KCRag Forum

As far as I know, the project has been put on hold due to the tight quarters of the site. To me, though, it looks like they've done a bit more work since I last saw it.







I believe this is still the latest design.

So is this project on hold due to construction issues related to CV19 and social distancing or is has it been put on indefinite hold for financial reasons? If we are opening up bars and restaurants, it seems that the social distancing would not be the issue. I hope it's not financially related. It's never a good thing having holes in the ground due to indefinitely stalled or aborted construction projects.

Highlander wrote: ↑Sat May 23, 2020 3:27 pm So is this project on hold due to construction issues related to CV19 and social distancing or is has it been put on indefinite hold for financial reasons? If we are opening up bars and restaurants, it seems that the social distancing would not be the issue. I hope it's not financially related. It's never a good thing having holes in the ground due to indefinitely stalled or aborted construction projects.

Corona

earthling wrote: ↑Fri May 22, 2020 9:39 am

dukuboy1 wrote: ↑Fri May 22, 2020 9:06 am

earthling wrote: ↑Fri May 22, 2020 6:43 am Was expecting delays but hopefully not killed. Wouldn't be surprising if they switch to residential. Looks like the developer did Depot Square apts in Boulder as well.

Maybe a little less business travel but not that much off. People will adjust to the new normal.

Downtown hotel occupancy wasn't all that great before COVID and now Lowes added 800 rooms. Cities will be fighting for convention biz, KC probably won't be on winning side if Chicago and Denver are desperate. Large events (Sprint Center, etc) could take a while to pick back up too. It's not likely going to be a V-shape economic recovery either, could take 10+ years.

I hope it does not take 10yrs. Trying to stay positive and IMO I think things will rebound at a rapid pace. Nothing overnight & maybe year or 18 months. But we are learning more each day, especially on what the real numbers are. Everyday we learn better how to treat it with what we have and researching better ways. Not to mention vaccine research, both areas have seen positive research. There is a lot of money on the sidelines so to speak ready to get back into the game. There will be changes that will be with us a long time but I feel there will be a return at a quick pace. We killed an economy & brought the greatest global economic experience mankind has every witness to a crashing halt in 2 weeks. We should be able to turn the spigot back on

^Hope for the best, prepare for the worst. The downhill snowball effect is just getting started. There aren't any indicators to suggest a return to where we were in 18 months. Consumer confidence will probably be low at least until there is a vaccine but even then there's still a snowball effect that we haven't' seen since the Great Depression.

The 2008 recession wasn't anywhere close to this and took over 6 years to get back to 2008 levels in terms of jobs. And the unemployment rate took even longer to recover where it was because the labor force continued to grow.

KC might fare better than US avg but maybe not with hotels given occupancy wasn't all that great before COVID due to so many hotel rooms coming online. Will become more difficult to compete with other cities for conventions too and we don't understand the airline impact, which is clearly more severe than any event in its industry. And car rental impact. Hertz is over 100 years old and filed for bankruptcy out of nowhere, putting auto industry in jeopardy with possibly liquidating 100K-150K fairly new used cars on fire sale. Such snowball effects we haven't thought of yet will likely continue for many months.

We haven't seen anything like this so who knows. No one can predict how long it will take to return to where we were. Could highly optimistically be within a couple years but wouldn't be surprising if over 15 years.

earthling wrote: ↑Mon May 25, 2020 2:44 am ^Hope for the best, prepare for the worst. The downhill snowball effect is just getting started. There aren't any indicators to suggest a return to where we were in 18 months. Consumer confidence will probably be low at least until there is a vaccine but even then there's still a snowball effect that we haven't' seen since the Great Depression.

The 2008 recession wasn't anywhere close to this and took over 6 years to get back to 2008 levels in terms of jobs. And the unemployment rate took even longer to recover where it was because the labor force continued to grow.

The difference is that;

1. Our economy was already weak leading up to the 2008 recession.. instead of the barreling train that it was just a few months ago.
2. THIS economic situation was entirely man made. It's the result of our decisions. THAT can be undone rather quickly (IE: By reopening).
3. Please stop using verbiage such as "Until there is a vaccine" and spreading this false sense that there WILL be a vaccine. There likely will NEVER be a vaccine. That's the simple reality of science. Hearing people talk about vaccines as if we can magically formulate one from thin air at our discretion is ridiculous. We don't even have a foolproof method of testing for the virus right now. Thinking that we'll somehow create a vaccine for an RNA based virus in the next few months is absurd and completely out of touch with reality. Treatments, sure. But vaccines are a whole different ball game. We have millions of treatments for diseases all over the globe, but we only have 26 vaccines. TWENTY SIX. Wrap your head around that. Do people NOT realize these simple facts and what they mean? We simply do not have the answers or the capable to create the answers to every medical question out there. It is 2020. Not 2398423948. We are only a few years removed from wiping our asses with toliet paper. Just kidding.. We're absolute animals. We are not an advanced species or society. We are crude. Basic. Raw. Our science is politically charged and unimaginative. We are constrained to these realities. Welcome to Earth, 2020. This is going to be as common and ever lasting as the seasonal flu.

Can the debate over the coronavirus, politics and other stuff be done on the dedicated threads. I understand that this conversation is somewhat in regards to hotels, but there are appropriate threads to debate this.

^Moved.

earthling wrote: ↑Mon May 25, 2020 2:44 am ^Hope for the best, prepare for the worst. The downhill snowball effect is just getting started. There aren't any indicators to suggest a return to where we were in 18 months. Consumer confidence will probably be low at least until there is a vaccine but even then there's still a snowball effect that we haven't' seen since the Great Depression.

The 2008 recession wasn't anywhere close to this and took over 6 years to get back to 2008 levels in terms of jobs. And the unemployment rate took even longer to recover where it was because the labor force continued to grow.

KC might fare better than US avg but maybe not with hotels given occupancy wasn't all that great before COVID due to so many hotel rooms coming online. Will become more difficult to compete with other cities for conventions too and we don't understand the airline impact, which is clearly more severe than any event in its industry. And car rental impact. Hertz is over 100 years old and filed for bankruptcy out of nowhere, putting auto industry in jeopardy with possibly liquidating 100K-150K fairly new used cars on fire sale. Such snowball effects we haven't thought of yet will likely continue for many months.

We haven't seen anything like this so who knows. No one can predict how long it will take to return to where we were. Could highly optimistically be within a couple years but wouldn't be surprising if over 15 years.

The other thing to consider regarding 2008 recession: the congress at the time was not interested in having the economy recover quickly. I would hope that the current crisis might have a different result, but won't know until after the election.

^Moved.

This project is expected to start back up soon.

Loan issues delay Hyatt House Hotel project, prompt lawsuit
https://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/ ... wsuit.html

After signing financing agreements with AltosGroups, Pedersen Development issued a notice to proceed for the project on Dec. 4, performing about $3.71 million of work through April 30. But Pedersen said AltosGroups has failed and refused to pay any portion of the amount through the loan, even though it is contractually obligated.

As a result, Pedersen has been unable to pay its contractor, which suspended work on the project, and it filed a lawsuit filed June 10 in federal district court in Kansas City.

AltosGroups' failure to live up to its obligations resulted in additional costs, potential loss of other financing, loss of profits from delays in opening the project, and potential default and termination of the construction contract, the lawsuit states.

Same financing team for the hard rock hotel

earthling wrote: ↑Thu Jun 11, 2020 12:50 pm Loan issues delay Hyatt House Hotel project, prompt lawsuit
https://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/ ... wsuit.html

After signing financing agreements with AltosGroups, Pedersen Development issued a notice to proceed for the project on Dec. 4, performing about $3.71 million of work through April 30. But Pedersen said AltosGroups has failed and refused to pay any portion of the amount through the loan, even though it is contractually obligated.

As a result, Pedersen has been unable to pay its contractor, which suspended work on the project, and it filed a lawsuit filed June 10 in federal district court in Kansas City.

AltosGroups' failure to live up to its obligations resulted in additional costs, potential loss of other financing, loss of profits from delays in opening the project, and potential default and termination of the construction contract, the lawsuit states.

What’s the likelyhood that this could tank the entire project? Be an awful shame to lose one like this.

TheLastGentleman wrote: ↑Mon Jun 01, 2020 5:12 pm This project is expected to start back up soon.

So.... nah?

DaveKCMO wrote: ↑Thu Jun 11, 2020 9:26 pm

TheLastGentleman wrote: ↑Mon Jun 01, 2020 5:12 pm This project is expected to start back up soon.

So.... nah?

The rumor back then was that new financing was close to being secured

DaveKCMO wrote: ↑Thu Jun 11, 2020 9:26 pmSo.... nah?

My contact hasn't heard anything new about it one way or the other

I hope this doesn't turn into another Second and Delaware.

FangKC wrote: ↑Fri Jun 12, 2020 12:22 am I hope this doesn't turn into another Second and Delaware.

At least Second and Delaware was far enough along that you just knew someone would pick it up at some point. This project just has a little bit of rebar sticking out of the ground and a tower crane up. This could just as easily turn back into surface lot if the project is abandoned.

Roadwork was being done in the alleyway.