Generic ongoing KCATA thread

Transportation topics in KC
shinatoo
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

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KC_Ari
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

Post by KC_Ari »

KC used to have an electric intercity rail as well as the streetcar network? Man that's depressing
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

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TheLastGentleman
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

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KC_Ari wrote: Thu May 25, 2023 8:50 pm
KC used to have an electric intercity rail as well as the streetcar network? Man that's depressing
And overhead wire trolley buses!
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GRID
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

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FangKC wrote: Thu May 25, 2023 5:15 pm Or would they run it mostly along the former St. Joseph Interurban rail right-of-way (that sits east of the airport) along Congress down Green Hills to NW Waukomis Drive through Northmoor and RIverside to the RR tracks? This has the benefit of also building some dense TOD nodes at rail stops along the line.
If it happens, I hope they use this corridor (same general corridor of the city backed light rail plan). Commuter rail running way out in the boonies would be a waste of time and money. Would be much better to spend that money on a nice airport bus route using coach buses with luggage racks that run every 15 minutes.

I still think that is what needs to be done for the world cup anyway (and permanently till LRT can be built which is decades out). Simply run coach style buses from KCI direct to downtown every 15 minutes. Not sure why that's so hard. It would cost a fraction of rail and be far more efficient for airport users than trains which will take at least twice as long to make the same journey with many stops. Especially if it's street running light rail. That will take over an hour to get from KCI to downtown. A bus will take 15-20 minutes.

LRT to KCI will be more about building up the corridor between downtown and KCI than serving KCI. You will get more people to ride a bus if their destination is KCI and they are originating downtown.

LRT will have more total ridership because it will server a much broader area, but KCI will not be the driver of ridership for a LRT line.
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im2kull
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

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KCPowercat wrote: Thu May 25, 2023 9:10 am why even say that Lucas. There is 0.0% chance that could happen in 3 years.
Prep work has been done.
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Anthony_Hugo98
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

Post by Anthony_Hugo98 »

KC_Ari wrote: Thu May 25, 2023 8:50 pm
KC used to have an electric intercity rail as well as the streetcar network? Man that's depressing
300 plus miles of streetcar line at that. Somewhere I read it was over 700-800 miles of interurban total, unsure how accurate that one is, as there’s less info floating around about the interurbans. Regardless still a massive regional system. You could ride on a train from Paola all the way to St Jo making 1-2 total transfers.
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

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im2kull wrote: Thu May 25, 2023 11:41 pm
KCPowercat wrote: Thu May 25, 2023 9:10 am why even say that Lucas. There is 0.0% chance that could happen in 3 years.
Prep work has been done.
Lol ok
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

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KCPowercat wrote: Fri May 26, 2023 10:44 am
im2kull wrote: Thu May 25, 2023 11:41 pm
KCPowercat wrote: Thu May 25, 2023 9:10 am why even say that Lucas. There is 0.0% chance that could happen in 3 years.
Prep work has been done.
Lol ok
May not be totally off base. A major decision maker had brought up this project a while ago
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DaveKCMO
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

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Guys, it's not possible. You are totally off base. The Mayor is wrong. Consider this:

- The tax generates ~$35 million a year, which already supports our anemic bus system. Just replacing the North Oak bus with LRT doesn't get you there. It only runs 30/60 minute headways today.
- You can't redirect money from a federally-funded bus system to federally-funded light rail (here's one reason why and here's another)
- The $350 million the tax would raise is not enough to build a $2 billion light rail line without federal funding.
- The federal process simply would not allow planning, design, and construction in three years.
- Even if the tax revenue could be bonded to build something in three years, you wouldn't have any money left to operate it.
- The 10-year term is insane for funding a light rail line, which has to be maintained in a "state of good repair" for 25 years if you accept federal money (which is why the streetcar TDD lasts 25 years).
- Would this or the next Council buy off on such a project given what we went through to get the streetcar starter line and extensions approved? Those weren't all unanimous votes and stakes were much lower.

The Mayor isn't going to tank the sales tax renewal with this talk, but he will lose credibility by telling people it can happen when it can't. Let me be clear that there are no technical experts advising him that this is possible.

The sad thing is they could be proposing an additional 1/8-cent that is authorized but has not be put in front of voters. That would have at least added some new bus service.
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

Post by langosta »

They think they can build this rail for extremely cheap by using mostly existing ROW. Same strategy as the commuter trail.
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

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langosta wrote: Fri May 26, 2023 7:36 pm They think they can build this rail for extremely cheap by using mostly existing ROW. Same strategy as the commuter trail.
That’s what Clay Chastain thinks, too. Just go out and trace the interurban ROW yourself and see what the ridership potential might be.
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

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DaveKCMO wrote: Sat May 27, 2023 7:02 am
langosta wrote: Fri May 26, 2023 7:36 pm They think they can build this rail for extremely cheap by using mostly existing ROW. Same strategy as the commuter trail.
That’s what Clay Chastain thinks, too. Just go out and trace the interurban ROW yourself and see what the ridership potential might be.
I don’t particularly think it’s doable but that is the thought process as I understand it. If you can truly build out the corridor for super cheap low ridership is less of an issue. + can ensure future construction and reconstruction is denser and more urban.

I would vote yes on a tax for this project *if* they actually can deliver at a low cost per mile. If it’s apples to apples we are just wasting our time when we should be doing east west or Waldo or even OP.
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

Post by im2kull »

langosta wrote: Sat May 27, 2023 7:26 am
DaveKCMO wrote: Sat May 27, 2023 7:02 am
langosta wrote: Fri May 26, 2023 7:36 pm They think they can build this rail for extremely cheap by using mostly existing ROW. Same strategy as the commuter trail.
That’s what Clay Chastain thinks, too. Just go out and trace the interurban ROW yourself and see what the ridership potential might be.
I don’t particularly think it’s doable but that is the thought process as I understand it. If you can truly build out the corridor for super cheap low ridership is less of an issue. + can ensure future construction and reconstruction is denser and more urban.

I would vote yes on a tax for this project *if* they actually can deliver at a low cost per mile. If it’s apples to apples we are just wasting our time when we should be doing east west or Waldo or even OP.
+1
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

Post by TheSmokinPun »

I know cars have the majority blame but it's still always heartbreaking to read about how many public transit options bit it during the Great Depression & just never came back. We rebuilt the country but not always in the best ways.
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

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Is it just me (and I'm too lazy to look up the timing) but it seems like every bus going up/down Grand is on the exact same timing through downtown so they are always basically back to back. Defeats the purpose of using Grand as a common bus street IMO. If I miss that time they all run I'm out of luck for 30 minutes.
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DaveKCMO
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

Post by DaveKCMO »

Kimley Horn was selected to do the KCATA/MARC airport transit study.
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

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DaveKCMO wrote: Fri Jun 23, 2023 10:18 am Kimley Horn was selected to do the KCATA/MARC airport transit study.
KCATA/MARC has a study and KCMO is looking for proposals
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Re: Generic ongoing KCATA thread

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langosta wrote: Fri Jun 23, 2023 10:33 am
DaveKCMO wrote: Fri Jun 23, 2023 10:18 am Kimley Horn was selected to do the KCATA/MARC airport transit study.
KCATA/MARC has a study and KCMO is looking for proposals
Very efficient!
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