Downtown Baseball Stadium

[Eon Blue]

Oak is twice as wide as it needs to be. You could take some of the ROW and still have a functional street left over.

[Imarealperson]

SKC is running away from KCK commitments. Things are happening more than you know.

Who is building Sporting a new $400MM stadium?

[alejandro46]

Sporting is still investing money into CMH, and there is still the American Royal and youth soccer fields going out there along with the training complex thing. I haven't seen anything publicly indicating they are going to leave.

The Crossroads may be a better geographical site as it's closer to PNL, but the site is more expensive and small. Going to take a lot longer to accumulate the land with various lawsuits from any imminent domain.

[KCPowercat]

I still need someone to explain to me why the East Crossroads site will lead to spin-off development and we won't see any demolitions for parking lots and the East Village site will level West Paseo for parking and we won't see any development. What makes these sites so different that we will see the complete opposite from a spin-off development standpoint? It really seems illogical and that people are just looking at their preferred site through rose-colored glasses and not reality.

If we're sitting here in 10 years with the East Crossroads leveled for parking and East Village having seen zero development, what will you say? Will it really matter that the baseball stadium is a few hundred feet closer to P&L?

I'm not exactly sure what you're asking but the biggest difference between East Village and East Crossroads is the fact that the stadium would be relied upon to be the catalyst to more spin-off development in East Village. In East Crossroads, it takes advantage of already existing development and becomes a part of the existing momentum we've been seeing over the last decade.

Some on this forum don't see any major difference with proximity to PNL between the two sites but it's monumental. The East Crossroads site, pending exact location could be as close as 200' or even connected via the park cap. East Village is over 1500 feet at its closest edge to edge. That's not connected at all.

As for the possibility of property owners leveling areas for parking, I guess that could happen but the Royals are going to build plenty of parking as part of their design. They need that revenue. It will be mostly garage style parking but of course, to appease the ridiculous concept of tailgating baseball, they'll need to build some smaller surface parking.

I mean neither of those numbers are accurate but okay. Glad to hear we are already admitting surface lots will pop up. East village needs less structured parking built but hey we are KC, let's build more parking

[DColeKC]

I still need someone to explain to me why the East Crossroads site will lead to spin-off development and we won't see any demolitions for parking lots and the East Village site will level West Paseo for parking and we won't see any development. What makes these sites so different that we will see the complete opposite from a spin-off development standpoint? It really seems illogical and that people are just looking at their preferred site through rose-colored glasses and not reality.

If we're sitting here in 10 years with the East Crossroads leveled for parking and East Village having seen zero development, what will you say? Will it really matter that the baseball stadium is a few hundred feet closer to P&L?

I'm not exactly sure what you're asking but the biggest difference between East Village and East Crossroads is the fact that the stadium would be relied upon to be the catalyst to more spin-off development in East Village. In East Crossroads, it takes advantage of already existing development and becomes a part of the existing momentum we've been seeing over the last decade.

Some on this forum don't see any major difference with proximity to PNL between the two sites but it's monumental. The East Crossroads site, pending exact location could be as close as 200' or even connected via the park cap. East Village is over 1500 feet at its closest edge to edge. That's not connected at all.

As for the possibility of property owners leveling areas for parking, I guess that could happen but the Royals are going to build plenty of parking as part of their design. They need that revenue. It will be mostly garage style parking but of course, to appease the ridiculous concept of tailgating baseball, they'll need to build some smaller surface parking.

I mean neither of those numbers are accurate but okay. Glad to hear we are already admitting surface lots will pop up. East village needs less structured parking built but hey we are KC, let's build more parking

Those numbers are down to the inch. Do I need to provide a map to prove it?

And no one can prevent current property owners from turning their land into parking lots. Not with the laws the way they are, so I'm sure that's a possibility.

Both locations would need parking built.

[KCPowercat]

Sure. Post em if you care that much. No doubt EC is closer to pnl. Why that makes it a better site is up for debate.

[DColeKC]

I mean neither of those numbers are accurate but okay. Glad to hear we are already admitting surface lots will pop up. East village needs less structured parking built but hey we are KC, let's build more parking
[/quote]




Add 400' to the EV for the one block north.

[KCPowercat]

Lol. That not where EV site starts and EC better not knock down the east side of grand and who cares how close it is to the yogs studio? Just be honest in these numbers, already agree EC is closer, it's just not material especially given the cost of EC site.

To cordish though it definitely is material difference.

[DColeKC]

Lol. That not where EV site starts and EC better not knock down the east side of grand and who cares how close it is to the yogs studio? Just be honest in these numbers, already agree EC is closer, it's just not material especially given the cost of EC site.

To cordish though it definitely is material difference.

Did you not see the comment about add another 400 feet? You keep denying there’s much difference between the two sites logistically when there is. If east village was so great, we wouldn’t be debating the location. I said close to power and light. That corner is where it starts. Talk about not being honest.

PNL, specially Kansas city live is a huge asset that would be integral in creating the type of baseball game day experience the royals want.

What’s so amazing on the east side of grand? The strip club? Tattoo parlor? Corner bar that changes concepts every 2 years because it can’t succeed? Closed SOT? Closed food places? I guess the dry cleaner could be considered historical.

The only old and cool business in that section is Cigar Box and I know the owners personally. They’ll listen to reasonable offers.

[DColeKC]

And property accumulation and demolition is far cheaper than infrastructure improvements or installation. Plus, does anyone here know how much Van Trust was asking to EV? Why is it assumed that area is cheaper.

[TheBigChuckbowski]

I'm not exactly sure what you're asking but the biggest difference between East Village and East Crossroads is the fact that the stadium would be relied upon to be the catalyst to more spin-off development in East Village. In East Crossroads, it takes advantage of already existing development and becomes a part of the existing momentum we've been seeing over the last decade.

I mean, this is an argument against the East Crossroads site but of course you don't see it that way. First of all, we should be concerned with the overall momentum of downtown and the metro before we're concerned with the momentum of the Power & Light District. And, don't tell me you're also talking about the Crossroads when you've spent dozens of pages denigrating the businesses, buildings and residents of the neighborhood.

That area of downtown does indeed have momentum. What better way to risk halting that momentum than plopping down a mega-block black hole for 200+ days a year (yeah, yeah, there will be a team store in one corner of over four square blocks, great). And, it basically guarantees that the momentum in the East Crossroads is stopped as it will just be demoed. But, you seem to only care about the proximity to P&L and property owners getting a good ROI so it doesn't matter if the East Crossroads becomes a sea of parking.

Meanwhile, we have a gigantic festering wound, otherwise known as the East Village, that will remain a gigantic festering wound for years to come if the stadium isn't built there. The East Crossroads site is repeating every stupid tear down mistake we've made over the last 80 years. But, it's worse, because we have the evidence that this sort of thing doesn't work and just leads to lower density, walkability and worse urbanism. The EC site will basically doom us to having almost exclusively surface lots from 8th to the trench east of Cherry downtown. Just absurd that anyone views that as a positive outcome or refuses to believe the obvious. Especially when the alternative is to fill in the East Village and allow East Crossroads to build on its momentum. The gameday experience for the <5% of fans that will do more than just go to the game should be seen as close to irrelevant and, instead, it seems to be the top priority.

[DColeKC]

Sporting is still investing money into CMH, and there is still the American Royal and youth soccer fields going out there along with the training complex thing. I haven't seen anything publicly indicating they are going to leave.

The Crossroads may be a better geographical site as it's closer to PNL, but the site is more expensive and small. Going to take a lot longer to accumulate the land with various lawsuits from any imminent domain.

The accumulation has already begun, even if the stadium doesn’t happen. I don’t see eminent domain being needed but if so, thise cases usually take less than a year. Also, EC could be far less expensive considering the existing infrastructure. Lastly, the plot to build the stadium could be assembled first as the rest of the lane for the village portion could take longer.

[Rusty Irish]

Sam McDowell was on 810 there and basically parroted everything DCole has said. Crossroads has been the sole focus for weeks now and East Village is just a fallback option at this rate. Apparently Frank White is also unhappy about the change in focus of the preferred site.

Also stated as before that beyond a possible amphitheater on the Kauffman site, there's absolutely no desire from the Chiefs to develop the rest of TSC post Royals at this time.

[DColeKC]

I'm not exactly sure what you're asking but the biggest difference between East Village and East Crossroads is the fact that the stadium would be relied upon to be the catalyst to more spin-off development in East Village. In East Crossroads, it takes advantage of already existing development and becomes a part of the existing momentum we've been seeing over the last decade.

I mean, this is an argument against the East Crossroads site but of course you don't see it that way. First of all, we should be concerned with the overall momentum of downtown and the metro before we're concerned with the momentum of the Power & Light District. And, don't tell me you're also talking about the Crossroads when you've spent dozens of pages denigrating the businesses, buildings and residents of the neighborhood.

That area of downtown does indeed have momentum. What better way to risk halting that momentum than plopping down a mega-block black hole for 200+ days a year (yeah, yeah, there will be a team store in one corner of over four square blocks, great). And, it basically guarantees that the momentum in the East Crossroads is stopped as it will just be demoed. But, you seem to only care about the proximity to P&L and property owners getting a good ROI so it doesn't matter if the East Crossroads becomes a sea of parking.

Meanwhile, we have a gigantic festering wound, otherwise known as the East Village, that will remain a gigantic festering wound for years to come if the stadium isn't built there. The East Crossroads site is repeating every stupid tear down mistake we've made over the last 80 years. But, it's worse, because we have the evidence that this sort of thing doesn't work and just leads to lower density, walkability and worse urbanism. The EC site will basically doom us to having almost exclusively surface lots from 8th to the trench east of Cherry downtown. Just absurd that anyone views that as a positive outcome or refuses to believe the obvious. Especially when the alternative is to fill in the East Village and allow East Crossroads to build on its momentum. The gameday experience for the <5% of fans that will do more than just go to the game should be seen as close to irrelevant and, instead, it seems to be the top priority.

Well, first of all, I live in the power & light district and have since that was an option. On top of that, I helped build it and open it and lastly, I've seen what the synergy between a cordish owned property and baseball can be like with visits to St Louis, Atlanta and Texas. So yes, most of my comments tend to talk about PNL. I've also spent a great deal of time in the crossroads over the last 15 years but to be honest, I typically skip the first two or there blocks to get to places I frequent. And honestly, that general area seems to be the most "vibrant" in all of Crossroads.

PNL has had the vast majority of major momentum over the last decade. To claify my comment: This stadium would help the crossroads far more than PNL as far as momentum. This would speed up the development along Truman. Of course I'm talking about all of downtown, but I want this stadium as close to PNL as possible for a multitude of reasons. I think it's short-sighted settling for East Village simply because someone else took the time to assemble the land with hopes for a big payday. I'm not settling for East Village just because it's a big hole. I'm not settling for East Village just because we want to plug holes even if that isn't the best choice for the particular situation. I want a world class baseball experience in this city and East Village ain't it. I'm also not too worried about East Village sitting empty for years if that's what it takes. It's very much out of sight, out of mind for 99% of the people who visit and live downtown. I get it, we all pay more attention to development and want it filled, but we're not most people. I do think it will be developed once the big, easy payday is no longer an option for the land squatters.

The idea that just 5% of fans will do anything more than go the game is insanely far off. Why do you think almost every MLB team in the country wants to build some kind of village? Why have representatives from dozens of MLB teams came to Kansas City to visit PNL?

Fans will now be able to come into our downtown and park once. Walk or ride from hotel to food, fun, entertainment, baseball, movies, museums, retail and on and on. Talk about "urbanism" at it's finest.

I get the concern about surface parking lots but you ain't going to stop KC from doing KC. That's a larger issue with the city and until they change some policies, it's a problem. I don't see that happening but the pros far outweigh the cons if it does indeed take place.

I'm always going to be the cordish guy on here. Everyone is always going to take anything I say and view it through those cordish-colored glasses. That's fine, but that's not how I look at this. This is something most of us in here will never get to witness or be apart of again. A baseball stadium being built in downtown Kansas City, the largest project in the cities history. I want to get it right and not take the layup. I understand the complexities involved and the pushback some will give related to the East Crossroads site.

Somethings gotta give because there's no way to make everyone happy.

Finally, if you think me expressing my opinion is disparaging crossroads residents and businesses owners, I have a helmet for you. You all do a fine job advocating for them. You all seem to speak for them but your feedback clashes with what I hear out of them. I think many people on here are speaking from a personal perspective and haven't actually gotten out and talked to others. I don't mean to put down anyone, I understand this process is difficult and not everyone will be happy with the outcome. I'm just not going to play that role on here, you can.

[KCPowercat]

Lol. That not where EV site starts and EC better not knock down the east side of grand and who cares how close it is to the yogs studio? Just be honest in these numbers, already agree EC is closer, it's just not material especially given the cost of EC site.

To cordish though it definitely is material difference.

Did you not see the comment about add another 400 feet? You keep denying there’s much difference between the two sites logistically when there is. If east village was so great, we wouldn’t be debating the location. I said close to power and light. That corner is where it starts. Talk about not being honest.

PNL, specially Kansas city live is a huge asset that would be integral in creating the type of baseball game day experience the royals want.

What’s so amazing on the east side of grand? The strip club? Tattoo parlor? Corner bar that changes concepts every 2 years because it can’t succeed? Closed SOT? Closed food places? I guess the dry cleaner could be considered historical.

The only old and cool business in that section is Cigar Box and I know the owners personally. They’ll listen to reasonable offers.

Spoken like a new resident who cares not about any of our past. The current businesses there are irrelevant. Weve torn down enough of our city why continue to do so. We have a space ready to go that takes no demo

[DColeKC]

Lol. That not where EV site starts and EC better not knock down the east side of grand and who cares how close it is to the yogs studio? Just be honest in these numbers, already agree EC is closer, it's just not material especially given the cost of EC site.

To cordish though it definitely is material difference.

Did you not see the comment about add another 400 feet? You keep denying there’s much difference between the two sites logistically when there is. If east village was so great, we wouldn’t be debating the location. I said close to power and light. That corner is where it starts. Talk about not being honest.

PNL, specially Kansas city live is a huge asset that would be integral in creating the type of baseball game day experience the royals want.

What’s so amazing on the east side of grand? The strip club? Tattoo parlor? Corner bar that changes concepts every 2 years because it can’t succeed? Closed SOT? Closed food places? I guess the dry cleaner could be considered historical.

The only old and cool business in that section is Cigar Box and I know the owners personally. They’ll listen to reasonable offers.

Spoken like a new resident who cares not about any of our past. The current businesses there are irrelevant. Weve torn down enough of our city why continue to do so. We have a space ready to go that takes no demo

lol. When do I get to be an "old" resident? I've been living downtown for almost 20 years in total. Sorry, I don't care to have a strip club and tattoos parlor close to my residence. I don't care to have a bar close to my home that has occasional shootings. I could care less about dry cleaning or I've got dozens of other choices if I'm needing an event space. The only thing I'd miss would be Cigar Box.

[KCPowercat]

Again the actual businesses currently occupying those buildings is irrelevant. Understand that is when you get to graduate. We have to quit tearing down our past. Nobody goes to a city enthralled with their newest building outside of Vegas.

Crossroads is growing already. It doesn't need this. EV expanded our functional downtown space and makes a better overall urban space and costs us no teardowns.

[DColeKC]

Again the actual businesses currently occupying those buildings is irrelevant. Understand that is when you get to graduate. We have to quit tearing down our past. Nobody goes to a city enthralled with their newest building outside of Vegas.

Crossroads is growing already. It doesn't need this. EV expanded our functional downtown space and makes a better overall urban space and costs us no teardowns.

No teardown and hundreds of millions needed in infrastructure costs. East Village isn't even a better option if you're trying to save on site prep.

I'm not for tearing down historic of culturally significant buildings. That's why I'm ok with anything we're talking about in East Crossroads going. This city has plenty of history and a ton of buildings that will never be touched, they don't reside in East Crossroads.

I'm not into saving structurally and historically irrelevant buildings so older residents can get a sense of nostalgia when they walk by them once a month. I'm into development and improving downtown as a whole.

Ending up with the 2nd best option and a subpar baseball experience so a handful of people can reminisce as they watch the 50th business in 10 years move into a bland building in East Crossroads would be very disappointing. I'm worried about the future, not the past.

[TheBigChuckbowski]

Fans will now be able to come into our downtown and park once. Walk or ride from hotel to food, fun, entertainment, baseball, movies, museums, retail and on and on. Talk about "urbanism" at it's finest.

Urbanism at its finest is people driving in from the suburbs and not moving their car.

[KCPowercat]

Again the actual businesses currently occupying those buildings is irrelevant. Understand that is when you get to graduate. We have to quit tearing down our past. Nobody goes to a city enthralled with their newest building outside of Vegas.

Crossroads is growing already. It doesn't need this. EV expanded our functional downtown space and makes a better overall urban space and costs us no teardowns.

No teardown and hundreds of millions needed in infrastructure costs. East Village isn't even a better option if you're trying to save on site prep.

I'm not for tearing down historic of culturally significant buildings. That's why I'm ok with anything we're talking about in East Crossroads going. This city has plenty of history and a ton of buildings that will never be touched, they don't reside in East Crossroads.

I'm not into saving structurally and historically irrelevant buildings so older residents can get a sense of nostalgia when they walk by them once a month. I'm into development and improving downtown as a whole.

Ending up with the 2nd best option and a subpar baseball experience so a handful of people can reminisce as they watch the 50th business in 10 years move into a bland building in East Crossroads would be very disappointing. I'm worried about the future, not the past.

Trying to stereotype everybody wanting to save our past as "older residents" is just demeaning. Come on man. There is nothing more bland than new buildings built today. Plenty of examples to point to there around town.

Detail us the 100s of millions of dollars the EV site costs over the crossroads.