Big 12 Football

[TheBigChuckbowski]

[Highlander]

This whole thing started because MD claimed the Cotton Bowl is a second tier bowl. 

All bowls that do not contain a team that is at least concievably playing for a shot at the national championship are second tier bowls.  All the bickering will not change that reality.  Orange Bowl, Cotton Bowl, and Holiday Bowl get relegated to the who-cares-other-than-the-fans-of-the-two-teams-involved category if they do not contain a potential national champion.    It would be like watching UCLA play North Carolina on the same day KU and Memphis plays in the NCAA tourney and stating the games had the same meaning.  To me watching UCLA vs North Carolina play a consolation game would have no more meaning than watching Davidson and Duke play one. 

[jlbomega]

Judging by the payouts, it is clear the Cotton = Orange



Rose        17M
Fiesta      17M
Orange     17M
Sugar       17M


Capitol 1   4M
Outback    3M
Cotton      3M
Chik-Fil-A  2.8M
Champs Sports  2.3M

The confernece splits all of this money anyway, total non-issue.

[KCPowercat]

back to back bowl games for the ku program would be huge...lets not act like ku is some bowl veteran with choice of their bowl now.  they have to do quite a bit to take that "one hit wonder" tag off.

[Maitre D]

Orange Bowl, Cotton Bowl, and Holiday Bowl get relegated to the who-cares-other-than-the-fans-of-the-two-teams-involved

Absurd.   The payouts alone render your argument incorrect.   So do the TV ratings.


Nobody thinks the Rose Bowl is totall worthless just because it doesn't host the title game 3/4 of the time.  Or that going is the same as a Holiday Bowl bid.  GMAFB.

[jlbomega]

All bowls that do not contain a team that is at least concievably playing for a shot at the national championship are second tier bowls.  All the bickering will not change that reality.  Orange Bowl, Cotton Bowl, and Holiday Bowl get relegated to the who-cares-other-than-the-fans-of-the-two-teams-involved category if they do not contain a potential national champion.    It would be like watching UCLA play North Carolina on the same day KU and Memphis plays in the NCAA tourney and stating the games had the same meaning.  To me watching UCLA vs North Carolina play a consolation game would have no more meaning than watching Davidson and Duke play one.   

Exactly.  That is why I would take beating Kansas, the opportunity to win a Big 12 title, and earn a spot in the National Championship game over losing to Kansas and backing into the Orange Bowl.  Other than the crappy International Bowl every bowl played after NYD is bascially the same.  

The fact that bowl committees pick and choose teams without regarding what occured on the field the BCS will not mean anything (other than the National Champion).  And yes, I will say this if Mizzou ever wins a BCS bowl game... unless they change the BCS so the top eight (or ten if they expand) teams play in it.

Bottom line, the BCS is ruining college football.  Just look at the TV ratings for bowls, down across the board (especially for the BCS games) over the past couple of years.

[jlbomega]

Absurd.   The payouts alone render your argument incorrect.   So do the TV ratings.


Nobody thinks the Rose Bowl is totall worthless just because it doesn't host the title game 3/4 of the time.  Or that going is the same as a Holiday Bowl bid.  GMAFB.

Payouts are spread evenly throughout the confernece.... quit bringing up this stupid point.  If you would have taken any number of the NYD games (Cotton, Capital One, etc) and moved them to network TV in primetime they would have done the same numbers and probably more.  The NYD games have competition from other games on TV. 

If you want to judge bowl game importance by TV audience you would have to put them all in the same time slot and see how many people watched which game.  You can't do that so it is a non point.  I have already pointed out winning the OB in front of such a large audience did nothing to improve Kansas perception to voters or the nation for that matter.  If the OB were that much better than the Cotton or any other bowl game for that matter beating a then top 5 team in the OB should have assured you a top 5 finish.

[kcmetro]

Payouts are spread evenly throughout the confernece.... quit bringing up this stupid point.

Yeah...and? KU brought dinner to the table for the rest of the North teams to feast on.

[kcmetro]

The fact that bowl committees pick and choose teams without regarding what occured on the field the BCS will not mean anything (other than the National Champion).  And yes, I will say this if Mizzou ever wins a BCS bowl game... unless they change the BCS so the top eight (or ten if they expand) teams play in it.

The top 8 teams did play in it. Sorry if Mizzou wasn't top 8 in the minds of the committees.

[Maitre D]

Payouts are spread evenly throughout the confernece.... quit bringing up this stupid point. 

It's perfectly relevant to the central question:  does the Cotton = Orange?  Obviously, the Cotton doesn't generate anywhere near the revenues the Orange does.  And those revenues are largely dictated by television dollars, indicating huge differences in fan interest.


Whether it's split or not btw members, is utterly beside the point.  Keep up, JLB.

[Highlander]

Absurd.   The payouts alone render your argument incorrect.   So do the TV ratings.


Nobody thinks the Rose Bowl is totall worthless just because it doesn't host the title game 3/4 of the time.  Or that going is the same as a Holiday Bowl bid.  GMAFB.

The championship game between LSU and OSU had a TV rating of 17.4.  The Rose Bowl had a TV rating of 11 which wasn't too bad.  After that there was a big fall off, the Orange Bowl had a TV rating of 7.4 despite a pretty good television time slot.  The Capital One Bowl, not a BCS bowl, had a TV ranking of 9.13.  After the championship game, there was a huge fall-off in viewership and while the BCS bowls generally did better than non BCS bowls, they weren't much better and certainly were much closer in viewership to the non-BCS bowls than they were to the championship game.  If you did a cluster analysis on the ratings, the non championship BCS bowl games would group much more closely with the rest of Bowl wannabees than they would with the championship game. 

In attendance, the Cotton Bowl was essentially the same as the Orange Bowl. 

[Maitre D]

Bottom line, the BCS is ruining college football.  

The only thing the BCS is ruining, is your self-esteem.

[jlbomega]

The only thing the BCS is ruining, is your self-esteem.

MD is turing the attention elsewhere, usually what happens when he must admit defeat.  You are seriously weak dude!

Mizzou ended the season on top.  As the old saying goes... he who laughs last....

[WSPanic]

Mizzou ended the season on top.

The fact that you can't recognize the distinction between a BCS Bowl and a non-BCS Bowl makes the fact that you somehow make a huge distinction between #4 and #7 in an end of season poll that much funnier.

[KCPowercat]

isn't  he referring to mu wining the north and beating ku head to head?

I think we all kind of agree the whole poll system and bowl selections are pretty fickle.

I see both sides....I just think ku and mu had pretty much equally successful seasons...mu got one more piece of hardware but ku got the better bowl win.

[Maitre D]

The fact that you can't recognize the distinction between a BCS Bowl and a non-BCS Bowl makes the fact that you somehow make a huge distinction between #4 and #7 in an end of season poll that much funnier.

I still find it hilarious he says the Orange isn't that big a deal - but throws yet another tantrum clear out of nowhere about their snub of MU, 4 months later.


He's like the guy who says he doesn't miss his ex that dumped him.  Then rags on her constantly.

[KCPowercat]

md....didn't u start a
marriage sucks-themed thread complete with ongoing article s based on your experience with your ex? 

[jlbomega]

I still find it hilarious he says the Orange isn't that big a deal - but throws yet another tantrum clear out of nowhere about their snub of MU, 4 months later.

To end my time posting today I would merely like to point out I posted an article about how the Cotton Bowl will move to Jan 2 and have it's own timeslot in its attempt to become the fifth BCS bowl.  I had no intention of talking about who had a better season.  My point (which I made months ago) is if/when the Cotton becomes a BCS bowl everyone will look back at this as a total non issue.

Then enter MD with his nonsense....  The only tantrum being thrown is by you (like usual).  The only reason I actually believe you are an adult is you would have to be in school right now if you were not.

He's like the guy who says he doesn't miss his ex that dumped him.  Then rags on her constantly.

You talk about this like you know a lot about the subject  :lol:

[Maitre D]

[quote auuthor=KCPowercat link=topic=10118#msg339234 date=1209591607]
I see both sides....I just think ku and mu had pretty much equally successful seasons...mu got one more piece of hardware but ku got the better bowl win.
[/quote]

Dude, I'd keep that quiet.  JLB is about to explode on you.

[jlbomega]

Dude, I'd keep that quiet.  JLB is about to explode on you.

I was going to stop... but this needs to be said. 

THE ORANGE BOWL IS A BETTER BOWL THAN THE COTTON BOWL UNDER THE CURRENT SYSTEM!  IF I HAD TO CHOOSE WHICH BOWL I WANTED I WOULD CHOOSE THE ORANGE.

My point all along has been the Cotton was a better game this year and the final rankings proved it.  In a few years if/when the Cotton becomes another BCS bowl nobody (except MD I'm sure) will view the Cotton Bowl and differently than the Orange Bowl. 

Every year the BCS makes blunders in selections and it degrades the product, so every year the BCS becomes less and less prestegious.  If the Orange Bowl were such a prestegious bowl in relation to the Cotton then beating a top five team would have easily put Kansas ahead of Mizzou in the final rankings.  What ended up happening was Kansas didn't even move up at all while Mizzou finished top five. 

Finally... if TV ratings are what judges a games value then the Capital One bowl should have been a BCS game because it was bigger than both the Orange and Sugar Bowl.