General Amtrak Discussion

Transportation topics in KC
langosta
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by langosta »

WoodDraw wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 12:08 pm Amtrak is just terrible, and I take it often. If you could blow it up and start over, you'd focus on highspeed corridors, and then branch out from there once they're successful.

There are a good four or five that would be really good in the US. Instead we just spread the money around aimlessly, spend far too much, and enjoy a very pathetic system.
Essential Air Service + Amtrak Long Distance should be combined. END EAS and use Rail/Bus to connect rural areas to cities.

Focus on city-city corridors would be a lot more exciting if we could rebuild tracks in interstate ROW.
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smh
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by smh »

langosta wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 12:22 pm Focus on city-city corridors would be a lot more exciting if we could rebuild tracks in interstate ROW.
I would like to see Jeff City (ha, I know) use some of the budget surplus along with the I-70 widening money to study a new passenger route connecting KC, Columbia, and St. Louis with a handful of other stops.

I read a past study (I think roughly 2007) of the existing River Runner route that Dave shared awhile back. It recommended a series of improvements to the River Runner trackage, all of which have been constructed in the intervening years yet the River Runner remains slow and unreliable due to freight interference. Need to start pushing for something different, a study of an I-70ish alignment would be a great first step.
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alejandro46
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by alejandro46 »

smh wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 12:29 pm
langosta wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 12:22 pm Focus on city-city corridors would be a lot more exciting if we could rebuild tracks in interstate ROW.
I would like to see Jeff City (ha, I know) use some of the budget surplus along with the I-70 widening money to study a new passenger route connecting KC, Columbia, and St. Louis with a handful of other stops.

I read a past study (I think roughly 2007) of the existing River Runner route that Dave shared awhile back. It recommended a series of improvements to the River Runner trackage, all of which have been constructed in the intervening years yet the River Runner remains slow and unreliable due to freight interference. Need to start pushing for something different, a study of an I-70ish alignment would be a great first step.
100% agreed. The River Runner would be great if it actually was useful, reliable and less expensive. As of now, it is too expensive and slow to justify compared to driving + multiple people in a vehicle.
WoodDraw
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by WoodDraw »

langosta wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 12:22 pm
WoodDraw wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 12:08 pm Amtrak is just terrible, and I take it often. If you could blow it up and start over, you'd focus on highspeed corridors, and then branch out from there once they're successful.

There are a good four or five that would be really good in the US. Instead we just spread the money around aimlessly, spend far too much, and enjoy a very pathetic system.
Essential Air Service + Amtrak Long Distance should be combined. END EAS and use Rail/Bus to connect rural areas to cities.

Focus on city-city corridors would be a lot more exciting if we could rebuild tracks in interstate ROW.
I guess you have to decide what you want your rail system to be. Does every little area get a station, or do we want functional trains?

You need federal legislation that gets rid of environmental reviews and local regulation, and then focus on high speed corridors.

Probably cut all long distance trains.

Build from the bottom up. Texas, Florida, north east, California. Then branch out from those once they're successful.

It'll never happen, but it's the only way to make it successful.
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FangKC
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by FangKC »

MoDOT wants to expand Amtrak in Kansas City to St. Joseph, Springfield
...
The state would like to improve the existing Amtrak route from Kansas City to St. Louis by adding another daily round trip and new stops. The Missouri River Runner already has two daily round trips and eight stops.

MoDOT is also interested in creating new Amtrak routes from Kansas City to Springfield/Branson and from Kansas City to St. Joseph.

The agency said both these areas are not currently served by Amtrak. In southwest Missouri, which includes Missouri’s third largest city, MoDOT said the closest Amtrak station is more than 100 miles away.
...
https://fox4kc.com/news/modot-wants-to- ... ringfield/
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Cratedigger
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by Cratedigger »

Missouri also expressed interest in partnering with Minnesota and Iowa for a potential Minneapolis-Des Moines-Kansas City corridor.
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smh
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by smh »

Cratedigger wrote: Wed Sep 20, 2023 8:55 am
Missouri also expressed interest in partnering with Minnesota and Iowa for a potential Minneapolis-Des Moines-Kansas City corridor.
MN seems particularly serious about this corridor as a way to get to Texas (from what I can tell). Anyone have additional thoughts/know more?
TheUrbanRoo
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by TheUrbanRoo »

smh wrote: Wed Sep 20, 2023 9:22 am
Cratedigger wrote: Wed Sep 20, 2023 8:55 am
Missouri also expressed interest in partnering with Minnesota and Iowa for a potential Minneapolis-Des Moines-Kansas City corridor.
MN seems particularly serious about this corridor as a way to get to Texas (from what I can tell). Anyone have additional thoughts/know more?
Well, nobody’s getting to Texas until they connect OKC to Wichita. To me that connection happening should be KC’s #1 priority.
TheSmokinPun
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by TheSmokinPun »

Take the I-35 corridor & finally put rail on it like I heard like 2 decades ago? Why not?
dukuboy1
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by dukuboy1 »

Rail would be great alternative for travel, but we need high speed rail with direct routes, limited stops, etc.

I think passenger traffic runs on the same lines as freight and freight takes priority correct? This causes delays for travelers. Rail has so much potential but it is the same time travel as automobiles.
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smh
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by smh »

dukuboy1 wrote: Wed Sep 20, 2023 10:19 am Rail would be great alternative for travel, but we need high speed rail with direct routes, limited stops, etc.

I think passenger traffic runs on the same lines as freight and freight takes priority correct? This causes delays for travelers. Rail has so much potential but it is the same time travel as automobiles.
Agreed. We really need to be thinking about building new passenger corridors. Small digression, but I wish as part of the I-70 widening the MO government would have at least put in a few hundred thousand to study a new passenger alignment between KC/STL via Columbia roughly mirroring I-70
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by WoodDraw »

I tried to take the Amtrak home from stl yesterday. At the Sedalia stop they’re like it’s going to be at least a three hour delay because of a freight train on the track that couldn’t get to siding.

They openly said if you have anyway to not stay here, take it.

I was lucky to meet two other solo people able to afford a very expensive Uber ride to Union station we all split.

At 11:15 (I was already home) got a text saying the train wasn’t going to make it at all, and alternate transportation would be provided.


I don’t know what our train policy should be, but it’s not this.
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TheLastGentleman
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by TheLastGentleman »

The state of our passenger rail would be treated as a national emergency in a remotely normal competent country
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by KC_Ari »

The laws on the books need enforced. And hopefully a side effect is the end of PSR
WoodDraw
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by WoodDraw »

In my relatively uninformed opinion we spend too much money on making sure every place gets a stop and the completely fucking stupid cross country rail.

We need to focus on rail coridors and having transit between them.

Instead we have a system that's a combination of parochial interests and train fetishists.
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smh
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by smh »

WoodDraw wrote: Wed Dec 27, 2023 5:33 pm I tried to take the Amtrak home from stl yesterday. At the Sedalia stop they’re like it’s going to be at least a three hour delay because of a freight train on the track that couldn’t get to siding.

They openly said if you have anyway to not stay here, take it.

I was lucky to meet two other solo people able to afford a very expensive Uber ride to Union station we all split.

At 11:15 (I was already home) got a text saying the train wasn’t going to make it at all, and alternate transportation would be provided.


I don’t know what our train policy should be, but it’s not this.
What's doubly frustrating about this situation is that a report in ~2007 made a series of recommendations to limit passenger delays due to freight movement along the River Runner corridor. It include things like building new sidings, adding a second bridge over the Gasconade River (I may have the wrong river name), etc. As far as I could tell from a cursory review of satellite imagery, all or most of these recommendations were implemented. In the meantime however, freight trains grew in length and from what I can tell rendered many of the improvements, particularly sidings, somewhat useless.
langosta
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by langosta »

smh wrote: Thu Dec 28, 2023 9:45 am
WoodDraw wrote: Wed Dec 27, 2023 5:33 pm I tried to take the Amtrak home from stl yesterday. At the Sedalia stop they’re like it’s going to be at least a three hour delay because of a freight train on the track that couldn’t get to siding.

They openly said if you have anyway to not stay here, take it.

I was lucky to meet two other solo people able to afford a very expensive Uber ride to Union station we all split.

At 11:15 (I was already home) got a text saying the train wasn’t going to make it at all, and alternate transportation would be provided.


I don’t know what our train policy should be, but it’s not this.
What's doubly frustrating about this situation is that a report in ~2007 made a series of recommendations to limit passenger delays due to freight movement along the River Runner corridor. It include things like building new sidings, adding a second bridge over the Gasconade River (I may have the wrong river name), etc. As far as I could tell from a cursory review of satellite imagery, all or most of these recommendations were implemented. In the meantime however, freight trains grew in length and from what I can tell rendered many of the improvements, particularly sidings, somewhat useless.
Brightline is double tracked everywhere but where it’s the only service iirc
herrfrank
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by herrfrank »

Brightline is double tracked I think all the way from Cocoa Beach to Miami -- and there is some freight activity on that line (Florida East Coast Railroad - the original Henry M. Flagler line). The freight tends to run at night, usually it's mixed freight with mostly gravel/ coquina stone going north from the surface mines near Miami.
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DColeKC
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by DColeKC »

This country has been talking about improving rail and implementing high speed rail for almost 60 years now. It's almost like some kind of special interest groups don't want it to happen. ;)
WoodDraw
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Re: General Amtrak Discussion

Post by WoodDraw »

I mean running passenger on privately owned rail will always have issues. The incentives aren't aligned. I know the laws but they're not enforced.

Trains have changed a lot and while every place wants a stop, none of the people in charge actually use them.

So we fought for a huge network with awful reliability. Worst of both worlds.
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