KCMO Downtown Streetcar

[staubio]

  I fear fixed transit in the RCP has just absolutely dropped off the map in terms of KCMO, and really regional plans have as well.  Where is our uber-pro regional transit mayor right now? 

or ANY leader in a position of power in this city. Say what you will about Kay Barnes but she knew how to motivate people, get people excited, champion a cause and inspire folks to join her. There is a drastic shortage of leadership in this city.

[aknowledgeableperson]

  can anyone explain why the RCP starter line has not been made the number one stimulus priority for the city, particularly by mayor Funkhouser and KCMO? 

VERY SIMPLE.  IT LOST AT THE POLLS.

[staubio]

VERY SIMPLE.  IT LOST AT THE POLLS.

Well, one specific, hastily assembled attempt lost at the polls. This is not an indication of the public's lack of interest in light rail in general.

[aknowledgeableperson]

But not the whole public.  So, yes, there are some of the public that have this as a prime objective but for a majority it would appear to be far down the priority list of things to get done.

[staubio]

But not the whole public.  So, yes, there are some of the public that have this as a prime objective but for a majority it would appear to be far down the priority list of things to get done.

Do you mean that different people have different opinions?

Wow, that hadn't occurred to me! Thanks!

[DaveKCMO]

if the price tag really is just $400 million, there is potential for public-private partnership, TDD, or some other method that could avoid a new city-wide tax or vote. regardless, that doesn't change the fact that the ATA will have a completed AA this year for the RCP line and has it on their stimulus wish list (which will be granting 100% funding for projects, btw) that MARC is managing and may have input on project selection.

there is also potential for about $5 billion in stimulus funds that could be spent at the discretion of the USDOT for projects costing between $20-500 million each (that pot gets larger if "use or lose it" transportation funding is not used). if that amendment survives the floor vote this week in the House, and eventually the Senate, it's possible that KCMO could receive 100% capital funding. this would not solve the operational cost issues, of course.

all a long shot, but worth watching. otherwise, we'll be looking at some three-county vote whenever mike sanders thinks it's a priority again (don't hold your breath).

[enough]

unfortunately, even with a completed aa, lrt in the rcp corridor will be far from "shovel-ready."  (i hate that term.)

[rxlexi]

  I think Staubio makes a good point re: the leadership vacuum in KCMO.  However, at this point I'm starting to point the finger at Funk.  The RCP line failed, okay so brush off and renew the regional/JackCo talks that were started hastily last summer. 

  Keep this thing a high priority, or just sit back and watch it die on the vine.  Funk has championed regional rail transit in the very recent past and has made a point of discussing transit as key part of his campaign and the future of the city and region. 

  Regional transit needs solid salesmanship and leadership now more than ever, and I am not seeing any hardcore campaigning on the part of the Funk, who, it should be noted AKP, has never let the opinion of  others dictate his priorities. 

[TheBigChuckbowski]

Where is our uber-pro regional transit mayor right now?

Starting up his consulting business.

[enough]

^^ at a meeting in december, the chief elected officials of the three counties made it clear that they were taking the regional transit issue away from funkhouser -- and funk sat there and took it.  sanders is the presumptive new regional leader, but i'm not convinced he knows where to lead.  near term, i can't see anybody seriously proposing a regional rail system.

[ComandanteCero]

A regional network of true BRT lines is the best plan.  If we go to rail in the future it should be exclusive R.O.W rail, not street running, since there is no improvement in transit service for street running rail vs true BRT.  The only arguments for streetcars vs BRT are vague promises of development due to perceived "permanence" and the marginal increase in attractiveness for new riders.  I used to latch on to those arguments when trying to justify the RCP starter line, but honestly, looking at it objectively it's bull shit.

We could build a true BRT line for 20 million dollars per mile (that's on the very high side for BRT, usually caused by having to build new tunnels and such, but i'm using the high figure to be as generous as possible), and then throw in 10 million dollars worth of incentives for each mile (along with TIF districts and appropriate land use policies) and still be significantly under budget compared to street running LRT.  We'd have the same quality of service and it we could actually see how the development incentives worked.

Using this transportation infrastructure we can build up density, and when it becomes necessary to switch to high capacity mass transit we can make a real proposal for elevated or underground rail through the urban core with exclusive R.O.Ws outside of it (and i think if we get to the kind of density where it becomes necessary there will be the local support to help pay for it).  Not to mention, by the time this happens PRT will either have been proven to work or not work so it might be a viable alternative as well.  But let's be clear: KC should aim for exclusive R.O.W transit (be it in the form of elevated/underground rail, or PRT), and I think true BRT is the best intermediate mode.

Commuter rail = b.s
street running LRT = b.s
Real BRT and commuter express buses throughout the region = real deal

[GRID]

ComandanteCero

I agree 100%.  Why we can't get this done, I just will never know.

We could be one hell of a BRT system in this town for what it would cost to build 5 miles of LRT.

[DaveKCMO]

since we pioneered "BRT lite", i doubt these dreams will come true either.

[BSykes]

$27M in KC-area transportation projects move toward federal funding

The Missouri Surface Transportation Program/Bridge Priorities Committee on Monday allocated the following projects and amounts:

• Troost Bridge replacement and Volker intersection improvements, Kansas City, $8 million (partial financing).

• 39th Street traffic signal upgrade, Kansas City, $400,000 (full financing).

• Route 9 and Briarcliff Parkway interchange, Kansas City, $3 million (partial financing).

• 31st Street traffic signal upgrade, Kansas City, $800,000 (full financing).

• Operation Green Light System Enhancement, 20 jurisdictions in bistate region, $3.7 million (partial financing).

• Regional Transit (Smart Moves) implementation plan, MARC, $261,250 (partial financing).

• Traffic control center, first phase, Kansas City, $750,000 (full financing).

• Street maintenance – Broadway/Old Pike, Gladstone, $378,061 (partial financing)

• Jackson Drive, Holke Road to Missouri Highway 78, Independence, $1.44 million (full financing).

• Asphalt overlay, Adams Dairy Parkway from Duncan to Moreland School Road, Blue Springs, $378,061 (partial financing).

• Principal arterial street rehabilitation, Liberty, $378,061 (partial financing).

• Lone Jack U.S. Highway 50 interchange Completion, Lone Jack, $1.5 million (partial financing).

• Raytown roadway preservation and maintenance program, Raytown, $378,061 (partial financing).

• Vivion Road (U.S. Highway 69) and Route AA Intersection improvements, Riverside, $378,061 (partial financing).

http://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/s ... ily11.html

[enough]

as of 90 minutes ago, here's how the three transit agencies propose to spend the $20,343,424 of federal transit stimulus money that the kansas city region will get:

preventive maintenance - $5.25m
ada paratransit service - $1.50m
new buses - $9.15m
facilities improvements - $4.20m
on-street facilities (aka bus stop upgrades) - $220k

this breakdown combines project amounts by category.  projects must still be approved by the transit agencies' governing bodies, and then by marc's total transportation policy committee and the marc board.

[GRID]

Will they just throw that money at the Troost BRT bus order or will that buy new buses that were not in the original short term plans?

[enough]

maybe this deserves a new thread, maybe not.

fta recently announced $25m available nationally for rail transit aa (alternatives analysis) studies.  jackson county is teaming up with kcmo and kcata to apply for $2m -- the maximum  amount available to a single applicant.  $1.4m would be for work on two legs of the commuter rail concept that mike sanders has been promoting (the rock island / lee's summit corridor and the i-70 corridor), and $600k would be to re-start planning for the downtown streetcar project.  the application deadline is july 12 and marc staff will be fully involved in developing the application.  the time line is short and the marc board today approved submitting the application without the issue having passed through either marc's transit committee of the total transportation policy commitee.

chances of getting the full $2 million are probably pretty low.  the region probably has a better chance of getting just the $600k for the downtown streetcar project. 

[trailerkid]

something i thought was interesting is that the River to Crown Center streetcar line was tagged as "essential" in the Star to the proposed commuter line. i think it's essential to the expansion of progressive, real transit in this region, but i don't find it essential to commuter rail in any way. are the MAX stops really that scary to someone from Raytown?

[nilsson1941]

something i thought was interesting is that the River to Crown Center streetcar line was tagged as "essential" in the Star to the proposed commuter line. i think it's essential to the expansion of progressive, real transit in this region, but i don't find it essential to commuter rail in any way. are the MAX stops really that scary to someone from Raytown?

I don't think a streetcar line would be essential in order to get commuter rail going, but I would think that a streetcar could carry more people than the MAX buses.

[trailerkid]

I don't think a streetcar line would be essential in order to get commuter rail going, but I would think that a streetcar could carry more people than the MAX buses.

real BRT > streetcars