Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

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town cow
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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by town cow »

I've been a bus rider since junior high days, and look forward to free rides whenever they get here.

The rise in operations costs may not be covered by municipal fare subsidies; check out this study on "ADVANTAGES AND DISADVANTAGES OF
FARE-FREE TRANSIT POLICY": http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/do ... 1&type=pdf

flyingember
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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by flyingember »

That's a really lazy article.

There's going to be a fixed cost for every bus. The idea is to fund a specific level of service and it's the same cost if there's 0 riders or if every bus is completely full. You remove a large number of variable costs from the equation by not taking fares and suddenly you can run a system that's about providing value to people with more frequent service rather than running the best service that fares can pay for.

The biggest risk is if demand goes beyond the funded level of service. If that's the case the method would be so successful that we would be stupid to not give the system more money. It would prove that there's pent up demand for transit and cost was the limiting factor.


Cost per rider needs to be the metric of success and you have to subtract out current costs. In theory if the system was given the same amount as fares coming it service could be increased.

there's no more paying to print huge amounts of passes each month
There's no more need to pay credit card fees for online sales. I would assume a percentage of each pass goes to retailers selling them as well.
You don't have to deliver fares to stores and schools and businesses each month, a savings in labor.
You don't have to buy envelopes and individually send a pass to people in the mail, a savings in labor
There's no need to validate someone is qualified for reduced fare, a savings in labor

There's no need to pay someone to do accounting around cash fares and take it to the bank, a labor savings
There's no need to pay someone to do fare validation, a labor saving

While in theory you want to maintain the fare taking system for now, if this becomes the norm there's no cost in maintaining the equipment so that's a labor saving too

Then think about the related labor costs like HR benefits if they cut the labor of 10 people that's easily $1 million in savings. So the cost to go free is going to immediately be less than the cost to take fares and that's money that can go to provide more service, improve stops and the like

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DaveKCMO
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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

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FangKC
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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by FangKC »

Free transit isn’t enough. Transportation needs to be a right.

Guaranteeing Americans universal access to opportunity would be transformative



https://www.curbed.com/2019/12/20/21031 ... ion-access

earthling
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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by earthling »

Dave... Any idea when we'll see approval (or not) for funding the free fare for next fiscal cycle? Could it take until May before we find out and could it start in May if approval not until last minute?

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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by flyingember »

earthling wrote:
Thu Jan 09, 2020 7:18 pm
Dave... Any idea when we'll see approval (or not) for funding the free fare for next fiscal cycle? Could it take until May before we find out and could it start in May if approval not until last minute?
They have to approve the budget before May since the fiscal year starts then.

Watch the city budget process.

earthling
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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by earthling »

Am aware it has to be approved before May fiscal start. That wasn't the question, and was directed to Dave.

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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by flyingember »

earthling wrote:
Thu Jan 09, 2020 7:46 pm
Am aware it has to be approved before May fiscal start. That wasn't the question, and was directed to Dave.
Again, watch the city budget process

Read ordinance 190951 for why this is the answer

Hint: the approval would be from it being funded in the budget

earthling
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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by earthling »

WTF

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DaveKCMO
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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by DaveKCMO »

You’ll have to wait a bit longer for details, but it will happen shortly after the budget takes effect.

earthling
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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by earthling »

^Thanks. Good to hear it can start shortly after.

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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

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Steve52
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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by Steve52 »

earthling wrote:
Thu Jan 09, 2020 7:18 pm
Dave... Any idea when we'll see approval (or not) for funding the free fare for next fiscal cycle? Could it take until May before we find out and could it start in May if approval not until last minute?
After everyone's property tax checks have been accounted for and cashed.

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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by DaveKCMO »

Ruckus: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nza_Rt0Kc9g

Skip to 19:00 for the zero fare discussion.

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grovester
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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by grovester »

Mayor's budget request is about 2 mil short of what's needed for fare free, says the rest will need to come from KCATA.

Does that mean from the streetcar? Does that change scoring with DOT?

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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by flyingember »

grovester wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 1:58 pm
Mayor's budget request is about 2 mil short of what's needed for fare free, says the rest will need to come from KCATA.

Does that mean from the streetcar? Does that change scoring with DOT?
Wait for the document to come out tomorrow to see the proposals

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normalthings
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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by normalthings »

grovester wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 1:58 pm
Mayor's budget request is about 2 mil short of what's needed for fare free, says the rest will need to come from KCATA.

Does that mean from the streetcar? Does that change scoring with DOT?
I assume that there will be cost savings from free fare. Funds previously put into collecting fares could be included in the KCATA portion of funding.

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grovester
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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by grovester »

Think that's already been accounted for, still 2 million short, coincidentally the same amount as the annual subsidy to the streetcar.

earthling
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Re: Pursuing FREE City-Wide Bus

Post by earthling »

Bummer if not able pull off city wide. Dave, if not, is free fare for major lines possible this year?

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