KCRag Forum

DaveKCMO wrote: ↑Sat Nov 16, 2019 10:44 am

DaveKCMO wrote: ↑Tue Nov 12, 2019 9:54 pm If you care at all about zero fare or transit priority, please attend tomorrow’s T&I committee at 9am, where the resolution to study both is on the docket.

http://cityclerk.kcmo.org/liveweb/Meeti ... c%2fzvq5Gc

This resolution passed unanimously out of committee.

Section 3. That the Council directs the City Manager to include a funding request in the next fiscal year budget to make fixed route public transportation fare free within the City.

Section 4. That the Council directs the City Manager to collaborate with the Kansas City Area Transportation Authority and engage relevant city boards and commissions and stakeholder groups in the development of recommendations for a transit priority policy. The City Manager is directed to provide a final report on such recommendations to the Council within 60 days of the passage of this Resolution.

Great news.

- When does the 'next fiscal year' start?
- How will fare work with lines that cross city limits, like 201 N Oak line going through NKC?

It starts May 1.

Model 1: you would need to pay to get on outside the city limits but can get off anywhere. This would encourage finding a job inside the city limits or biking back to KC. Simple to understand but less flexible for exceptions.

Model 2: it’s by route distance inside the city. like 39 goes to kumed but the majority of miles is in KCMO so it’s free. 201 is all free under this model. But the NKC flex route would still cost

Model 3: outbound from KC is free to the city limits while inbound is free to encourage all riders to have a destination inside KC both directions and benefits residents the most. So if you live in KCMO and work in OP it’s free both ways but if you live in OP you pay to get here.



I like model 3 because residents never pay no matter what part of the system they use while someone who lives outside the city limits has to pay for a trip one way or another unless they come into the city to work or shop. Getting their taxes because they went to Ward Parkway Center because their ride is free if they do is a fine trade off to free service

I like model 1 for how easy it is to understand and it encourages residents to work inside the city limits for free transportation

This sounds amazing, what are the steps still needed to take? If KC implemented would suburbs follow suit?

Would think some burbs will eventually bite depending on success of KCMO proper. They'd apparently need to cover the lost fare. Dave, have others shown any hint of interest? NKC (edit: and Gladstone) seem to be a natural and would think KCK would want to find a way.

BTW, Prospect MAX starts first week of Dec and will be free for I think 90 days so will be a good first test.

If this happens, apparently KCMO will be the largest US city to have city-wide free fare bus.

The first step has been taken

https://www.kshb.com/news/local-news/kc ... -bus-fares

The Kansas City, Missouri, City Council on Thursday gave approval to a proposal to eliminate public bus fares, positioning the city to become the first major metropolitan area with free public bus service.

The council still needs to work out details of the proposal, including how it will be funded and where that money will come from.

Ordinance 190951

It also includes researching best practices to speed up the bus too

Fantastic news. Hopefully some tangible results come from the best practices study too.

this is a pretty pretty big deal. Dave, I know you weren't alone on this but you won't get enough credit for it. Thank you.

It's always great to see KC leading the way with anything, but this is exceptional. I could easily see it being the start of a nationwide trend.

Anyone have any solid knowledge on if the Jo will follow suit with it since they are apart of the ride KC brand? Talk about actually tying the region together if they get on board!

This is great news. It very well may fail or create issues that don't outweigh the benefits but this is worth trying given KC's difficulty to get people to use public transit.

So would this start around May or so? The next fiscal budget cycle?

Anthony_Hugo98 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 06, 2019 4:47 am Anyone have any solid knowledge on if the Jo will follow suit with it since they are apart of the ride KC brand? Talk about actually tying the region together if they get on board!

Would love to see it happen outside of KCMO, but not holding my breath.

Steve Kilka on the JoCo board of commissioners (along with the other conservatives) are trying to kill all remaining fixed route busing and replace it all with micro transit. A gargantuan mistake IMO to do that as a blanket solution for the whole county. Their claim is that if NE JoCo cities want to maintain fixed route service (as those corresponding comissioners do too) then those cities need to chip in more of the cost.

Anthony_Hugo98 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 06, 2019 4:47 am Anyone have any solid knowledge on if the Jo will follow suit with it since they are apart of the ride KC brand? Talk about actually tying the region together if they get on board!

Dave didn't seem to have any insight. Would be surprising if JoCo/KS govt would pursue it as they likely don't want to ship workers into MO, especially with downtown's momentum. But if it succeeds in KCMO, JoCo residents may push for it.

Will be interesting to see how fares work across city boundaries, like crossing NKC/Gladstone, etc. This is for KCMO only right? Not entire KCATA system?

Conservatives should love free bus service countywide.

It’s not a direct handout because anyone in the community can use it, compared to direct handouts to some individuals with free fare cards or reduced cost service like today.

The conservatives on the board claim the county, one of the richest in the country, can’t afford well run fixed route service in its budget....

According to this article (https://www.kcur.org/post/kansas-city-c ... s#stream/0) from KCUR...

"Only buses that originate and return to Kansas City, Missouri, would be free."

&

"he [Josh Powers, who oversees transit services in Johnson County, Kansas] says Johnson County is not currently considering going fare-free."

Can someone help me understand what this means for future service expansion (either in geography or frequency)? I am certainly on board (ha) with the concept, just a little concerned about the speed with which this happened and what it all means. My suspicion is that fares make up such an insignificant portion of the budget it won't be an issue and that projects like Prospect MAX are mostly funded through federal grants.

I will be very curious how next years city budget looks. There are a lot of ‘asks’ in the table from this council in addition to existing commitments that were going to be difficult to fund. Not sure how they will do it.

2019 Budget page 18
https://www.kcata.org/documents/uploads/2019Budget.pdf

In millions
Fares: $9.16
Total Budget: $111.09 million

So fares are 8.2% of the KCATA budget.

It's not split up enough to find the cost, but not paying for the fare systems, printing passes and all that will counter some of the cost. If you print one paper pass per month for 100,000 people that's over 1 million passes yearly. Even a really small cost per adds up quickly at that scale.

Doc page 27 includes Dave on it for anyone interested

Can cities pass gas taxes or is that state and federal only? How about a tax on convenience stores?