OFFICIAL - New KCI Terminal

[SingleMalt12]

A lot of airports use buses to get to rental cars. It is what it is.

On another note I was at an event and the keynote speaker, who used to work in Overland Park, said "I don't know how many of you have ever been to the Kansas City airport but it's unlike any other and that's not a compliment. There aren't many people and it's only on one level."

I told him about the new one & he said "It's about time. I don't understand the reason for the current one." I said it was a short trip from his car to the gate and bag claim. He didn't seem to care & wondered why it was so big for so few people. When I said about 12 million people use it a year he didn't bat an eye & seemed to think it wasn't very many. I should add that he''s from the New York area originally. He now lives in the Detroit metro.

I actually appreciated the layout when I was there. I'm sure I'll like the new one too but I still liked the short trip to and from gates and bag claim.

[GRID]

I'm sure I'll like the new one too but I still liked the short trip to and from gates and bag claim.

Why so you can stand there for 30 minutes and wait for your bags to come out and then when they do, the carousel looks like it should be serving a Cessna 172 so everybody is three people deep waiting around a tiny carousel spilling out into the main hallway. I think you will like the new terminal too.

BTW, KCI feels so dead becaue there is no central areas where there is a lot of traffic. Everybody thinks KCI is super Podunk and is barely used, but that's just not true. It's a relatively busy airport that has the same traffic volume as many other mid sized airports that nobody would say are empty/dead.

It would be like if a metro station had 25 entrances from the street, but no continuous platform and every two entrances went to an individual train car and you could't see any other train cars or platforms. And two cars were always packed (southwest) while the rest of the train was empty. You would get on the train thinking the entire train was like that and wondering why a subway was even needed. If that makes any sense haha.

[normalthings]

We knew even when they opened that the current terminals were a massive mistake. To add to what GRID is saying, the time it takes to get through security at KCI is comparable to or longer than peer cities. Once you are on the airside, KC’s lack of connectability means travelers have to expend great amounts of time and steps connecting in other cities

[GRID]

As a visitor to MCI - should be KCI? - does anyone know whether we can expect an automated tram to rental cars or is it overlooked that we have to take the randomly-timed, crowded and slow busses? Very old school transit and even more reason to embrace Uber if so.

Kind of late response but even without an APM, the bus situation for the new terminal will be much more efficient for rental car facility and economy lots. There will be one central area to grab the bus versus 15 starts/stops and combined drop off / pickup at same stops.

Correct. Buses will be fine and they will function 1000 times better than the current setup. But a people mover would be nice. They are more user friendly when you have luggage too.

[horizons82]

I would not be surprised if the APM's timetable gets bumped up slightly because of the infrastructure bill. Especially if KCI can sell it as a "greening" measure by getting busses off the road.

[Anthony_Hugo98]

I would not be surprised if the APM's timetable gets bumped up slightly because of the infrastructure bill. Especially if KCI can sell it as a "greening" measure by getting busses off the road.

I’m pretty sure the economy bus fleet has gone to all CNG or electric busses, someone correct me if I’m mistaken, but I recall an article about that recently.

[normalthings]

I would not be surprised if the APM's timetable gets bumped up slightly because of the infrastructure bill. Especially if KCI can sell it as a "greening" measure by getting busses off the road.

I’m pretty sure the economy bus fleet has gone to all CNG or electric busses, someone correct me if I’m mistaken, but I recall an article about that recently.

An APM would be cool but not on the top or even bottom of my stimi wish list.

[horizons82]

I would not be surprised if the APM's timetable gets bumped up slightly because of the infrastructure bill. Especially if KCI can sell it as a "greening" measure by getting busses off the road.

I’m pretty sure the economy bus fleet has gone to all CNG or electric busses, someone correct me if I’m mistaken, but I recall an article about that recently.

Yes, they've been converting busses for a while now. Doesn't mean they won't try to sell a new electric APM as green. I'm sure they'll throw any buzzword at it that they think improves their chances. Equity, union jobs, etc.

There's still going to be a large pot of funds for airports in the bill. KCI already so far down the road with the new terminal which includes the support infrasctructure. Assuming management is even semi-competent, they'd put in a request for *something/anything*...APM is already being studied and has a tentative financial plan in place.

[normalthings]

I would not be surprised if the APM's timetable gets bumped up slightly because of the infrastructure bill. Especially if KCI can sell it as a "greening" measure by getting busses off the road.

I’m pretty sure the economy bus fleet has gone to all CNG or electric busses, someone correct me if I’m mistaken, but I recall an article about that recently.

Believe transitioning to all electric over the next few years

[normalthings]

I would not be surprised if the APM's timetable gets bumped up slightly because of the infrastructure bill. Especially if KCI can sell it as a "greening" measure by getting busses off the road.

I’m pretty sure the economy bus fleet has gone to all CNG or electric busses, someone correct me if I’m mistaken, but I recall an article about that recently.

Yes, they've been converting busses for a while now. Doesn't mean they won't try to sell a new electric APM as green. I'm sure they'll throw any buzzword at it that they think improves their chances. Equity, union jobs, etc.

There's still going to be a large pot of funds for airports in the bill. KCI already so far down the road with the new terminal which includes the support infrasctructure. Assuming management is even semi-competent, they'd put in a request for *something/anything*...APM is already being studied and has a tentative financial plan in place.

There are a lot of boring projects I’d like us to pursue. I admit an APM would look cool

[KCPowercat]

As a visitor to MCI - should be KCI? - does anyone know whether we can expect an automated tram to rental cars or is it overlooked that we have to take the randomly-timed, crowded and slow busses? Very old school transit and even more reason to embrace Uber if so.

Kind of late response but even without an APM, the bus situation for the new terminal will be much more efficient for rental car facility and economy lots. There will be one central area to grab the bus versus 15 starts/stops and combined drop off / pickup at same stops.

Correct. Buses will be fine and they will function 1000 times better than the current setup. But a people mover would be nice. They are more user friendly when you have luggage too.

For sure. Having an APM to the cheap parking would be amazing.

[Anthony_Hugo98]

Kind of late response but even without an APM, the bus situation for the new terminal will be much more efficient for rental car facility and economy lots. There will be one central area to grab the bus versus 15 starts/stops and combined drop off / pickup at same stops.

Correct. Buses will be fine and they will function 1000 times better than the current setup. But a people mover would be nice. They are more user friendly when you have luggage too.

For sure. Having an APM to the cheap parking would be amazing.

Something like an APM also upgrades the status of the airport in the minds of out of town visitors as well. It makes us seem less like a poe dunk stop and more of an actual, 21st century City & Airport

[alejandro46]

Would our existing rolling stock even be feasible for this elevated route, or would KCI just want a smaller APM from the parking garage to rental car then in the decades to come run to a transfer station?

Looks like some other APMs have run like $100M usd in Miami, but prices seem to be kind of all over the place or unclear. LA has a new APM that is part of a $5.5bln access modernization project:

https://urbanize.city/la/post/construct ... ople-mover

Here is an interesting (but a little dated) comparison between APM, Light Rail, and "PRT" (pods)

http://www.advancedtransit.org/wp-conte ... -Craig.pdf

NY and LaGuardia Airport are also working on a new Air Train that would link the airport to parking and subway, $450M for around 2mi but not really comparable location.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AirTrain_LaGuardia

[normalthings]

I don’t think there is a fully automated version of the Urbos 3, so no. There are some automated rapid rail options (see Honolulu).

[alejandro46]

I don’t think there is a fully automated version of the Urbos 3, so no. There are some automated rapid rail options (see Honolulu).

Right, I was saying to have normal Urbos service to Airport was even feasible with a driver, not automated. Yes, the SC won't run to KCI for many years, if ever, but we should at least be thinking about it as a possible destination. E.g. run on standard gauge, make elevated tracks able to bear additional weight, etc. $100m for a apm seems really pricy for like a mile of rail if we are not thinking big. I actually really think Justin Meyer and the Aviation Department has done great on the new terminal, and I would bet they have already contemplated how to make any eventual rail connection without duplicating efforts.

[flyingember]

street running would be 21.4 miles long

Building a compatible streetcar (even just the track) to be an APM that serves the terminal, rental car and long term lots is approx 1.7 miles
The NKC section being studied is 3.1 miles

Together that's 20% of the distance.

Not planning for rail with an APM would be a bad idea. Even if it's on tires, the design should be compatible so the route works for rail too

[WoodDraw]

I thought the airport was designed for some type of rail stop at the garage, whether apm or whatever, but I cant recall any specifics or if it made it through design.

[normalthings]

Yes designed for a station to be built onto the north side of the garage

[normalthings]

Under budget, ahead of schedule.

KCAD is deciding on concessions operators.

Seating and final cleaning will be bought next month.

[Anthony_Hugo98]

Under budget, ahead of schedule.

KCAD is deciding on concessions operators.

Seating and final cleaning will be bought next month.

Far enough ahead that it should be open before NFL draft?