Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

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beautyfromashes
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Re: Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

Post by beautyfromashes »

aknowledgeableperson wrote: Trying to change the image of Troost can start with the city itself. Draw Council Districts without using Troost as a boundary.
That is done to ensure that a certain number of councilpeople are minorities. It's one of those situations where people are trying to help a community but are actually hurting.

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chaglang
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Re: Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

Post by chaglang »

beautyfromashes wrote:
aknowledgeableperson wrote: Trying to change the image of Troost can start with the city itself. Draw Council Districts without using Troost as a boundary.
That is done to ensure that a certain number of councilpeople are minorities. It's one of those situations where people are trying to help a community but are actually hurting.
The boundary could move 6 blocks east with almost no change in demographics. If anything, the district would become less diverse and more "solid". I wonder if the line eventually moves as the neighborhoods immediately east of Troost become less segregated.

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Re: Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

Post by flyingember »

chaglang wrote: The boundary could move 6 blocks east with almost no change in demographics. If anything, the district would become less diverse and more "solid". I wonder if the line eventually moves as the neighborhoods immediately east of Troost become less segregated.
population growth is not just the economic future of the eastside but it's political future as well

Think about where there's population growth. The northland will pull 2.5-3 districts northward by 2030.
Downtown growth is even more rapid right now. It's pulling the districts towards it as well.

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Re: Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

Post by flyingember »

I drove down Indep Ave from almost the Blue River to the HOA Bridge at around 4pm today from Independence to home.
I was sold before and this trip cemented it.

there was way more foot traffic on this corridor than I expected at that time of the day. Even downtown doesn't get as many people walking around at 4pm.

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Re: Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

Post by langosta »

DaveKCMO wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:44 am
Image

as the image above indicates, a northeast extension of the streetcar would start in the river market and terminate at topping avenue (4.4 miles). this would directly serve columbus park, paseo west, independence plaza, pendleton heights, scarritt renaissance, indian mound, and lykins.

some of these neighborhoods are served by the current #24 (mostly on independence) and #30 (lexington/st. john) bus lines, which practically mirror their streetcar predecessors.

previous citywide light rail elections didn't do so well in these wards, but demographics are changing.

thoughts on routing, stop locations, phasing?

article from northeast news: http://northeastnews.net/pages/?p=16462
I would absolutely love to see this revived

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DaveKCMO
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Re: Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

Post by DaveKCMO »

FYI - Pre-pandemic ridership on the 24 Independence was averaging 2,431 trips per weekday.

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Re: Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

Post by flyingember »

DaveKCMO wrote:
Thu Jun 10, 2021 5:52 pm
FYI - Pre-pandemic ridership on the 24 Independence was averaging 2,431 trips per weekday.
For comparison,
Average daily streetcar ridership in May 2019: 5,633
The lowest ridership in Jan 2019, marked as extremely cold, was 2080.

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Re: Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

Post by alejandro46 »

It's an estimated 30 minute drive or an hour bus ride from City Market to Indepence MO along Indep. Ave/Winner Rd. per Google Maps Approximately 10 miles from City Market to DT Indepemdence. Seems like a ton of potential for an improved transit corridor. I believe that this ranked very high on the NextRail plan, however, since the bus is so successful here, does it make sense to disrupt something that is working so well versus make this route more frequent?

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normalthings
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Re: Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

Post by normalthings »

flyingember wrote:
Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:24 am
DaveKCMO wrote:
Thu Jun 10, 2021 5:52 pm
FYI - Pre-pandemic ridership on the 24 Independence was averaging 2,431 trips per weekday.
For comparison,
Average daily streetcar ridership in May 2019: 5,633
The lowest ridership in Jan 2019, marked as extremely cold, was 2080.
Isn’t that what Main Street max ridership was pre streetcar

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DaveKCMO
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Re: Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

Post by DaveKCMO »

The Council at the time chose the top three rated extensions from NextRail to put before voters:

1. Main Street South to UMKC
2. Linwood to Prospect
3. Independence to Prospect

It's still the only expansion plan on record with the governing body.

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Re: Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

Post by langosta »

With the redevelopment of Hardesty into an affordable or mixed income community, think a streetcar extension all the way to Topping makes a lot more sense today then it did in 2013

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Re: Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

Post by DaveKCMO »

It made a lot of sense then. We'd be riding that system today and talking about all of the great changes we're seeing along Linwood and Independence and probably talking about going further east.

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Re: Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

Post by flyingember »

DaveKCMO wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:33 am
It made a lot of sense then. We'd be riding that system today and talking about all of the great changes we're seeing along Linwood and Independence and probably talking about going further east.
The district being so crazy large doomed the 2014 project.

If it had stuck to land within a certain distance of the line it would have passed.
Not putting it to a vote again in the 7 years since has never made sense.

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Re: Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

Post by langosta »

Such a large project would be hard for citizens alone to put to a vote. Without the city advocating for this, who will?

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Re: Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

Post by DaveKCMO »

langosta wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:18 pm
Such a large project would be hard for citizens alone to put to a vote. Without the city advocating for this, who will?
Any two transportation authorities can put a TDD before voters (rather than the citizen-led effort we did for the Main Street extension). If you just pursue a sales tax instead of sales tax + assessments, that requires a single election (and a lower administrative cost). The trick would be to find the right project that could be paid for -- capital and operating -- with just a sales tax.

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Re: Phase 2 streetcar on Independence Avenue

Post by langosta »

DaveKCMO wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:31 pm
langosta wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:18 pm
Such a large project would be hard for citizens alone to put to a vote. Without the city advocating for this, who will?
Any two transportation authorities can put a TDD before voters (rather than the citizen-led effort we did for the Main Street extension). If you just pursue a sales tax instead of sales tax + assessments, that requires a single election (and a lower administrative cost). The trick would be to find the right project that could be paid for -- capital and operating -- with just a sales tax.
Crown Center to TSC with a TDD and county funding. Lets make it happen!

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