always parked there but actual loading and unloading a rare sight. Main Street, of course, is primarily a parking lot with a loading dock attached.) Meanwhile, the interior of the market is mostly a parking lot, and the shops are so disconnected from the neighborhood that merchants don't even want to stay open on weekday evenings.

Opening up Walnut to through traffic isn't going to fix much. We need a new City Market.

I disagree. If I wanted everything new and perfect, I would choose 117th and Roe.

Edit: And I have to add that the reason the City Market vendors have not been open at night is twofold. The opportunity has not been real. Lack of households and visitors did not provide sufficient numbers to make general evening operation viable by nine restaurants in this neighborhood. This... coupled with the fact that these are mostly owner-operated restaurants and these small operators have not wanted to work twelve hours x seven days and their business model/acumen has not to this point provided an alternative.

pash wrote:Meanwhile, the interior of the market is mostly a parking lot...

I was a little shocked that last Saturday--with the amazing crowd-drawing weather--that the interior was still open to parking. The experience of unsuspecting motorists nosing their way through the crowds was pleasant for nobody.

Just breaking up the huge swathes of concrete/parking lot would go a long ways in making the market feel more comfortable. Cobblestone, pavers...anything else over the monotony of poured concrete.

loftguy wrote:Edit: And I have to add that the reason the City Market vendors have not been open at night is twofold. The opportunity has not been real. Lack of households and visitors did not provide sufficient numbers to make general evening operation viable by nine restaurants in this neighborhood.

This is one of the reasons the low density of the Columbus Park redevelopment is so frustrating to me. We have several cleared city blocks to work with here, and the opportunity to create more population density to support nearby retail--like in the River Market.

We aren't talking about building 15-story apartment towers on infill lots between existing houses in the interior of the neighborhood. We are talking about whole city blocks on the north edge of the neighborhood that are currently vacant land.

I get so tired of seeing posts on neighborhood Facebook pages where people complain about the lack of retail, or the City lacks money to improve their neighborhood, but they don't have an understanding that you need a decent population density to achieve that.

FangKC wrote:

loftguy wrote:Edit: And I have to add that the reason the City Market vendors have not been open at night is twofold. The opportunity has not been real. Lack of households and visitors did not provide sufficient numbers to make general evening operation viable by nine restaurants in this neighborhood.

This is one of the reasons the low density of the Columbus Park redevelopment is so frustrating to me. We have several cleared city blocks to work with here, and the opportunity to create more population density to support nearby retail--like in the River Market.

We aren't talking about building 15-story apartment towers on infill lots between existing houses in the interior of the neighborhood. We are talking about whole city blocks on the north edge of the neighborhood that are currently vacant land.

I get so tired of seeing posts on neighborhood Facebook pages where people complain about the lack of retail, or the City lacks money to improve their neighborhood, but they don't have an understanding that you need a decent population density to achieve that.

A laudable goal would be to aim for another grocery store. To get there every project the city has to aim to get more stories and more units. If every block had one more residential unit on average that's easily 250 more residents downtown

The River Market had a grocery store at one time (other than the Asian Market), but it had trouble staying open.

I wish I could watch the City government channel and hear council member saying regularly to developers, "is there anyway to get you to add more housing units to your project?"

I wish council members thought of these new residential units more in terms of expanding sales and earnings taxes to fund city services. We need more residential units to accomplish that because more city residents than ever live alone in their home. There are literally thousands of single family houses in this city, that used to have four or five people living in them that now have only one person.

Sixty years ago you didn't have half of your city population living alone in all type of housing units.

The other factor is demographics. Now and in the future, we have the largest population of seniors that we have ever had. Many will be on fixed incomes. That has huge implications for housing stock, because as seniors age, they have more difficulty maintaining and affording larger properties. We need to be building more maintenance-free options for them. We need these options within their current neighborhoods, so they can downsize and stay where they are familiar.

RFP issued for KCATA's Third and Grand site.

Sean O'Byrne, vice president of business development for the Downtown Council, said the parameters of the proposal are wide open as long as the final use of the land is good for the city and KCATA. Office, retail, residential and mixed-use developments are all in the realm of possibility, he said, as long as the developers have transit first in their minds.

http://tinyurl.com/nlp7ucx