KCPD East Campus

[FangKC]

There would be less water runoff from the parking lot if they just used gravel instead of asphalt. In fact, there would be less runoff if the surface parking lots were smaller, and some of the parking was under the building.

The other thing about this design is the expansive roof. If they built, say a 4-story building on a smaller footprint 1/4th the size of the proposed building, there would be less square footage of roof and less runoff from it.

It would also be better if the smaller building had a green roof that would slow down runoff, and also provide insulating protection from the elements--requiring less utilities.

A building with a roof that size absorbs much more heat than smaller roof. Thus the building is harder to cool.

[FangKC]

Demolition set to begin Jan. 7 for East Patrol campus

http://northeastnews.net/pages/?p=16824

[chaglang]

Today I was driving over where the East Patrol Campus is going in, and there are now a double digit number of burned out houses in that area. That was not what those blocks looked like last summer. The KCFD was on the roof of one as I drove past. It looked an awful lot like they are using the vacants as firefighting practice.

[FangKC]

Construction begins on the East Patrol headquarters and crime lab.

http://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/n ... 2013-11-19

[chaglang]

I don't understand the economic development component of this, beyond the jobs that will relocate to that location. If there's more to it than that, could someone explain it to me like I'm a 5 year old?

[chrizow]

yeah, other than maybe the construction jobs, i can't see how this is anything other than an economic negative for an already distressed area. the facility itself will be a huge fortress that will only calcify blight for a decent radius around it. it's not like the KCPD employees are going to be shopping at the nearby strip mall or grabbing drinks at the Green Duck or whatever after work - meanwhile the project displaced several homeowners who presumably were more likely to patronize neighborhood businesses.

[GRID]

This type of "urban renewal" does not work. Don't understand this project.

[Demosthenes]

Here is a nice video I found on You Tube showing each of the blocks included in this project: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEEN04VLU5Y.

If you haven't been over to the site recently... well you may not want to go, especially after watching this. I am so FURIOUS that this was allowed to happen. The site is now a gigantic mound of dirt, literally the largest freaking mound of dirt ever. The site is so ridiculously expansive, it just blows the mind to see in person. These people deserve to be tortured for this shit.

Watching this video, you see that the neighborhood really didn't look too bad. It had nice bones, just like the blocks due south. Maybe not quite as nice, but certainly workable. There were many, many nice houses and some good looking apartment buildings. Even some commercial structures.

I am really curious to see the impact this police station brings. This immediate area is ground zero for the Kansas City drug trade, so you would imagine it would have to move, but the cops already know this and it continues. They have this area heavily manned already, so I really don't get what this building will accomplish except for spreading fear and anger. I have talked to many people in the neighborhood, and every single one of them is disgusted by this supposed "good for the neighborhood" project.

[FangKC]

Of course, this is all water under the bridge. It was ridiculous to take out that many houses and displace that many residents. Because they had to buy out so many residents, the project already is more expensive than it needed to be.

Instead of building this headquarters building on such a large footprint, and tearing down so many houses, I'd much rather have seen the KCPD build several smaller precinct houses all over the East Patrol territory.

East Patrol is a huge territory covering 45 square miles. That's about the physical size of San Francisco. Keep in mind that the East Patrol campus will cover four square blocks. The Downtown Police Headquarters building and parking lot is on one city block.

http://kcmo.gov/police/east-patrol-division/

http://zru5b3x41ea3ct5vgj46zvitm.wpengi ... 12/epd.png

This would have established a more visual police presence in several vital locations. Some existing buildings might have been adapted for this purpose. There are plenty of vacant former commercial storefronts -- former grocery, or drug, store locations, etc.

I can think of several places this could have happened. The former Thacher School on Independence Avenue in the Old Northeast for example. Build another smaller precinct building around E. 35th and Prospect, and then another one east of I-435-- somewhere south of the stadium complex. Each of these locations have buildings that exist already that could be renovated, and that also have adequate parking.

Former Thacher School site.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.1056668 ... a=!3m1!1e3

35th and Prospect, the former Mega Mart store.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0617855 ... a=!3m1!1e3

Shopping Center at Blue Ridge Cutoff and Sni-A-Bar Road

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.031087, ... d_fHTA!2e0

Then build a new crime lab next to the Police Investigation Building on Linwood and Forest Avenue, on the north side of the existing parking lot for the police station there--facing 31st Street.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0693919 ... a=!3m1!1e3


If the City insists on a sprawling one-campus location, I would have put it at 23rd and Topping on the Hilltop Townhomes site. This housing complex is mostly, if not completely, vacant now, and probably could have been purchased for less than buying all those houses in Wendell-Phillips. It's certainly blighted and probably all needs to be demolished. There is plenty of room for what the KCPD claims they need.

http://www.loopnet.com/Listing/17160921 ... s-City-MO/

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.086761, ... a=!3m1!1e3

[aknowledgeableperson]

"I have talked to many people in the neighborhood, and every single one of them is disgusted by this supposed "good for the neighborhood" project."


Here is another viewpoint.

"Since January, more than 500 people have flocked to the building seeking jobs, training — or just hope and some encouraging words. And many are finding it with the help of GG Owens, manager of JE Dunn’s information trailer.

The steady stream of visitors to the trailer is a graphic illustration of just how starved people in the urban core are for job opportunities. And while the original intent was to identify workers for the East Patrol project itself, the appeals for help have led Owens to search out other possibilities so people don’t go away empty-handed.
...
City officials say more than 70 people who visited the trailer qualified for a program called Section 3, designed to employ low-income residents from the surrounding neighborhoods on the construction project. Dozens more have found at least part-time work elsewhere, and more than 100 have been referred to training programs that can lead to decent-paying warehouse jobs.
...
One of those people is Terry Hodge, 51, who lives just blocks away at 25th and Olive streets. He had worked for years in retail but was laid off about a year ago.

He visited the trailer shortly after it opened last November and credits Owens with telling him how to get his Section 3 certification and required construction safety classes. He gradually networked with job contacts and got hired March 2 with Rodriguez Mechanical Contractors, helping to install water lines, storm drains and manholes at the East Patrol site.
...
Phillip Yelder, director of Kansas City’s Human Relations department, said city officials and the joint venture team of JE Dunn and Alexander Mechanical had a goal of employing at least 70 Section 3 workers on the project. They now expect to exceed that goal.

He acknowledged many construction jobs on the site may last only a few months. But he said the city has numerous other projects underway or scheduled to begin, and those who get Section 3 certification through the information trailer referrals can use that as the first step to other job opportunities, including union apprenticeships."

Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/2014/05/25/50 ... rylink=cpy

[chaglang]

70 temporary jobs.

I'm guessing that if the project wasn't a bloated superblock, people would let slide the "good for the neighborhood" stuff. Smacks of "we had to destroy the village to save it" logic.

[FangKC]

False equivalency. The jobs would have been created no matter where the new East Patrol building(s) were constructed.

So another viewpoint is: Do we need to demolish an entire neighborhood to create jobs?

Do people living in low-income neighborhoods with high unemployment need to demolish the homes of other residents just to create jobs?

Another viewpoint.

The City has thousands of vacant properties, some of which will require demolition. If the City needs a jobs program, why not employ people in demolition / deconstruction of these properties, and/or for site cleanup?

[pash]

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[Demosthenes]

This project is so depressing. I couldn't bring myself to post the series of articles in the Star last year that described how the police department came to realize, in slow motion, that its initial plan was so poorly drawn up that it would have to scale back the project substantially.

So instead of knocking down four square blocks to build a small building and some parking lots, it turns out that they've knocked down four square blocks to build an even smaller building and some parking lots. Meanwhile, the acres of vacant, city-owned land around the corner are still there, and still just as empty.

How sadly common that seems to be. So many buildings are torn down only for the developer to then realize they cannot complete the project, making the demolition completely unnecessary. At least this project will be completed, but it's going to look really stupid. It's really frustrating because this neighborhood was actually pretty solid. Nice architecture and plenty of good homes. If the city continues to rebound, this could have been a nice middle class neighborhood some day. Not anymore...

[aknowledgeableperson]

70 temporary jobs.

But isn't that true with any construction jobs on a project? But for these folks there is some long term benefit with the job training and skills provided. Anyway the post was to counter the comment about everyone in the neighborhood being disgusted with the project.

[chaglang]

So it's a $57m job training program for 70 people that required tearing down four blocks of homes? Gotcha.

[Demosthenes]

70 temporary jobs.

But isn't that true with any construction jobs on a project? But for these folks there is some long term benefit with the job training and skills provided. Anyway the post was to counter the comment about everyone in the neighborhood being disgusted with the project.

Well yes obviously because the only roll you typically play is devil's advocate. Sometimes there isn't a really good way to play that roll though. This is one of them.

You bring up a good point that there will be some people who benefit from this project. Some people will get work. Developers, architects, construction companies, etc. will all make money. The police will get a swanky new work space where families once lived for generations.

None of this is worth it though. A few people getting jobs does not warrant tearing down a neighborhood and displacing families. Especially since any construction project will get these same people work. A different project on this very site would have brought along construction jobs. How about one where they didn't touch any of the houses or streets, but built new houses and apartments on the site of vacant lots instead? Along Prospect, Brooklyn, and 27th they could have built commercial space, more houses and apartments, and even left a space for a new, multi-floor police station, one that is just as spectacular as the one they are currently building. That would have created many jobs. I bet even more than the current police station. And when they put up little pieces of art work that say things like "improving Santa Fe" and utter crap like that, they would actually mean it. This whole "we love the neighborhood" attitude is so full of shit that I get nauseated being in the presence of it. They don't care AT ALL about the neighborhood.

I still think these police officers should be forced to live in the neighborhood. Why not? It might actually help mend the disconnect that currently exists between police and community.

[aknowledgeableperson]

Again, the post was to counter the statement made that every one in the neighborhood was disgusted with the project.

Now for your point of destroying a neighborhood. What was left of the neighborhood before the project started wasn't much of a neighborhood. Along with the many vacant lots were many houses in Land Trust, houses no one wanted over the many years they were in Land Trust. These two categories, if memory is correct, equaled or exceeded occupied houses. Guess, maybe, the city could have waited for a generation or two before seeing a slight turnaround. How long is the city to wait for something to happen?

Granted the city could have done this or done that but for many reasons this was the decision made. Is it a perfect or flawless decision? No, but really no decision is completely perfect or flawless.

[pash]

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[chaglang]

Again, the post was to counter the statement made that every one in the neighborhood was disgusted with the project.

The original comment (not mine) was that everyone on the neighborhood that person had talked to hated the project. Quite different from the statement you're attempting to refute.

To your other point, several of those blocks were not in bad shape. Google street view bears this out. There are some vacant lots, but nothing in those images makes that area a more appealing target for this project than the more vacant blocks nearby. It's easy to get the impression that some of the better blocks in the area were sacrificed. If some of the properties were in the Land Bank, so what? The point of the Land Bank is not to be a pretext for demolition. Vacancy doesn't equal uselessness.

Since you apparently think that this project is going to generate some kind of economic regeneration in that area, could you explain how you came to that conclusion? Apart, of course, from the job training program.