Discuss items in the urban core outside of Downtown as described above. Everything in the core including the east side (18th & Vine area), Northeast, Plaza, Westport, Brookside, Valentine, Waldo, 39th street, & the entire midtown area.
langosta wrote: ↑Wed Jun 21, 2023 11:28 am
You have not spent much time in Europe! The youths are all the same no matter where you go. I think comparatively, maybe even worse in Europe
Unless this is a recent development, that's not something I've ever seen in Europe. I lived 11 years in Europe and travelled extensively and never saw any issues with unruly youths except for rare instances with soccer fans (and that included fans of all ages). In fact, I never really felt uncomfortable in terms of becoming the victim of physical violence while in Europe. I don't generally feel threatened in the US either but I'm far more aware of my surroundings here when out and about. I just witnessed physical violence against a beggar in the Crossroads over the weekend by several kids.
London fare evasion always seems low. I have had them check my tickets a few times so that might be why. Even this week I watched some evade there though. I have found other countries to have varied levels of enforcement and adherence. Also depends on the area you visit within each city.
Lets say for example this weekend, I went to McDonalds in central London and saw the security staff break up groups of youth inside and directly outside of the store multiple times. I don't know if I even recall having security at MCD in the US (I don't do much fast food when at home) but I have seen it in multiple countries this year.
langosta wrote: ↑Fri Jun 23, 2023 5:57 am
Lets say for example this weekend, I went to McDonalds in central London and saw the security staff break up groups of youth inside and directly outside of the store multiple times. I don't know if I even recall having security at MCD in the US (I don't do much fast food when at home) but I have seen it in multiple countries this year.
Saw this exact scenario in Dublin and Galway earlier this year
Unfortunately, security in the US is often staffed by out of shape people with hip problems, asthma or some other chronic condition that limits their physical movement. And then one of the youth's parents would sue because someone touched their kid in an attempt to break something up.
langosta wrote: ↑Wed Jun 21, 2023 11:28 am
You have not spent much time in Europe! The youths are all the same no matter where you go. I think comparatively, maybe even worse in Europe
Unless this is a recent development, that's not something I've ever seen in Europe. I lived 11 years in Europe and travelled extensively and never saw any issues with unruly youths except for rare instances with soccer fans (and that included fans of all ages). In fact, I never really felt uncomfortable in terms of becoming the victim of physical violence while in Europe. I don't generally feel threatened in the US either but I'm far more aware of my surroundings here when out and about. I just witnessed physical violence against a beggar in the Crossroads over the weekend by several kids.
London fare evasion always seems low. I have had them check my tickets a few times so that might be why. Even this week I watched some evade there though. I have found other countries to have varied levels of enforcement and adherence. Also depends on the area you visit within each city.
Lets say for example this weekend, I went to McDonalds in central London and saw the security staff break up groups of youth inside and directly outside of the store multiple times. I don't know if I even recall having security at MCD in the US (I don't do much fast food when at home) but I have seen it in multiple countries this year.
There's a difference between dozens of kids running around a shopping center and harassing the patrons than a couple of kids getting into a fight a McDonalds. But to put it into context, you can be reasonably sure the kids fighting at McDonalds in central London are not armed. That's not an assumption you can make in the US. Unfortunately, the incidents of unruly kids fighting in the US devolving into a shootout where bystanders have been impacted are now common. In that context, you can understand how Plaza patrons might be concerned about going to the Plaza, particularly in the summer months at night. It doesn't matter if their perceptions are right or wrong, businesses on the Plaza will suffer. There are plenty of options in KC for people to spend their money and they generally won't spend it areas they perceive as unsafe.
My experience in Europe is that you have a extremely small chance of being a victim of violent crime even if kids might be fighting at a McDonalds. I also would be careful if out and about when the bars close - plenty of drunks to contend with across Europe. But if you are not looking for trouble, you can almost certainly avoid it. While your chances of being victimized in the US are not that high either, they are still significantly higher than in Europe and things can turn deadly pretty quickly in the US if you are at the wrong place at the wrong time. And there are far more wrong places and wrong times in the US when compared to Europe.
langosta wrote: ↑Fri Jun 23, 2023 11:33 am
Kids are unruly everywhere is the theme. Others stated the kids being ruly is not the case overseas. I provided the perspective that they are.
That might be true. But they can be unruly, armed and dangerous here. And that's the issue with the Plaza. You might get your coke spilled by two kids fighting at McDonalds in London, but you almost certainly won't be hit by a stray bullet if that fight progresses into something more lethal. The Plaza is actually the theme and I'm just pointing out why it's an issue on the plaza where it might not be so much anywhere in Europe.
Last edited by Highlander on Fri Jun 23, 2023 10:41 pm, edited 3 times in total.
GRID wrote: ↑Wed Jun 21, 2023 11:16 amThis seems to be a worse problem in KC than many other cities. Before people go off on me, many other cities have much worse problems....
I think it seems worse in KC because KC only has a few areas in the city to go, Plaza etc. so you just see it more.
Anyway, the plaza, sometimes Crown Center, and last time I was in town, the area around Sprint Center can be overrun by urban teens and pre teens. I'm really surprised this has not become a problem on the streetcar, but once the line is much longer, it might become a problem.
I'm so sick of the younger urban crowd being totally lawless and disrespectful in this country though. One of my biggest pet peeves in DC is how people jump the turnstiles at metro stations. It's so minor yet so childish, immature and just basically shows how people just do not care bout following any rules anymore. You just don't see that in other countries to such a degree.
America's poverty/uneducated population (both urban and rural) is going to be what ends us. We have so much now.
BULLSH.....
You are deliberately lying in your last sentence? This does NOT happen in "rural" populations.
You know the truth but like everyone else you stick your head in the sand and tote the party line.
The emperor has no clothes, but you and every other progressive Democrat will never admit it.
These crimes are all out in the open, we see it in numerous videos every day.
The stats are smeared all over your face like rotten eggs.
Your face and every other Democrat.
Black crime is an epidemic, worse than 100 covids. Admit it.
^^^^THIS and a million similar crimes is why you people are all bemoaning the suburban growth and the reason KC is light years behind other cities.
KC is Detroit, STL, Memphis, CLE.
I’m from one of the larger towns in rural Kansas that has quite a high population of people living beneath the poverty line and it appears that you haven’t spent a whole lot of time in such an area to make a statement.Both the urban and rural poor show a pretty strong disrespect and strong levels of distrust towards authority figures and rules, both groups tend to not view education as an important resource, drug use is often an issue within both populations, physical and gun violence runs rampant in both populations, and in the larger rural towns, you’ll even find gang activity. Go spend time volunteering somewhere like La Junta, CO or Dodge City, KS, and tell me that crime and poverty are truly a non-issue there because they’re red-voting areas. There have been numerous businesses in those communities (and others like Salina, KS) like skating rinks, cart tracks, and more that have been driven out of business by the youth and young adults not being able to conduct themselves in a respectful manner in public. My friends in Salina (26-32 in age) have stoped going out to places like The District (bowling, go carts, arcade games) on the weekends because the teen violence has been so high that they now have mall police, private security, and Salina police watching the place. Malls in smaller communities like Salina and Bartlesville, OK have also had to instill youth escort policies because teens have been coming into the mall in large groups and fighting and vandalizing. fixtures. There were kids who I attended high school with who graduated with 2-4 kids. Poverty and a lack of good public schools in rural and urban communities will be the downfall of this country.
empires228 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 23, 2023 1:03 pm....Both the urban and rural poor show a pretty strong disrespect and strong levels of distrust towards authority figures and rules, both groups tend to not view education as an important resource, drug use is often an issue within both populations, physical and gun violence runs rampant in both populations
Clueless. Rural poor whites or urban whites do not kill each in the same numbers as urban blacks.
Rural white youth do not loot, steal, riot, vandalize, assault and murder anywhere near the rate that urban black youth do. I can't believe I have to say that to anyone with an IQ above room temperature.
empires228 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 23, 2023 1:03 pm....and in the larger rural towns, you’ll even find gang activity. Go spend time volunteering somewhere like La Junta, CO or Dodge City, KS, and tell me that crime and poverty are truly a non-issue there because they’re red-voting areas. There have been numerous businesses in those communities (and others like Salina, KS) like skating rinks, cart tracks, and more that have been driven out of business by the youth and young adults not being able to conduct themselves in a respectful manner in public.
You cherry pick a few towns and a few break ins trying to prove your nonsense. Absurd.
kcjak wrote: ↑Fri Jun 23, 2023 10:13 am
Unfortunately, security in the US is often staffed by out of shape people with hip problems, asthma or some other chronic condition that limits their physical movement. And then one of the youth's parents would sue because someone touched their kid in an attempt to break something up.
that part! most of them are there just for a check. the other half are usually gun nuts.
GRID wrote: ↑Wed Jun 21, 2023 11:16 amThis seems to be a worse problem in KC than many other cities. Before people go off on me, many other cities have much worse problems....
I think it seems worse in KC because KC only has a few areas in the city to go, Plaza etc. so you just see it more.
Anyway, the plaza, sometimes Crown Center, and last time I was in town, the area around Sprint Center can be overrun by urban teens and pre teens. I'm really surprised this has not become a problem on the streetcar, but once the line is much longer, it might become a problem.
I'm so sick of the younger urban crowd being totally lawless and disrespectful in this country though. One of my biggest pet peeves in DC is how people jump the turnstiles at metro stations. It's so minor yet so childish, immature and just basically shows how people just do not care bout following any rules anymore. You just don't see that in other countries to such a degree.
America's poverty/uneducated population (both urban and rural) is going to be what ends us. We have so much now.
BULLSH.....
You are deliberately lying in your last sentence? This does NOT happen in "rural" populations.
You know the truth but like everyone else you stick your head in the sand and tote the party line.
The emperor has no clothes, but you and every other progressive Democrat will never admit it.
These crimes are all out in the open, we see it in numerous videos every day.
The stats are smeared all over your face like rotten eggs.
Your face and every other Democrat.
Black crime is an epidemic, worse than 100 covids. Admit it.
Highlander wrote: ↑Wed Jun 21, 2023 3:47 pmIn fact, I never really felt uncomfortable in terms of becoming the victim of physical violence while in Europe. I don't generally feel threatened in the US either but I'm far more aware of my surroundings here when out and about.
The data doesn't back up that feeling, unless the only physical violence you worry about is being shot.
GRID wrote: ↑Wed Jun 21, 2023 4:14 pm
Violent crime is worse in urban areas, but crime in general is very high in high poverty rural areas. The "red" states, since you want to be political, have just as much or more crime per capita than blue states and almost always have higher poverty and lower education rates.
There is some pretty fascinating data about the correlation between ethnic settlement patterns in the US and violent crime, especially with regards to the Scots-Irish and other "honor cultures".
Noahfleshman wrote: ↑Sun Jun 25, 2023 6:48 pm
Idk quit trying to defund the police, and pouring tax dollars into sports.
Alternately, you could quit giving the police ALL THE MONEY to do a bunch of tasks - tasks that they are objectively very, very bad at - that aren't policing, and instead give that money to the organizations that are designed to handle those tasks and which do them measurably better.
Highlander wrote: ↑Wed Jun 21, 2023 3:47 pmIn fact, I never really felt uncomfortable in terms of becoming the victim of physical violence while in Europe. I don't generally feel threatened in the US either but I'm far more aware of my surroundings here when out and about.
The data doesn't back up that feeling, unless the only physical violence you worry about is being shot.
Precisely. It was wild how many more times I was approached and harassed while I lived and Europe, than I have been in the US. I’ve also heard (anecdotally) of many more people I had known either be assaulted or mugged while stationed in Europe than in the US. Just my experiences though.
It's not being assaulted, approached, or harassed that is unique to the United States. It's the gun violence. Being robbed in America is a different ball game all together, especially in Kansas City. You wouldn't know it's about to happen until their kicking in your door, and that mostly happens to dope dealers who will never report it, and whom I assume no one on this board has any affiliation with to confirm. Europeans will tell you themselves, Americans are violent, and they're not wrong.
daGOAT wrote: ↑Mon Jun 26, 2023 1:34 pmEuropeans will tell you themselves, Americans are violent, and they're not wrong.
Europeans will tell you all kinds of stuff about Americans, and usually they don't have a very good sense of what they are talking about. They are about as ignorant of us as they pretend we are of them, and most of the things they think they know are just regurgitated nonsense.
