Make Grand Grand

Issues concerning Downtown as described by the Downtown Council. River to 31st Street, I-35 to Bruce R. Watkins.
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KCPowercat
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by KCPowercat »

Some huge planters in those dead spaces would be nice. Just have to be small enough not to block views to make drivers pulling out sit in the bike lane or pulling in not see a biker
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AlkaliAxel
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by AlkaliAxel »

So basically this entire thing is just coming down to whether they’ll actually put the landscaping in or not
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FangKC
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by FangKC »

I've looked at that block. As far as I'm concerned there is no reason it couldn't have the entire median a raised planter with landscaping and trees. You don't even need turn lanes presently since the cross streets are one-way, and there isn't really a need for a turn lane to enter the garage. Come in from the north. The surface lot could enter and exit using the existing alley. Take out the entrance on Grand entirely.

Much denser cities find ways to include tree canopies. Big fail for a City that is constantly bragging about its' parks and boulevards system.
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im2kull
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by im2kull »

AlkaliAxel wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 2:38 pm I think I finally understand the plan here.

So, they're only going to fund this south of Truman...and it's only going to look like Gillham with just bollards, curb bumpouts & no green paint.

Is that it? So we end up with no landscaping, just bumpouts?
Yes. No landscaping. Paint and cheap, flimsy plastic 24" bollards for the cool total of $4.3 million dollars.

Should I even mention that the stop lights no longer line up with the lanes? They're about 12ft off in either direction.
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GRID
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by GRID »

FangKC wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 9:04 pm I've looked at that block. As far as I'm concerned there is no reason it couldn't have the entire median a raised planter with landscaping and trees. You don't even need turn lanes presently since the cross streets are one-way, and there isn't really a need for a turn lane to enter the garage. Come in from the north. The surface lot could enter and exit using the existing alley. Take out the entrance on Grand entirely.

Much denser cities find ways to include tree canopies. Big fail for a City that is constantly bragging about its' parks and boulevards system.
Yeah, they have a ton of space to work with. What is the point of the 20 foot wide chicken lane? The little bollards will help, but it will come down to how well the city maintains all that. Also, doesn't downtown KC have a problem with people tearing up the streets by doing donuts etc? Hopefully the city is able to stay on top of that as well.

The main issue to make that a success and for to be used is to quickly make it a seamless connection from the River Market through the crossroads and then to the Gillham road cycle track. Hopefully it does not stay just a few blocks long for very long or it likely will just deteriorate are be barely used.
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KCPowercat
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by KCPowercat »

Doesn't every city have dorks doing donuts in the streets? I know I've seen the 4 wheeler crews in the middle of midtown Manhattan.

Yeah some big planters would be nice in those spaces. I don't mind the wider middle with all the service vehicles Grand needs to serve.
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GRID
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by GRID »

KCPowercat wrote: Sat Aug 06, 2022 10:15 am Doesn't every city have dorks doing donuts in the streets? I know I've seen the 4 wheeler crews in the middle of midtown Manhattan.

Yeah some big planters would be nice in those spaces. I don't mind the wider middle with all the service vehicles Grand needs to serve.
Not really with the whole shutting down intersections and taking it over like I have seen a lot in Downtown KC. That's more of a thing on the outskirts of downtowns like industrial areas etc. But yeah, the urban four wheeler thing is a problem in a lot places. It's quite embarrassing for America in general and shows how uncivilized our country has become.
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KCPowercat
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by KCPowercat »

The 4 wheeler thing seems pretty stupid but harmless

Seems happening in other downtowns
https://youtu.be/du2iMZHh5rk

https://youtu.be/yEAdcc08d0k

https://youtu.be/yK4z0RraudU
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DColeKC
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by DColeKC »

KCPowercat wrote: Sat Aug 06, 2022 10:53 am The 4 wheeler thing seems pretty stupid but harmless

Seems happening in other downtowns
https://youtu.be/du2iMZHh5rk

https://youtu.be/yEAdcc08d0k

https://youtu.be/yK4z0RraudU
Def not harmless. It just takes them antagonizing one idiot who bites and we've got a problem. Not to mention, they don't always have class. Doing stunts and being obnoxious during a concert for example.

Looks like a complete blast though.
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KCPowercat
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by KCPowercat »

But that idiot can also be antagonized by a car or biker or scooter or pedestrian.

Definitely don't need a 4 wheeler to be obnoxious.
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DColeKC
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by DColeKC »

KCPowercat wrote: Sat Aug 06, 2022 11:41 am But that idiot can also be antagonized by a car or biker or scooter or pedestrian.

Definitely don't need a 4 wheeler to be obnoxious.
I think the 4-wheeler crew purposely try to start shit. They're a lot more fun riding them off-road and away from traffic yet they like to blow past road closed signs and cause general chaos. It's not about the ride, it's about the disruption. Only speaking from my limited encounters with them.

This isn't even factoring in that what they're doing is illegal. So it's all about defying authority.
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normalthings
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by normalthings »

DColeKC wrote: Sat Aug 06, 2022 1:16 pm
KCPowercat wrote: Sat Aug 06, 2022 11:41 am But that idiot can also be antagonized by a car or biker or scooter or pedestrian.

Definitely don't need a 4 wheeler to be obnoxious.
I think the 4-wheeler crew purposely try to start shit. They're a lot more fun riding them off-road and away from traffic yet they like to blow past road closed signs and cause general chaos. It's not about the ride, it's about the disruption. Only speaking from my limited encounters with them.

This isn't even factoring in that what they're doing is illegal. So it's all about defying authority.
not to mention the sound is also disruptive
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KCPowercat
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by KCPowercat »

All the things we're talking about can be put to annoying cars too. I mean I think the whole craze is dumb and sorry I mentioned it.
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AlkaliAxel
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by AlkaliAxel »

Start ticketing every single car that parks in a bike lane and they’ll get the hint.

Also, I saw last night that the lanes with curb protection were safe from cars, but the ones with just bollards were getting abused.
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by KCPowercat »

Wish we could invest a little more than bollards and parking stall concrete stops but I know we are balling on a budget with this stuff.

Maybe dcid can add in planters on their dime.
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by gfenn11 »

AssertiveKnit wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 11:54 am Bollards are up!

Image
They filled in the flex posts on the NB side so that the MAX platform is inaccessible, and the SB side also has a very sharp turn the bus drivers have to make. So I feel for the bus drivers (and riders) and hope that the SB side doesn't become too much of a pinch point for cyclists since they should have angled out a route before the platform for a "switch" to occur and not be trapped directly behind an angled bus.

A section in front of UMB between the alley and MAX platform also doesn't have any posts or anything installed (hopefully that's not finished) and of course is entirely blocked by illegal parking.
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by shinatoo »

Will this layout be extended the rest of the way along Grand? While not perfect, I like it better than the faded layout of the previous bike lanes.

Also, why is the street closed off?
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AlkaliAxel
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by AlkaliAxel »

If this just gets green paint I think it will suffice well for now
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by gfenn11 »

shinatoo wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 6:58 pm Will this layout be extended the rest of the way along Grand? While not perfect, I like it better than the faded layout of the previous bike lanes.

Also, why is the street closed off?
I wish they would've done Independence-Truman, but we're gonna be stuck with the current layout (and faded paint) for at least the next 5 years as it is not included in the 5 year bike plan. But Grand South of Truman also isn't listed but is getting a closer look with the Grand Grand plan, so who knows?

There was an event all weekend at T-Mobile & it's the usual weekend shut down.
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by DColeKC »

shinatoo wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 6:58 pm Will this layout be extended the rest of the way along Grand? While not perfect, I like it better than the faded layout of the previous bike lanes.

Also, why is the street closed off?
Grand between 13th and 14th will have slightly different delineators that can be removed. I'll assume those are backordered and won't be installed for some time.
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