Downtown Airport (MKC)

Issues concerning Downtown as described by the Downtown Council. River to 31st Street, I-35 to Bruce R. Watkins.
earthling
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Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by earthling »

Haven't found a thread on downtown airport. Will begin with these...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_B ... wn_Airport

In/Outbound flights...
https://flightaware.com/live/airport/KMKC

Up to 700 flights a day, 300 based aircraft...
http://www.flymkc.com/

Can imagine someday it will have more significance (and all smaller commuter airports in general). Air travel could eventually become part of the crowdsourcing/sharing economy with more specialty use cases as airplane/jet technology and improved efficiency changes travel. Crowdsource apps could allow for individual charter operators to say, allow bidding for a flight, or flex fares based on how many signup for a flight.

Vertical takeoff is a reality like this jet, which could someday apply to commercial or some form of commuter/charter travel. This would allow much more flexibility with smaller airports' short runways like MKC, and also allow for more simultaneous takeoffs/landings from multiple pads...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2G36gH1ylI
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by pash »

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Last edited by pash on Thu Aug 10, 2017 5:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
earthling
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by earthling »

MKC most certainly should be further invested into. MKC doesn't appear to be struggling today with 300 planes based there - more likely to move forward than struggle. Downtown still has a massive number of lots to infill (ideally hirise) and it's one of few downtowns that have an airport next door for corporate jets, etc. In not-so-far future is feasible enough wealthy leaning people live downtown with their own private jets/planes. Newer technologies should allow for broader types of flights in future, if even broader charter operations. If anything, there needs to be a shakeup with traditional airlines and charter companies using an Uber type app to allow for bidding or flex pricing signups for flights could become a form of disruption. And many much prefer flying out of a smaller airport than larger (LAX vs Burbank for example). Shrinking KCI down to 45-50 gates with a new terminal for major airlines/international flights and boosting local regional airports with charter service could become an ideal balance of competition and broad types of service.

Am hoping to see commuter airports overall revived with some type of crowdsource/sharing ecosystem something along the lines of Uber/Airbnb, that gives charter companies from small airports a boost, and even further enabling one-person charter operations with say a 4-20 seat plane. Imagine a small charter operator puts up on Uber like app its 10 seat plane up for flights to Chicago, STL and Denver with a 5 seat minimum booking requirement before flight is confirmed. The first 5 book it for say $100 one way, if all 10 seats are booked, everyone gets it for $70 - or something to that effect. It doesn't really need to be this type of fare system if demand is built up. Though it would need to be a national network of this (with an Uber/Airbnb type entity managing it) as you also have to book your return flight as well, possibly from a local charter company in the destination city. The app would also allow the KC charter operator to book flights from say Chicago back to KC.

Technology could allow for managing this sophisticated national web of charter companies (appearing as one system to the flyer) in smaller airports as an alternative to the major airlines' hub/spoke system that more recently only favors largest markets. It also would allow cities/towns to determine their flight destination destinies via near instant demand rather than large airlines dictating the supply.
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by aknowledgeableperson »

It's been quite a few years ago but I knew of a few companies that had multiple employees flying the same time to a location, one location being Wal-Mart Land in Arkansas. They would catch a hired plane, guess a charter, from MKC and fly to their location on their time schedule and the plane would stay there until they were ready to fly back.

And MKC does have a shared plane company on hand:
http://www.execairshare.com/

And it does have a charter service:
http://atdflightsystems.com/air-charter/

And other charter services are available. Can even handle US Customs with advance notice. Keep it as an airport. There is quite a value there as is.
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by longviewmo »

earthling wrote: Crowdsource apps could allow for individual charter operators to say, allow bidding for a flight, or flex fares based on how many signup for a flight.
Already exists. Not super popular, as it's still at a price point where people who have that type of money can afford to be picky.
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by flyingember »

One interesting thing, the big airlines like Delta use the downtown airport still.

So it's not just for small charter and private planes
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by normalthings »

flyingember wrote:One interesting thing, the big airlines like Delta use the downtown airport still.

So it's not just for small charter and private planes
They use the downtown airport when chartered to do so.
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by flyingember »

I supposed there could be chartered flights from KCI to MKC, but seems weird

757s take that route too sometimes
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by normalthings »

flyingember wrote:I supposed there could be chartered flights from KCI to MKC, but seems weird

757s take that route too sometimes
STL Cardinalshave chartered Delta 757's to take them to Downtown Airport from STL in recent years, A few years back Boston sent a Delta 767 to the downtown airport to fly the Red Socks home.
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by shaffe »

I believe almost anytime you see a 737/757 sized plane sitting out on the tarmac it's a baseball team in town to play the Royals. It is very frequently a Delta plane but I've seen others as well, and you'll notice they're almost exclusively out there when the Royals are at home. The 757 that's out there now appears to be scheduled to fly to Oakland tomorrow night, which is where the Mariners are scheduled to begin a series on Monday.
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by KCPowercat »

Correct.
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by smh »

shaffe wrote:I believe almost anytime you see a 737/757 sized plane sitting out on the tarmac it's a baseball team in town to play the Royals. It is very frequently a Delta plane but I've seen others as well, and you'll notice they're almost exclusively out there when the Royals are at home. The 757 that's out there now appears to be scheduled to fly to Oakland tomorrow night, which is where the Mariners are scheduled to begin a series on Monday.
One of my favorite features of baseball season in KC! Almost every Sunday a large plane or two show up in the afternoon and leave around 4-6pm. It never gets old watching them takeoff from downtown.
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by KCPowercat »

I remember clearly during the world series runs hearing the planes take off late after games and getting chills for some reason.
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normalthings
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by normalthings »

shaffe wrote:I believe almost anytime you see a 737/757 sized plane sitting out on the tarmac it's a baseball team in town to play the Royals. It is very frequently a Delta plane but I've seen others as well, and you'll notice they're almost exclusively out there when the Royals are at home. The 757 that's out there now appears to be scheduled to fly to Oakland tomorrow night, which is where the Mariners are scheduled to begin a series on Monday.
I think the Royals usually use United. Does anyone have pics when bigger jet liners flew commerically to downtown?
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by earthling »

A Google images search came up with these...
1 July 1965 - Continental Airlines Flight 12 overran the runway at Kansas City Downtown Airport. All 66 survive.
Image

Image

Not big jets but cool pics nevertheless..
Image

Image

The site claims this is KC circa 1930 but don't recognize any buildings..
Image

Fairly decent sized jet in background, but not before MCI.
Image

Image
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by longviewmo »

Convincing Garmin to move their flight ops from KOJC to downtown would be nice but will probably never happen...
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by missingkc »

Love that picture of the prop planes. I grew up in Cameron which must have been in an approach path to the old airport. I remember the lazy drone of those planes passing over. Great sound effects on a summer afternoon.

And if anyone comes up with a map of approach paths in the 50s and none go over Cameron, I'll thank you to keep it to yourself.
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by TheLastGentleman »

In the old picture, the Romanesque building in the top left corner with the tower is the old board of trade building. You can also see the junction of Main and Delaware behind the plane's left wing
Last edited by TheLastGentleman on Tue Aug 08, 2017 11:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by TheLastGentleman »

Here's the same view via Google Earth
Image
flyingember
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Re: Downtown Airport (MKC)

Post by flyingember »

missingkc wrote:Love that picture of the prop planes. I grew up in Cameron which must have been in an approach path to the old airport. I remember the lazy drone of those planes passing over. Great sound effects on a summer afternoon.

And if anyone comes up with a map of approach paths in the 50s and none go over Cameron, I'll thank you to keep it to yourself.
Real world it is more of a fan out with planes curving into the final approach.

So as far as Cameron being under the path, I 100% believe it.

That experience comes from living directly under the final flight path for years. Even a few miles out planes are off by many blocks either way, probably wind driven.
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