Phase Three Streetcar Expansion

[AlkaliAxel]

Late October I thought

Where at?

[DaveKCMO]

Late October I thought

Where at?

http://oneridekc.org/

[shinatoo]

Are there plans to use part of the rock island way as a bike lane to connect to the trail at the stadiums?

If I understand your question correctly, yes there will be a plan to connect the existing Rock Island trail to the urban core. The Linwood Corridor Complete Streets project offers some details on how that would work (10-14' shared use path):

https://dashboards.mysidewalk.com/linwood-psp/

Please just get P33 done right away so you can get from the TWO trailheads at Blue River and Stadium drive to the Rock Island Trail.

I want to meet my friends at Crane Brewing!

[DaveKCMO]

There is a larger effort afoot to connect Riverfront Heritage, Greenline, Blue River, Rock Island, and Katy Trail systems.

[Riverite]

That would help so much with amenities, I love the riverfront trail to cliff drive but it’s not very long

[beautyfromashes]

There is a larger effort afoot to connect Riverfront Heritage, Greenline, Blue River, Rock Island, and Katy Trail systems.

What's the progress/planning on Greenline? I haven't heard anything about it for awhile.

[DaveKCMO]

There is a larger effort afoot to connect Riverfront Heritage, Greenline, Blue River, Rock Island, and Katy Trail systems.

What's the progress/planning on Greenline? I haven't heard anything about it for awhile.

website

Downtown Council has a working committee for the project now, but I think a lot still depends on the railroads.

[beautyfromashes]

Downtown Council has a working committee for the project now, but I think a lot still depends on the railroads.

Yeah, I just personally love this project. If the choice was money for this or capping the loop it’d be a tough decision for me.

[AlkaliAxel]

I genuinely do think that after the city is introduced to the Streetcar extension down Main, people's attitudes will start to look different on mass-rail when they get some taste of it. Just my thought.

[Anthony_Hugo98]

I genuinely do think that after the city is introduced to the Streetcar extension down Main, people's attitudes will start to look different on mass-rail when they get some taste of it. Just my thought.

With the ability to traverse the main spine of the city, people will absolutely be coming around to the idea of regional rail for sure. It’ll be welcome to see the change of opinion overall

[flyingember]

I genuinely do think that after the city is introduced to the Streetcar extension down Main, people's attitudes will start to look different on mass-rail when they get some taste of it. Just my thought.

With the ability to traverse the main spine of the city, people will absolutely be coming around to the idea of regional rail for sure. It’ll be welcome to see the change of opinion overall

The main spine of the city is closer to 40 miles N-S, a 6 mile train won’t change that

N Oak at 152, down to Burlington, to crossing downtown, to Main in midtown to Shawnee Mission Pkwy to Metcalf to about 119th.

[AlkaliAxel]

I genuinely do think that after the city is introduced to the Streetcar extension down Main, people's attitudes will start to look different on mass-rail when they get some taste of it. Just my thought.

With the ability to traverse the main spine of the city, people will absolutely be coming around to the idea of regional rail for sure. It’ll be welcome to see the change of opinion overall

The main spine of the city is closer to 40 miles N-S, a 6 mile train won’t change that

N Oak at 152, down to Burlington, to crossing downtown, to Main in midtown to Shawnee Mission Pkwy to Metcalf to about 119th.

That's not the point. The current streetcar won't have anything to do with building mass rail. The point is that it would change people's *perceptions* about rail to where they would be more open to mass rail, instead of an automatically pessimistic attitude.

For example, all those people who were originally against the streetcar, but then saw it in action and changed their minds about rail. That can be boosted heavily by Main expansion. People will see that rail is good for us, and then we can hopefully get the ball really rolling. Hopefully alot of "wow, this would be cool if we had this in ____ town or street in my area" or something.

[Anthony_Hugo98]

With the ability to traverse the main spine of the city, people will absolutely be coming around to the idea of regional rail for sure. It’ll be welcome to see the change of opinion overall

The main spine of the city is closer to 40 miles N-S, a 6 mile train won’t change that

N Oak at 152, down to Burlington, to crossing downtown, to Main in midtown to Shawnee Mission Pkwy to Metcalf to about 119th.

That's not the point. The current streetcar won't have anything to do with building mass rail. The point is that it would change people's *perceptions* about rail to where they would be more open to mass rail, instead of an automatically pessimistic attitude.

For example, all those people who were originally against the streetcar, but then saw it in action and changed their minds about rail. That can be boosted heavily by Main expansion. People will see that rail is good for us, and then we can hopefully get the ball really rolling. Hopefully alot of "wow, this would be cool if we had this in ____ town or street in my area" or something.

Precisely the point I was making.

[flyingember]

That's not the point. The current streetcar won't have anything to do with building mass rail. The point is that it would change people's *perceptions* about rail to where they would be more open to mass rail, instead of an automatically pessimistic attitude.

For example, all those people who were originally against the streetcar, but then saw it in action and changed their minds about rail. That can be boosted heavily by Main expansion. People will see that rail is good for us, and then we can hopefully get the ball really rolling. Hopefully alot of "wow, this would be cool if we had this in ____ town or street in my area" or something.

It’s been five years. Waiting another four years for expansion to open another and 2-3 for it to get real use won’t change many more opinions on a system with millions of rides already.

If it hasn’t happened what’s going to be different when it’s a fraction of the road system vs being an imperceptibly larger fraction? Will hundreds of thousands of people think, “oh, it’s now six miles and still goes nowhere near my home but that’s enough to show me the value” ???

The good public opinion should exist right now if it’s ever going to and waiting until 2030 to act on it is delaying unnecessarily.

We can see this in NKC where they clearly see the value and they’re taking action.

[Riverite]

I thought that’s what was happening right now is they are looking at long term plans

[normalthings]

That's not the point. The current streetcar won't have anything to do with building mass rail. The point is that it would change people's *perceptions* about rail to where they would be more open to mass rail, instead of an automatically pessimistic attitude.

For example, all those people who were originally against the streetcar, but then saw it in action and changed their minds about rail. That can be boosted heavily by Main expansion. People will see that rail is good for us, and then we can hopefully get the ball really rolling. Hopefully alot of "wow, this would be cool if we had this in ____ town or street in my area" or something.

It’s been five years. Waiting another four years for expansion to open another and 2-3 for it to get real use won’t change many more opinions on a system with millions of rides already.

If it hasn’t happened what’s going to be different when it’s a fraction of the road system vs being an imperceptibly larger fraction? Will hundreds of thousands of people think, “oh, it’s now six miles and still goes nowhere near my home but that’s enough to show me the value” ???

The good public opinion should exist right now if it’s ever going to and waiting until 2030 to act on it is delaying unnecessarily.

We can see this in NKC where they clearly see the value and they’re taking action.

I think it will. I know suburban and exo-burban residents who view the current system as a connector between parking and venues downtown. A longer system will show that it can work as an even more day-day users focused system

[flyingember]

That's not the point. The current streetcar won't have anything to do with building mass rail. The point is that it would change people's *perceptions* about rail to where they would be more open to mass rail, instead of an automatically pessimistic attitude.

For example, all those people who were originally against the streetcar, but then saw it in action and changed their minds about rail. That can be boosted heavily by Main expansion. People will see that rail is good for us, and then we can hopefully get the ball really rolling. Hopefully alot of "wow, this would be cool if we had this in ____ town or street in my area" or something.

It’s been five years. Waiting another four years for expansion to open another and 2-3 for it to get real use won’t change many more opinions on a system with millions of rides already.

If it hasn’t happened what’s going to be different when it’s a fraction of the road system vs being an imperceptibly larger fraction? Will hundreds of thousands of people think, “oh, it’s now six miles and still goes nowhere near my home but that’s enough to show me the value” ???

The good public opinion should exist right now if it’s ever going to and waiting until 2030 to act on it is delaying unnecessarily.

We can see this in NKC where they clearly see the value and they’re taking action.

I think it will. I know suburban and exo-burban residents who view the current system as a connector between parking and venues downtown. A longer system will show that it can work as an even more day-day users focused system

It doesn't change that though. Take someone coming from 159th and Switzer.
The extension ending is 21.4 miles away. Currently it's 24 miles away.

The system is still a connector between parking and venues, we just moved where they can park at. The Plaza *is* downtown at the scale of the entire metro. Functionally what you say it is today won't change.

It needs to bridge clear barriers to be seen as more. Crossing a river (either one), going to the stadiums, connecting into Kansas.

[AlkaliAxel]

Because right now people only view the streetcar as a purely downtown thing. Once it’s showed how useful it is from going to shop in the Plaza and go all the way downtown and back, that will start to raise some eyebrows and make people see the benefits. That’s quite a bit of distance compared to now.

[alejandro46]

Again, I think the Stadiums are the most apparent next "Phase 3" Expansion, even before NKC due to it's bridge limitations.

-TSC provides a clear, high visibility end point for a line that gets high traffic and could even be leveraged in discussions with Chiefs/Royals on stadium lease renewals.
-The area between Main and TSC needs critical investment; having the streetcar, a known development catalyst through the area would be huge for those all along the route.
-The VA hospital is another critical access facility, having the streetcar to the VA would connect affordable housing in the center city to medical care with rapid transit.
-There are expansion opportunities further along the Rock Island RR right of way.
-World Cup 2026 low transit scores shows that in the future if we want to hold big events at our stadiums, they shouldn't be so disconnected from the rest of the city.

[Anthony_Hugo98]

Again, I think the Stadiums are the most apparent next "Phase 3" Expansion, even before NKC due to it's bridge limitations.

-TSC provides a clear, high visibility end point for a line that gets high traffic and could even be leveraged in discussions with Chiefs/Royals on stadium lease renewals.
-The area between Main and TSC needs critical investment; having the streetcar, a known development catalyst through the area would be huge for those all along the route.
-The VA hospital is another critical access facility, having the streetcar to the VA would connect affordable housing in the center city to medical care with rapid transit.
-There are expansion opportunities further along the Rock Island RR right of way.
-World Cup 2026 low transit scores shows that in the future if we want to hold big events at our stadiums, they shouldn't be so disconnected from the rest of the city.

I imagine this would get away from Streetcar though, and drift further towards LRT, as it would have the capacity for stadiums to a significant degree more than SC