Plaza City Club Apartments

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normalthings
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Plaza City Club Apartments

Post by normalthings »

Plaza Club City Apartments by City Club Apartment Group
Image

https://www.cityclubapartments.com/usa/ ... club/info/

Does anyone know much about this apartment building? I'm the "go to" apartment expert in my friend group but know nothing about this place.
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

Post by moderne »

The old Dunleith Towers.
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

Post by normalthings »

These are not nice on the inside
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Chris Stritzel
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

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Goonies wrote: Wed Nov 17, 2021 7:23 pm
normalthings wrote: Fri Oct 29, 2021 11:07 pm These are not nice on the inside
What's wrong with the inside?
I can't speak for what NormalThings saw, but when I walked trough and was shown vacant units, the ceiling heights were too short (ceiling fans made it worse), doorways were narrower than normal, elevators were very small, hallways were dark, and stairwells were sketchy (but were able to get you around faster than waiting for en elevator). The cherry on top with this property was the units I was shown look like the occupant up and left and the property didn't send a cleaning crew in to do basic repairs and cleaning. There was hair in the bathrooms, water damage on some of the ceilings, and a musty smell in the units I was shown.

Also, the parking garage was as nasty as could be. It made sense why no one was parked in it.

I get that these are cheaper than other properties in the area, and the property website makes the units and property look good, but this is just pitiful (in my view). Literally, a little effort would go a long way in making these so much better than they are (really, just make them more presentable).
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

Post by FangKC »

Did they renovate the entire building, or are they perhaps renovating units as they come open?
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Chris Stritzel
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

Post by Chris Stritzel »

FangKC wrote: Wed Nov 17, 2021 8:39 pm Did they renovate the entire building, or are they perhaps renovating units as they come open?
The three units I saw were all "recently renovated". They could still be renovating, but it didnt seem like it.
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

Post by normalthings »

Goonies wrote: Wed Nov 17, 2021 7:23 pm
normalthings wrote: Fri Oct 29, 2021 11:07 pm These are not nice on the inside
What's wrong with the inside?
They forgot to remove the dead bugs and smells of mold in common spaces. There are multiple levels of remodel ranging from relatively ok to just a coat of new paint.
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

Post by Link2 »

normalthings wrote: Wed Nov 17, 2021 9:57 pm
Goonies wrote: Wed Nov 17, 2021 7:23 pm
normalthings wrote: Fri Oct 29, 2021 11:07 pm These are not nice on the inside
What's wrong with the inside?
They forgot to remove the dead bugs and smells of mold in common spaces. There are multiple levels of remodel ranging from relatively ok to just a coat of new paint.
From this past summer:

https://fox4kc.com/news/problem-solvers ... ditioning/

https://fox4kc.com/news/residents-at-ka ... not-fixed/
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

Post by gfenn11 »

Goonies wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 1:19 pm That sounds disgusting. I checked their website the shower still looks outdated and if you scroll to the bottom they have something listed as "sexy bathrooms" which is odd.
That's a thing they do company-wide. I'm staying at a property in Chicago and my "sexy" bathroom has tan walls and floor tiles with white subway tiles in the bathtub that is missing about half the grout.

I had some friends that lived in the Plaza building and had issues with the heating/cooling years ago as well. Sounds like incompetent management.
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

Post by FangKC »

It sounds like someone else should buy that building and give it a complete systems renovation.
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

Post by Chris Stritzel »

FangKC wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 7:33 pm It sounds like someone else should buy that building and give it a complete systems renovation.
I'd say these are borderline teardown and build new. No doubt you could make them nice again, but it'll be a huge mess
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

Post by FangKC »

We have to stop tearing down buildings just because they need renovation -- especially multi-story buildings. The Metropolitan apartment building in downtown KC was at one time in bad condition too, but they renovated it and now it's condos.

The View Condos at one time was an exposed shell of a tower that had been occupied by homeless people.

This mindset has to change, or we will never get climate change under management.
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

Post by TheLastGentleman »

Goonies wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 1:19 pm That sounds disgusting. I checked their website the shower still looks outdated and if you scroll to the bottom they have something listed as "sexy bathrooms" which is odd.
I remember the City Club downtown had “sexy bathrooms” on the construction fencing banners for a while. I haven’t been following, are both buildings the same company? That doesn’t bode well for the downtown location.....
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

Post by TheLastGentleman »

Goonies wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 10:26 pm
TheLastGentleman wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 10:17 pm
Goonies wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 1:19 pm That sounds disgusting. I checked their website the shower still looks outdated and if you scroll to the bottom they have something listed as "sexy bathrooms" which is odd.
I remember the City Club downtown had “sexy bathrooms” on the construction fencing banners for a while. I haven’t been following, are both buildings the same company? That doesn’t bode well for the downtown location.....
I'm not a prude or anything but to sell something like a bathroom as "sexy" just seems weird to me idk maybe I'm in the minority on that.
I meant more in terms of management. If the plaza city club is in a state of decay, it makes me wonder how long the downtown one will last
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

Post by dukuboy1 »

FangKC wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 9:47 pm We have to stop tearing down buildings just because they need renovation -- especially multi-story buildings. The Metropolitan apartment building in downtown KC was at one time in bad condition too, but they renovated it and now it's condos.

The View Condos at one time was an exposed shell of a tower that had been occupied by homeless people.

This mindset has to change, or we will never get climate change under management.
I agree in principle to the idea. However in some cases a tear down & new building may be more environmentally friendly. New buildings are built to more efficient standards using materials to promote these efficiencies and help keep maintenance & utility costs as low as possible. Renovating old buildings may cost more to add same features. Plus they may have older materials such as asbestos, lead paint/pipes, outdated electrical that cost money to remediate and replace. Plus renovations may not change design/layout of building. If hallways are dark and elevators smaller typically those issues will remain after renovation as the building design itself may not allow for improvements. There s nothing architecturally distinct or historic to these buildings. If they were gore down not a big deal and the new building would most likely have a lesser carbon footprint. Maybe in the first years from tear down to build it is higher but once finished the long run of the building would be
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

Post by normalthings »

TheLastGentleman wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 10:33 pm
Goonies wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 10:26 pm
TheLastGentleman wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 10:17 pm

I remember the City Club downtown had “sexy bathrooms” on the construction fencing banners for a while. I haven’t been following, are both buildings the same company? That doesn’t bode well for the downtown location.....
I'm not a prude or anything but to sell something like a bathroom as "sexy" just seems weird to me idk maybe I'm in the minority on that.
I meant more in terms of management. If the plaza city club is in a state of decay, it makes me wonder how long the downtown one will last
I mean I think its quality has improved under the City Club management. Its just an old property that needs an even deeper renovation.

This project is not in a condition to get bulldozed. Units are worth way too much to make it profitable
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

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dukuboy1 wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:23 am
... However in some cases a tear down & new building may be more environmentally friendly. New buildings are built to more efficient standards using materials to promote these efficiencies and help keep maintenance & utility costs as low as possible. Renovating old buildings may cost more to add same features. Plus they may have older materials such as asbestos, lead paint/pipes, outdated electrical that cost money to remediate and replace. Plus renovations may not change design/layout of building. If hallways are dark and elevators smaller typically those issues will remain after renovation as the building design itself may not allow for improvements. There s nothing architecturally distinct or historic to these buildings. If they were gore down not a big deal and the new building would most likely have a lesser carbon footprint. Maybe in the first years from tear down to build it is higher but once finished the long run of the building would be
https://www.architectsjournal.co.uk/new ... ady-exists

...
"The report concluded that ‘reusing an existing building and upgrading it to be as efficient as possible is almost always the best choice regardless of building type and climate’. "
...
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Re: Plaza City Club Apartments

Post by dukuboy1 »

FangKC wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 4:01 am
dukuboy1 wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:23 am
... However in some cases a tear down & new building may be more environmentally friendly. New buildings are built to more efficient standards using materials to promote these efficiencies and help keep maintenance & utility costs as low as possible. Renovating old buildings may cost more to add same features. Plus they may have older materials such as asbestos, lead paint/pipes, outdated electrical that cost money to remediate and replace. Plus renovations may not change design/layout of building. If hallways are dark and elevators smaller typically those issues will remain after renovation as the building design itself may not allow for improvements. There s nothing architecturally distinct or historic to these buildings. If they were gore down not a big deal and the new building would most likely have a lesser carbon footprint. Maybe in the first years from tear down to build it is higher but once finished the long run of the building would be
https://www.architectsjournal.co.uk/new ... ady-exists

...
"The report concluded that ‘reusing an existing building and upgrading it to be as efficient as possible is almost always the best choice regardless of building type and climate’. "
...
thank you for sharing, interesting article and good info to consider. I would tend to agree along the impacts when strictly focusing on environmental impacts and consumption of energy used vs. the return on the "green energy" and climate impact. Stands to reason that less energy involved overall in the project leads to less impact on the climate. Plus the gains from becoming more efficient & using less energy to do so has that 1-2 punch. Especially compared to the 10-80 yrs (as the article mentions) of new building becoming par to climate impact from energy used from renovations vs. tear down & rebuild. However there were some other metrics mentioned about a 30yr benchmark. Indicating that the formulas become a little closer to each other when you are talking about tearing down and replacing buildings older than 30yrs.

I also found this quote at the beginning "As there are so many variables involved in a decision to demolish, including the embodied energy of what is demolished and the energy consumed in construction, there are no universal comparative metrics."

I think there would be times and scenarios where both are appropriate. And the article does not mention costs, which will drive not only the desire to change (i.e. renovating or building new) but the likelihood it will happen at all.

I'm not sure how old these Plaza buildings are but I can assume they went up in the late 70's early 80"s? If this is the case those building are closer to 50yrs old than they are 30. This may be a driver, along with the feasibility of doing things they want, such as making elevators bigger, adding more natural lighting etc. The design of the existing building may not allow for those changes to be made without significant cost.

Very good discussion to consider for sure, especially in the US where the norm has always been more likely to tear down and replace as to preserve and re-use. The result of being a "younger nation" that has had more access to wealth and is much less densely populated overall than Europe. More money and available land, or ability to use current land more freely, has led us down a different path than others. Some of it for the worse, some of it for the better
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