OFFICIAL - New KCI Terminal

[dev49]

Neither of us will be a hub, but I could see KC grabbing the traffic and them wanting to move towards KC than paying for STL

Hubs vary by name, they're not always called hubs. SW calls them operating bases. Frontier I've seen Focus City used.

KC is the second smallest US airport by numbers that's not one for at least one airline.

STL is a Southwest “intentional connecting opportunity”. Basically a hub of sorts. I think they have around 18 gates there. Would have been more by now if not covid.

I think we could try and grab that from them. Agree that what Southwest is doing in Denver could and should have been us. Huge missed opportunity

Do we know how many gates each airline will get?

[normalthings]

[Anthony_Hugo98]

I hate that SWA is our biggest carrier because of the flying experience they provide but that's for another thread

Please elaborate.

[shaffe]

I hate that SWA is our biggest carrier because of the flying experience they provide but that's for another thread

Please elaborate.

Open seating sucks ass, especially if you're traveling with more than two people in your party.

[AlkaliAxel]

I’m not an airline expert but it makes no sense to me why KC had never been an airport powerhouse. We literally are the most central location in the country to go any direction. And somehow we even fuck that up of that not being able to take advantage of that. Unbelievable.

[dev49]

I was just trying to do a breakdown and I was thinking it wasn’t enough but I guess there is a little more leeway than I thought.

39 total

Southwest -10
Delta -6
AA -5
UA/AC- 5
Spirit - 2
Frontier - 1
Allegiant - 1
Alaska - 1
JetBlue - 1
Vacation express/Charters - 1
Total - 33

So 6 left over.

[normalthings]

I’m not an airline expert but it makes no sense to me why KC had never been an airport powerhouse. We literally are the most central location in the country to go any direction. And somehow we even fuck that up of that not being able to take advantage of that. Unbelievable.

Because our airport can not support connections. New terminal will help but it’s 50 years too late. If we had designed a normal terminal, TWA or others would have kept hubs here

[AlkaliAxel]

^In other words, they screwed up having the most central city in the country not being an airport hub.

[normalthings]

^In other words, they screwed up having the most central city in the country not being an airport hub.

It was an out dated design the day it opened. Many airlines have tried hubs here but all have failed.

[TheLastGentleman]

A design TWA mandated and then told the city to rebuild it. City said no and I absolutely cannot blame them.

[normalthings]

The city absolutely would have been better off fixing it.

[normalthings]

I was just trying to do a breakdown and I was thinking it wasn’t enough but I guess there is a little more leeway than I thought.

39 total

Southwest -10
Delta -6
AA -5
UA/AC- 5
Spirit - 2
Frontier - 1
Allegiant - 1
Alaska - 1
JetBlue - 1
Vacation express/Charters - 1
Total - 33

So 6 left over.

I don’t see JetBlue with 2 turns a day leasing a gate. Possible but I bet the use American gates until/unless they scale service up. I would love to see them build a Midwest hub here one day.

[Highlander]

^In other words, they screwed up having the most central city in the country not being an airport hub.

It was an out dated design the day it opened. Many airlines have tried hubs here but all have failed.

Oddly enough, KCI was actually designed to be the hub for TWA. TWA controlled much of the design of KCI and then cynically abandoned the city after they realized it could never function as a hub in the era of airport security. Oops. The real marvel is that KCI's myth of convenience perpetuated into the 21st century resulting in misguided attempts to refurbish the obsolete design into something manageable which never worked.

One other word on hubs: While airport design is a pre-requisite, most hubs were initially chosen for the amount of passengers the hub city could generate be it by population or by tourism (which is why Las Vegas and SLC had hubs early on).

[Sani]

^In other words, they screwed up having the most central city in the country not being an airport hub.

It was an out dated design the day it opened. Many airlines have tried hubs here but all have failed.

Oddly enough, KCI was actually designed to be the hub for TWA. TWA controlled much of the design of KCI and then cynically abandoned the city after they realized it could never function as a hub in the era of airport security. Oops. The real marvel is that KCI's myth of convenience perpetuated into the 21st century resulting in misguided attempts to refurbish the obsolete design into something manageable which never worked.

One other word on hubs: While airport design is a pre-requisite, most hubs were initially chosen for the amount of passengers the hub city could generate be it by population or by tourism (which is why Las Vegas and SLC had hubs early on).

Security requirements doomed it, but even before that, it wasn't functional as a hub. TWA brought in 747s, only to find that 300+ passengers would quickly overwhelm the terminal space, even without anything separating the space between the curbside entrance and the doors to the jetbridges. It was just a complete lack of proper planning for the space requirements, and when they realized it wasn't working, they wanted the city to tear it down and build it again, and they were properly told to go pound sand.

To think that the other option they were considering was a Tampa-like arrangement with a central terminal out outlying airsides connected with people movers... it was "too expensive," but it would have been a much better arrangement, not only for what TWA wanted at the time, but for the O/D traffic that we have today.

[TheLastGentleman]

The city absolutely would have been better off fixing it.

It was TWA’s mistake and there’s no way the city should’ve been on the hook for that screwup. I can’t imagine how anyone could have an inch of sympathy for the airline in this scenario

[normalthings]

https://www.airportprojects.net/histori ... Plans.pdf

[Sani]

https://www.airportprojects.net/histori ... Plans.pdf

Wow, that's fascinating! I notice they originally planned for a taxiway that would cross north of the terminals and over Cookingham Drive. Assuming it was built to plan, it appears Terminal B has a service drive underneath the main roadway, while terminals A and C do not (or did not, in A's case).

[normalthings]

https://www.airportprojects.net/histori ... Plans.pdf

Wow, that's fascinating! I notice they originally planned for a taxiway that would cross north of the terminals and over Cookingham Drive. Assuming it was built to plan, it appears Terminal B has a service drive underneath the main roadway, while terminals A and C do not (or did not, in A's case).

Can you point it out? There is a lower level service road that serves/served A,B,C. This service road will become the exit roadway for the new terminal

[normalthings]

10 Concepts for a proposed Platte County Airport.





Concept 7 selected for further refinement

[dev49]

I was just trying to do a breakdown and I was thinking it wasn’t enough but I guess there is a little more leeway than I thought.

39 total

Southwest -10
Delta -6
AA -5
UA/AC- 5
Spirit - 2
Frontier - 1
Allegiant - 1
Alaska - 1
JetBlue - 1
Vacation express/Charters - 1
Total - 33

So 6 left over.

I don’t see JetBlue with 2 turns a day leasing a gate. Possible but I bet the use American gates until/unless they scale service up. I would love to see them build a Midwest hub here one day.

They could do per turn but I don’t see AA sharing with them. I guess maybe until the new terminal but I’m not sure they are THAT friendly to share since it’s only 2 cities they are friends on. They would probably want to be near AA though. I guess it’s not a huge deal either way. There will be extra gates open.