Kansas, Missouri battle over companies

[KCPowercat]

That doesn't help a city/state economic development department with a basketful of incentives and goals to meet to validate their jobs.

[mean]

Another solution would be for the red-state rhetoric mongers to put their money where there mouth is let those multimillion dollar international corporations pull themselves up by the bootstraps.

[bobbyhawks]

Well, one solution is a strong, forward-thinking, charismatic mayor that can project his vision for the metro to the leaders of suburban communities to instill a sense of mutually beneficial cooperation to achieve a greater goal instead of sniping of each other business infrastructure that does nobody any good in the long term.  Unfortunately, that mayor is the exact opposite of the sitting mayor in KC.

I think KCMO has been trying to sell the wrong things often to businesses.  Sure, the incentives are extremely important, but KCMO has one thing that KS facilities will never have... prestige.  If you are a business with a client base that visits your office, especially from out of town or across the country, it is far more impressive to take them to your river/downtown/crossroads/crown/plaza office than to have them drive to your concrete oasis.  I've never known someone who was blown away by a sprawling complex next to an Applebee's.  I may be old fashioned, but to me, nothing says professional, quality, pride, involvement, and experience better than having a space in the core of a real city.  There is nothing impressive to me about a building with a letter on it, two floors of office space that look out on a five times as large parking area, and a hollow entrance next to a temp agency and a Devry campus.  For many companies, the convenience of location to the burbs, the incentives, the ability to grow, make that an attractive option, but I don't get why established companies who aren't mega-Sprint/Garmin/Cerner types make that move.  Heck, even those companies could really say something by having a building downtown with their name in big letters.

[smh]

I think KCMO has been trying to sell the wrong things often to businesses.  Sure, the incentives are extremely important, but KCMO has one thing that KS facilities will never have... prestige.  If you are a business with a client base that visits your office, especially from out of town or across the country, it is far more impressive to take them to your river/downtown/crossroads/crown/plaza office than to have them drive to your concrete oasis.  I've never known someone who was blown away by a sprawling complex next to an Applebee's.  I may be old fashioned, but to me, nothing says professional, quality, pride, involvement, and experience better than having a space in the core of a real city.  There is nothing impressive to me about a building with a letter on it, two floors of office space that look out on a five times as large parking area, and a hollow entrance next to a temp agency and a Devry campus.  For many companies, the convenience of location to the burbs, the incentives, the ability to grow, make that an attractive option, but I don't get why established companies who aren't mega-Sprint/Garmin/Cerner types make that move.  Heck, even those companies could really say something by having a building downtown with their name in big letters.

Right on!

[Highlander]

Another solution would be for the red-state rhetoric mongers to put their money where there mouth is let those multimillion dollar international corporations pull themselves up by the bootstraps.

Unfortunately, the blue states do the same.  As long as incentives are being offered by anyone, you have to play the game or you will lose to someone.  I'd like to see the issue of corporate welfare, in the case of incentives for relocation, addressed on a national scale.  Perhaps limit incentives only to established urban cores so that we can better promote public transportation.  Now, that's a green initiative I could get behind and would kill a couple of birds with one stone. 

[KCPowercat]

I can't imagine federal government would want ti take nor the states want to give up that type of power.

[mean]

Unfortunately, the blue states do the same. 

Right, but theoretically they're the "socialists" who like giving welfare, so at least it isn't completely hypocritical. Not saying they should do it, but it is in line with their political doctrine.

[Highlander]

Right, but theoretically they're the "socialists" who like giving welfare, so at least it isn't completely hypocritical. Not saying they should do it, but it is in line with their political doctrine.

Point taken about hypocrisy but it's become a survival mechanism regardless of your political background.  Unless you participate in showering corporations with incentives, you will lose unless you happen to be in one of those few compelling places in the US where companies actually want/need to be despite the cost.  I know it would be tough to do but I think it is a subject the federal government should take on because it really is acting against the national best interest in so many ways:  taking money from city and state treasuries, loss of local income from property tax, encouraging sprawl, making it more difficult to facilitate public transportation etc...   

Perhaps the feds should offer incentives for companies to locate in urban centers as a method for facilitating public transportation and subduing sprawl.  I am actually all for incentives and corporate/government cooperation but only if used in a smart way to accomplish a worthwhile goal.  What we have now is self serving, destructive competition that really does nobody any good. 

[KCMax]

Right, but theoretically they're the "socialists" who like giving welfare, so at least it isn't completely hypocritical. Not saying they should do it, but it is in line with their political doctrine.

Its a bit hypocritical since Dems are supposed to be the champion of the "little guy" over the moneyed interests of corporate America.

[Highlander]

Its a bit hypocritical since Dems are supposed to be the champion of the "little guy" over the moneyed interests of corporate America.

It's not a political party issue.  It's common practice around the US, I think we need to get beyond who's being a hypocrit and find solutions.  My solution is to have the federal government offer incentives for companies to relocate back into urban cores to facilitate public transportation.  This effort, along with a new deal type public transporation construction binge would create jobs, help eliminate sprawl, reinvigorate city centers around the nation and do a hell of a lot more than any of the other green initiatives or alternative fuell programs that have been proposed.  If you can't beat the suburban Kansas incentives, then join them but do it at a scale (national) that would swamp any of their feeble efforts.  It's a corporate welfare program, but one that would work for everyone.

[KCMax]

It's not a political party issue.  It's common practice around the US, I think we need to get beyond who's being a hypocrit and find solutions.  My solution is to have the federal government offer incentives for companies to relocate back into urban cores to facilitate public transportation.  This effort, along with a new deal type public transporation construction binge would create jobs, help eliminate sprawl, reinvigorate city centers around the nation and do a hell of a lot more than any of the other green initiatives or alternative fuell programs that have been proposed.  If you can't beat the suburban Kansas incentives, then join them but do it at a scale (national) that would swamp any of their feeble efforts.  It's a corporate welfare program, but one that would work for everyone.

Except it won't be perceived as helping rural and suburban areas, and unfortunately our Congress gives them a disproportionate amount of power.

[mean]

My solution is to have the federal government offer incentives for companies to relocate back into urban cores to facilitate public transportation.  This effort, along with a new deal type public transporation construction binge would create jobs, help eliminate sprawl, reinvigorate city centers around the nation and do a hell of a lot more than any of the other green initiatives or alternative fuell programs that have been proposed.  If you can't beat the suburban Kansas incentives, then join them but do it at a scale (national) that would swamp any of their feeble efforts.  It's a corporate welfare program, but one that would work for everyone.

I love the idea, but can you even imagine what kind of raging hellfire of fury would rise up if Obama even talked about such a thing? The perception among surprisingly large swaths of whites that "Obama helps / wants to help black people more than he helps / wants to help white people" has already been demonstrated in polls. I imagine it would not be hard at all for the Glenn Beck crowd to spin this as "helping the blacks" (with no hint of racism, natch) and creating a massive stink of thus far unprecedented scale.

[Highlander]

I love the idea, but can you even imagine what kind of raging hellfire of fury would rise up if Obama even talked about such a thing? The perception among surprisingly large swaths of whites that "Obama helps / wants to help black people more than he helps / wants to help white people" has already been demonstrated in polls. I imagine it would not be hard at all for the Glenn Beck crowd to spin this as "helping the blacks" (with no hint of racism, natch) and creating a massive stink of thus far unprecedented scale.

Actually, such an effort would probably revive gentrification arguments and give the impression that inner city black were being hurt by the process.  It's going to happen anyway, whether it takes the next 25-50 years by market driven forces fueled by oil depletion with a lot of pain and agony to everyone involved or whether the feds can speed the process along and make it a bit more innocuous is the question. 

[mean]

Yeah, I think you'd have it from both sides. I agree that it might be good policy, but it wouldn't be popular with large percentages of either the suburban whites or the urban blacks, probably.

[KCMax]

An older article that touches upon some of the solutions that have been tried. The poaching is even more intense in the Rust Belt states since the economies are so dire there.

Obama Administration Presses Cities, States to End "Jobs Poaching"

Cities and states have tried for decades to end poaching via regional agreements, with limited success. This Journal article  about incentive "clawbacks," noted that a group of cities in Northern Ohio put together an antipoaching agreement where cities share tax revenue to discourage poaching. Various cities, states, counties and regional governments have passed similar measures.

Yet poaching continues, and the cottage industry of economic consultants that act as agents for companies seeking tax breaks.

[aknowledgeableperson]

I think KCMO has been trying to sell the wrong things often to businesses.  Sure, the incentives are extremely important, but KCMO has one thing that KS facilities will never have... prestige.

I am not sure what you mean by "prestige" but I have had dealings with companies that have moved to Crown Center and the Plaza (in the 70's and 80's) because for one reason or another they wanted a KCMO address but left downtown for many reasons, mainly because CC and the Plaza had new buildings and they were leaving old dt buildings and new ones dt were not being built or not being built fast enough.  For whatever reason(s) it was easier to get a building built at CC or the Plaza than dt.  Others left dt for College Blvd (or nearby) because Corporate Woods and Executive Hills were the place to be, they were hot on a national basis.  And that was because you had one entity (the developer) selling the image of the location whereas dt KCMO did not have one entity selling it.

You do hit upon a point, though.  With the new residences downtown and the amenities recently built it does make some wonder why some companies are leaving.  Sure incentives do enter the picture but are there other issues coming into play?

[KCPowercat]

a)  Almost everybody thinks Crown Center is downtown (hell 75% of people think the plaza is)

b)  The 70's and 80's is 30+ years away....does that have an relevance to today?


Studies prove again and again a business in the urban core get the best pick of employee base and a strong downtown/urban core improve an entire metro....why does everybody think KC is so different? (hint:  it's not)

[beautyfromashes]

Companies that pack up to leave DT on the cusp of a renewal have no foresight and will be out of business soon anyway.  The 'followers' are the first to get picked off.

[GRID]

KC is self destructing one company move at a time.  KC has got to stop this.

http://www.kansascity.com/2010/09/09/22 ... llion.html

[NDTeve]

Thanks Sprint!!