P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

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wahoowa
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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by wahoowa »

who the hell made this decision and what is their email address

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by earthling »

Just noticed I put in wrong thread. Mods feel free to move.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by FangKC »

earthling wrote:
Wed Sep 04, 2019 10:19 am
Just as we've come to the conclusion that large planters on narrow sidewalks are :(, the sidewalk in front of One KC Place was just replaced with...
Image
You have to decide if you are willing to forego having street trees that can survive, or you might have to wait 10 seconds for a couple of people walking together to pass you. Trees need a well around their base to accept water. Water permeable concrete is not enough. During long droughts, trees need to watered to survive.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by gfenn11 »

FangKC wrote:
Wed Sep 04, 2019 11:08 pm
earthling wrote:
Wed Sep 04, 2019 10:19 am
Just as we've come to the conclusion that large planters on narrow sidewalks are :(, the sidewalk in front of One KC Place was just replaced with...
Image
You have to decide if you are willing to forego having street trees that can survive, or you might have to wait 10 seconds for a couple of people walking together to pass you. Trees need a well around their base to accept water. Water permeable concrete is not enough. During long droughts, trees need to watered to survive.
The grates before allowed water in AND for people to walk by each other.

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beautyfromashes
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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by beautyfromashes »

FangKC wrote:
Wed Sep 04, 2019 11:08 pm
You have to decide if you are willing to forego having street trees that can survive, or you might have to wait 10 seconds for a couple of people walking together to pass you. Trees need a well around their base to accept water. Water permeable concrete is not enough. During long droughts, trees need to watered to survive.
You have a gentle slope to the wells with permeable concrete in the area where the well is and those trees will get enough water.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by FangKC »

Image

Doesn't look like there were grates. It appears they have cobblestone or stone clear up almost to the trunk of the tree. That small area around the trunk is not large enough to accept enough water to allow a tree to survive a hot summer during drought. Even if a tree survives the initial years, it becomes stunted at a certain point.

This is a common amateur mistake city and street planners make. It is a waste of money since the tree will not thrive and have to be replaced at some point. Why not design a better system that allows the tree to reach a mature size?

Granted, the concrete berm is a bad idea, since it doesn't allow rainwater to run off the sidewalk into the well. It looks like there is a automatic sprinkler being added though.

Google Streetview:

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0994237 ... 8192?hl=en

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by KCPowercat »

I'd skip the street tress here. not enough room for this heavily trafficked sidewalk and not w lot of benefit with good sized buildings on both sides.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by earthling »

Grates work just fine, this is across the street...
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smh
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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by smh »

In fairness though, those grates suck. That sidewalk outside Kaldi et al is just about the worst walking experience downtown.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by DaveKCMO »

smh wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 2:31 pm
In fairness though, those grates suck. That sidewalk outside Kaldi et al is just about the worst walking experience downtown.
Because they are slippery when wet?

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by smh »

DaveKCMO wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 4:12 pm
smh wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 2:31 pm
In fairness though, those grates suck. That sidewalk outside Kaldi et al is just about the worst walking experience downtown.
Because they are slippery when wet?
Slippery when wet and bouncy when stepped upon. Plus the cords for the lights in the trees ensnare feet.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by earthling »

Trees seem to be surviving fine with this type...

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by FangKC »

I can't imagine that tree will survive much longer unless there is a drip line under the pavement.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by KCPowercat »

Garment district closing this weekend.

Real bummer to see cordish completely whiff on delivering clothing retail. Was optimistic.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by dukuboy1 »

they tried. Jos A Banks was ok, and smart placement as they figured business minded men would be around the area. Biggest Issues I think is those type of stores rely on foot traffic, but people looking for retail. Most in the area are working, conventioneers, or attending an event/seeking entertainment. Very few shoppers. Plus the area is not know as a shopping district per say. I wouldn't be surprised that with the addition of more residential that retail clothing may try to make a new attempt at some point. But I think there were just not enough people to keep it going.

I think of you add a Target downtown, that may be an anchor you need to get people who live in the area to start staying in the area to shop retail and getting them to think "what's close" as opposed to I'll go to the Plaza

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by earthling »

P&L is primarily entertainment but so many spaces are geared for retail and Cordish still doesn't seem to be trying outside bars/restaurants. The high profile 12th/Main coffee shop location is still empty and astonishing the corner across from movie theater is still empty for over 10 years, never occupied. Maybe Target can take that section? Might be five years though. I suspect they'll wait till downtown hits 35k population.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by KCPowercat »

Jos a bank is not trying.

I think there is still one open at Indian spring mall.

This could have easily been the retail stretch I was talking about in another thread.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by DColeKC »

KCPowercat wrote:
Sat Feb 29, 2020 12:17 am
Garment district closing this weekend.

Real bummer to see cordish completely whiff on delivering clothing retail. Was optimistic.
Garment District isn’t closing.

As for clothing retail, it’s not a Cordish or PNL problem, it’s a nationwide issue. Your Forever 21 type clothing retail stores wouldn’t survive downtown and barely do in malls with high foot traffic. A landlord can go after certain retailers all day, but if those retailers don’t think they can make a profit, it won’t happen. Not sure how this would be a Cordish whiff.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by DColeKC »

earthling wrote:
Sat Feb 29, 2020 10:26 am
P&L is primarily entertainment but so many spaces are geared for retail and Cordish still doesn't seem to be trying outside bars/restaurants. The high profile 12th/Main coffee shop location is still empty and astonishing the corner across from movie theater is still empty for over 10 years, never occupied. Maybe Target can take that section? Might be five years though. I suspect they'll wait till downtown hits 35k population.
Talks with Target have been ongoing.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Baltimore site proposal

Post by KCPowercat »

DColeKC wrote:
Sun Mar 01, 2020 8:17 pm
KCPowercat wrote:
Sat Feb 29, 2020 12:17 am
Garment district closing this weekend.

Real bummer to see cordish completely whiff on delivering clothing retail. Was optimistic.
Garment District isn’t closing.

As for clothing retail, it’s not a Cordish or PNL problem, it’s a nationwide issue. Your Forever 21 type clothing retail stores wouldn’t survive downtown and barely do in malls with high foot traffic. A landlord can go after certain retailers all day, but if those retailers don’t think they can make a profit, it won’t happen. Not sure how this would be a Cordish whiff.
Their Instagram says they were closing today?

If Jos a bank leaves, probably shows rents are too damn high, those places never close in zero foot traffic areas.

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