AlkaliAxel wrote: ↑Mon Sep 27, 2021 11:48 pm
normalthings wrote: ↑Mon Sep 27, 2021 10:03 pm
GRID wrote: ↑Mon Sep 27, 2021 9:53 pm
Hey, I never said KC couldn't or shouldn't host the games. The only thing I have ever said is that I think KC has some of the worst infrastructure of any major city and putting a baseball stadium downtown will expose that.
I also think KC people think way too much of the downtown streetcar system (very slow single vehicle trams that run in traffic). It's great for what it does (it's a fantastic circulator for short urban trips). But it's wildly in-efficient and under capacity to even help with things like major stadiums events.
I don't see a problem with KC hosting the World Cup. It would be nice if I-70 between downtown and the stadiums didn't still look like one of the most dated and depressing urban interstates in the country and it would be nice if KC would build light rail out to the east suburbs with a stop at the stadiums. But I digress.
I guess the best KC can hope for is running trams from the plaza to the stadiums in the next 20 years. Which will move WAY less people than the metro buses did when KCATA had the Chiefs Express.
It's constructive criticism. Of course I want KC to host major events. But KC is one of the worst cities in the country now when it comes to building and maintaining high level modern infrastructure. And that is a major obstacle to overcome when it comes to landing big events or building downtown stadiums.
Agree with streetcar being a circulator. Hope that we can build something more tram train or light rail like for east west and rock island. Maybe we will one day have what Portland has, overlapping streetcar and light rail networks.
Who was asking it to be more than a circulator though? The streetcar is the best case scenario for what we could put in the urban core here. It moves quickly, gets the job done, is expanding, free to use, is being useful to residents and most importantly it's driving development. I can't believe anyone would complain about that, especially when you see the shortfalls in other cities with it. Ours is filled to the brim all the time so of course it's useful to people.
As for GRID...Idk why some people complain it's slow? It moves from stop to stop very quickly (or atleast unnoticeably slow?) and the wait in between stops was better by far the Chicago & Denver rail I experienced this summer. The traffic and red lights don't really slow it down that much.
As far as the urban core goes, the streetcar might make alot more money and development for the city than a light rail in the urban core would considering the cost savings. My prediction is people will stop shitting on it as "not useful" after the expansion is up and running. For students, residents anywhere in the urban core (especially young people) it really is a game changer.
Long term, and outside of the core, yes we need real light rail. But many cities run streetcars in their urban cores & light rail outside it. Portland & Denver are good examples of that exact model.
Again, the streetcar is fine for what it does. It's an urban tram. It's probably the best modern streetcar line in the country right now despite its main downfall (running in mixed traffic).
I never said it was a bad investment or anything like that and it could be drastically improved if cars were restricted on parts of the line like Main Street in the loop and portions of the river market.
That said, it's not "mass" or "high speed" transit. It's not for long distances. It's not for moving a large amount of people. Running streetcars to KCI or Village West or even the TSC is just plain silly. Build out a modern tram system in the city and build a true light rail system to compliment it for regional transit (including the stadiums).
I honest to god do not understand how the streetcar would even function if a baseball stadium were downtown. First off the trams will be stuck in game traffic and secondly, they are barely bigger than a single articulated bus. That is not going to do much of anything to help get 20-30 thousand people to a downtown stadium. Let alone 70,000 out to Arrowhead.
I like the KC streetcar. I think it's great for the city. But KC needs light rail out to Blue Springs/Independence/Lee's Summit etc with a stop at the stadiums. Not commuter rail, not streetcar, but actual light rail. And light rail would do wonders for eastern KCMO, the I-70 corridor and the Jackson county suburbs. Having easy access to the stadiums from downtown (and the entire urban core via the streetcar) is just icing on the cake.
