beer.

[warwickland]

No, I've never had a flemish sour ale, that I know of, but it sounds to me like an unflavored lambic, which is a very dry, attentuated, sour beer. Most lambics, because they are so sour on their own, are flavored with some kind of fruit, like apple, raspberry, currant, or some other very sweet flavor.

Some people love lambics. I do not, but it's simply a matter of personal tastes. I am guessing that the beer you had was akin to an unflavored lambic.

i had another taste at lunch, and it ripped my taste buds off. ah well, it was the most interesting beer ive tried for a long time.

[Beermo]

so i popped my year old 20 dollar 750 ml bottle of new Belgium's la folie last night to celebrate the end of college again, and it tasted like ass (it says right there in my tasting notes). has anyone drank this before? perhaps it aged too long in the bottle or heat ruined it in colorado, but it is a Flemish sour ale, and damn was it sour...strong astringency and alcohol was detected as well, and none of the sweetness i expected. i wish i had brought it in the lab here with me to taste again. j/k.

bahua, did i ruin the beer? have you any experience with Flemish sour ales?


k THX


[not my photo]

beer doesn't age like whiskey or scotch, it tends to get shall we say, less than tasty. maybe even having an ass taste. the way i believe it goes for beer is the fresher the better. i mean maybe you can lay some beer around for a month or 6, but a year might be stretching it. i might even find out one day. i have a 3 quart-5.4 ounce bottle of Heineken sitting on my mantle. bought it at gomers 5 years ago. it'll probably make ass taste good.

[Tosspot]

beer doesn't age like whiskey or scotch, it tends to get shall we say, less than tasty. maybe even having an ass taste. the way i believe it goes for beer is the fresher the better. i mean maybe you can lay some beer around for a month or 6, but a year might be stretching it. i might even find out one day. i have a 3 quart-5.4 ounce bottle of Heineken sitting on my mantle. bought it at gomers 5 years ago. it'll probably make ass taste good.

fortunately, i wouldn't know what an ass would taste like, but i'll leave it to my vivid imagination.

[shinatoo]

Heat is the enemy

[kcdcchef]

fortunately, i wouldn't know what an ass would taste like

oh please.

[Beermo]

Heat is the enemy

and light.

[chrizow]

some beers do get better with age, but not like wine.  a 20 year old beer will probably not taste very good...but a one year old bottle-conditioned pale ale or ipa can be quite tasty.

in fact, Bell's Old Ale is their Third Coast Ale after it has aged a year or two.  mmmm.

[bahua]

beer doesn't age like whiskey or scotch, it tends to get shall we say, less than tasty. maybe even having an ass taste. the way i believe it goes for beer is the fresher the better. i mean maybe you can lay some beer around for a month or 6, but a year might be stretching it.

This isn't true. While it's certainly true that beer won't age for decades, like wine or liquor, it will last for years, and get better and better. Just follow these guidelines:

-Don't refigerate it
-Don't expose it to heat or light
-Keep it at about 63 degrees, and don't mess with it
-Don't expect cheap beer to last, as it isn't actually beer.

[Beermo]

This isn't true. While it's certainly true that beer won't age for decades, like wine or liquor, it will last for years, and get better and better. Just follow these guidelines:

-Don't refrigerate it
-Don't expose it to heat or light
-Keep it at about 63 degrees, and don't mess with it
-Don't expect cheap beer to last, as it isn't actually beer.

being as you will never find anyone who can keep beer using your 4 conditions, my original statement can be proved to be correct.

remember this next time you go out and buy that dusty six pack of expensive beer at gomer's and get home to find out that your fancy imported IPA or whatever has gone to seed.

heat and light will kill a good beer faster than anything else except for maybe bahua.

[bahua]

Plenty of people cellar their beer. It's more common than you think. I've cellared my own for well over a year before, less less optimum conditions than what I described, and at 20 months old, it was still delicious, indeed better than it was before.

I'm not attacking you, beermo. I was just pointing out that freshness isn't the goal in a good beer.

[LenexatoKCMO]

There are some beers that can't stand up to aging at all.  Red Stripe for instance - this is a jamaican beer that is supposed to have a spicy/ginger taste to it - very refreshing on a hot day.  However, the ginger flavor fades extremely fast, leaving the beer tasteless and uninteresting at best.  I would hazard a guess that probably better than 4 out of 5 bottles of Red Stripe that you buy in the States have already faded before they ever leave the store.  There are plenty of people  around that will tell you they hate this beer, though they have probably never had a fresh one.  It is one of those beers that you should only ever buy at liqour stores that do a very heavy turnover and even then you are taking a big gamble. 

[Beermo]

Plenty of people cellar their beer. It's more common than you think. I've cellared my own for well over a year before, less less optimum conditions than what I described, and at 20 months old, it was still delicious, indeed better than it was before.

I'm not attacking you, beermo. I was just pointing out that freshness isn't the goal in a good beer.

i don't feel like you are attacking me, not at all. but......

i do feel that freshness is the goal. while some beers may stand the test of time, most don't. i once bought out all of the remaining cases of Heineken tarwebok dark beer at red x in riverside. i think it was around 20-25 cases. cost me about 150 bucks i think. i stored them in my bedroom of my apartment and they were good to the last bottle. the great thing about that beer was that most of my friends were american lager drinkers and couldn't get past one sip of this stuff, so i pretty much drank it all by myself.

anyway, that being said. if you go to europe, Heineken actually tastes pretty good. so i figure that they either change the recipe on the american exports or the heiny is not as fresh as it should be. i would almost bank on the freshness. it's amazing how much better beer tastes when they only have to ship it across town instead of across the ocean.

[bahua]

Most mass-produced European beers are packed with flavor-altering preservatives for transatlantic shipment. This is evident in beers like Heineken, 1664, Pilsner Urquell, and others. They taste great in Europe, but they're completely different, in a bad way, on this side of the pond.

[catfish1812]

warwickland

My wife and I went to the New Belgium brewery in early July and tasted La Folie... that is how it is supposed to taste.  I know it is a little shocking.  Its flavor is almost startling.  I think it is one of the most unique beers I've ever tasted.  We ended up buying a bottle to bring home just so other people could experience it.

The unique flavor comes from the fact that the beer is aged for 1 to 3 years in oak barrels that previously held wine.  So the sourness is the result (partially) of the tannins in the wine.

If you like beer (and you can find it) try it out... you wont taste anything like it.

[warwickland]

warwickland

My wife and I went to the New Belgium brewery in early July and tasted La Folie... that is how it is supposed to taste.  I know it is a little shocking.  Its flavor is almost startling.  I think it is one of the most unique beers I've ever tasted.  We ended up buying a bottle to bring home just so other people could experience it.

The unique flavor comes from the fact that the beer is aged for 1 to 3 years in oak barrels that previously held wine.  So the sourness is the result (partially) of the tannins in the wine.

If you like beer (and you can find it) try it out... you wont taste anything like it.

i think that if i had tried it at the brewery 'fresh' from the wood barrel aging, i would have liked it better. i believe heat 'messed it up' a bit, i had it wrapped up in dirty clothes in the high desert for a week. i did walk away from tasting it thinking that it was definitely a unique tasting experience.

now, does a beer with a higher ABV % age better in the bottle? its been awhile since ive read any micheal jackson. usually i only age something like a heavy duty IPA or a triple, etc.

also - i tried to use a mini fridge as a 'cellar' but couldnt get the temp high enough, any tips?

[kard]

also - i tried to use a mini fridge as a 'cellar' but couldnt get the temp high enough, any tips?

The kegerator's thermostat is broken at my place.  We use one of these.



http://www.thegrape.net/browse.cfm/4,8776.html

[bahua]

It does any temperature between 20 and 80 fahrenheit.

[mean]

i do feel that freshness is the goal. while some beers may stand the test of time, most don't.

Truth. Most beers can't hack it, but in general the stronger and darker the beer the longer you can keep it. And you should pretty much always refrigerate beer after its initial conditioning period is over, again with caveats for particularly strong and/or dark beers, at least if you want to keep it for any extended period of time. Macrolagers don't age well because they are extremely pale and relatively weak, not because they are created from some voodoo non-beer recipe. Third Coast Old Ale, on the other hand, ages exceptionally well because it is both super strong and super dark. These are pretty much the two extremes.

Ideally if you're going to attempt to age a conditioned beer for any period of time, you should refrigerate it--or at least keep it as cool as possible--after the conditioning period. I would never advise allowing the beer to sit at any higher than 72 degrees, and 55 is a whole lot better. In any case, the continuing chemical reactions in your bottle will cause the flavor to change over time no matter what, and eventually it will invariably start tasting "bad". Therefore, the goal is to postpone the "bad" for as long as possible, and the only way to slow these reactions down is to cool the beer down. The warmer it is kept, the faster it will age. Sometimes this can make it taste better and better over a period of time; sometimes not so much, and in any case it will start tasting bad eventually. It's like a ticking time bomb where the LCD readout is broken.

[Moniker]

i don't feel like you are attacking me, not at all. but......

i do feel that freshness is the goal. while some beers may stand the test of time, most don't. i once bought out all of the remaining cases of Heineken tarwebok dark beer at red x in riverside. i think it was around 20-25 cases. cost me about 150 bucks i think. i stored them in my bedroom of my apartment and they were good to the last bottle. the great thing about that beer was that most of my friends were american lager drinkers and couldn't get past one sip of this stuff, so i pretty much drank it all by myself.

anyway, that being said. if you go to europe, Heineken actually tastes pretty good. so i figure that they either change the recipe on the american exports or the heiny is not as fresh as it should be. i would almost bank on the freshness. it's amazing how much better beer tastes when they only have to ship it across town instead of across the ocean.

There is a reason why Heiniken tastes different overseas and here. Next time you crack one open, take a look as to where it is made and bottled.

You're drinking domestic Heini's, brother.

[kard]

There is a reason why Heiniken tastes different overseas and here. Next time you crack one open, take a look as to where it is made and bottled.

You're drinking domestic Heini's, brother.

I'm pretty sure Heineken is produced in Holland.  Isn't it?  It's imported by a company in NY.

Now, Fosters--that's made in Canada.