Kansas City could flourish by erasing its state line mode

Missionite · Post by **Missionite** » Sat Feb 19, 2005 5:53 am

Let the border wars begin...

[quote]Kansas City could flourish by erasing its State Line mode

SHIRLEY CHRISTIAN

The bistate tax proposal went down to defeat, but instead of wringing our hands and blaming people from the other state or another county and then fretting about how we are going to maintain high-quality cultural, sports and civic facilities, it is time for a solution that will eliminate or reduce such conflicts.

The best way to do that would be to put all of what we consider Greater Kansas City in the same state.

The line dividing Missouri and Kansas was not imposed from on high. Rather, it is the product of a series of political and military steps beginning in 1808 when William Clark built Fort Osage and negotiated the treaty pushing the Osage Indians west of a line running south from there. Later, the Osages were pushed west of the mouth of the Kansas River, and a straight line running north and south from there became the border of the new state of Missouri. Next, in the 1837 Platte Purchase, the border was moved west to the Missouri River in the area north of the Kansas River, forming the part of Missouri that now overhangs Kansas, including Platte County.

These are anecdotes of history today. The reality now is that nearly 2 million people live and work in a circular space spread over various counties in two states. We would be much more successful, and have much less to argue about, if the main parts of the metropolitan area, including close-in suburbs, were all in the same state.

Most big metropolitan areas suffer the doughnut syndrome, but Kansas City may be the worst. The largest cities and areas that now encircle the center â€” Overland Park, Shawnee/Lenexa, western Wyandotte County, Northland, Blue Springs, Lee's Summit â€” are growing so rapidly that each has the possibility of becoming independent of the area as a whole. That may sound good to the civic and business promoters of those communities, but it is not the way to build a city with national stature.

The existence of the state line, and the fact that the area is so nearly evenly divided between the two states makes it even more difficult to manage the sprawl and develop regional consensus. There are other bistate or even tristate metropolitan areas â€” I've lived in two of them, New York and Washington, D.C., and have spent a lot of time in a third, St. Louis. But the others are much more clearly dominated by the central city, with the areas in adjacent states remaining basically bedroom communities. For all practical purposes, State Line Road is our main street. It's the middle of things.

So which state should we join? The answer is Kansas. I am not motivated by personal interest, even though I live in Kansas. I was born in Missouri, of a family that arrived the year it became a state. I grew up in a neighborhood practically on the state line. I identify with both states, but mostly I identify with â€œKansas City.â€

Missionite · Post by **Missionite** » Sat Feb 19, 2005 6:12 am

As most of you know, I really don't share my thoughts in depth too much on this board for fear of being flogged. But, this column was too tempting to pass up. My love for KC hasn't changed because of this article and it never will. I'll be the first one to correct someone when they say KC is in Kansas, believe me. But some of the things mentioned here are very valid and deserve some thought.

Maybe I'll be bashed and beaten after what I say, but that's the risk I take. For those open to civil discussion without the Kansas hatred, feel free to share your thoughts.

Now on with the comments....

We would be much more successful, and have much less to argue about, if the main parts of the metropolitan area, including close-in suburbs, were all in the same state.

I believe this has been said on this forum a number of times and it's true. Getting rid of the state line (or at least extending it beyond what is today the KC metro area) would help in a LOT of ways both locally and nationally.

So which state should we join? The answer is Kansas. I am not motivated by personal interest, even though I live in Kansas. I was born in Missouri, of a family that arrived the year it became a state. I grew up in a neighborhood practically on the state line. I identify with both states, but mostly I identify with â€œKansas City.â€

ignatius · Post by **ignatius** » Sat Feb 19, 2005 10:32 am

Well it could be fun to speculate on the outcome of something this drastic.

- Jackson County is the most liberal/democratic of the metro area. KC can bounce off STL to influence ultra-conservate Jeff City and the rest of the state, keeping it balanced. If JaxCo were to join KS, both KC and STL 'blue' side would have no leverage anymore, especially w/southern MO growing faster than STL. KC blues would leave at the thought of Topeka in control and it would become more of a red city, unbalanced.

- KC is different than other bi-state metros in that the population is nearly balance on both sides. STL is 80/20. MSP is probably >90/<10.

- I think MSP and Denver have taken off better because the Capitols are in the primary metros, accelerating their rate into the new economy instead of keeping things in a suspended state of the Jesus era economy. I think instead of moving KCMO to KS, we need to move the State Capitals. KS Capital should move to KCK and MO Capitol should move to KCMO.

Hah!

shinatoo · Post by **shinatoo** » Sat Feb 19, 2005 11:05 am

I'm a life time Missourian. But this has been in my mind for a long time. If it ever did happen, as much as it pains me to say it, the whole city should move into Kansas. It's much better to be the big boy in a small state than to play second fiddle in a mid size state. We would get more federal funding also for transportation between KC and St.Lou since it would be interstate.

The only thing that worries me is that Kansas is worse than Missouri in funding its schools.

We would also need to get rid of county governments where they overlap the city.

zlohban · Post by **zlohban** » Sat Feb 19, 2005 11:23 am

Leave Kansas City North (Clay County) in Missouri...believe me this would get the attention of Jeff City and they would invest much more into what is left of KCMO...just to upset Kansas.

ComandanteCero · Post by **ComandanteCero** » Sat Feb 19, 2005 12:07 pm

i personally believe this is something that needs to happen eventually for the KC Metro to be economically efficient (the unifying the metro area under one state). I hadn't gone as far as to think it should unify and join Kansas, but the more i think about it the more it makes sense. With KC being the state's economic powerhouse we'd have the support and backing of a state's worth of federal and state funding for infrastructure and economy. Politically speaking our region would dominate the state and drastically change the power balance. The State's estimated population as of 2003 was 2,723,507, imagine adding on a million people to that number to back up the northeastern numbers, KC metro would practically run the state the same way Chicago runs Illinois. I think with KC being the state's flagship we'd start seeing big changes in how the burbs interacted with the core city and how the state protected and nurtured the core city. I'm not coming at this from a pro-Kansas or anti-Missouri position (i lived in MO double the time that i've lived in KS), i'm looking at it strictly from a Pro-Kansas City view point. I say let's go for it.

ignatius · Post by **ignatius** » Sat Feb 19, 2005 12:32 pm

As a lifetime MO resident, I'd be willing to give JaxCo to KS if the KS State Capitol is moved to downtown.

Post by **dangerboy** » Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:11 pm

This is a moot argument. A lot of research is showing that metro areas are becoming the driving force of the American economy, and states are becoming less and less relevant. Metro areas are becoming like city-states.

The state line is more of psychological problem than anything. It's an easy scapegoat. Moving into one state wouldn't magically give us more money. 30% of the Kansas budget already comes from Johnson County. Getting more clout in Topeka isn't going to get us anymore money from western Kansas. Likewise in Jeff City.

Jeff City and Topeka are getting less important by the day. The most practical way to improve the region is bistate funding, making is more independent of both capitals. Neither state has any interest in solving urban and metro problems, and especially no interested in making the investments needed to solve them.

If anything we should secede from states and form our own city state.

shaffe · Post by **shaffe** » Sat Feb 19, 2005 1:54 pm

why don't we just pull a D.C. and make the state lines go around us on all sides?

KCK · Post by **KCK** » Sat Feb 19, 2005 2:03 pm

Kansas City is already the largest metro area in Kansas and has the most political clout and money, but that would be intensified greatly if the entire region was in Kansas. On the negative side, Clay County, Platte County, Cass County, are all republican counties, so don't expect a more progressive attitude to emerge from those Missouri areas being in Kansas.

moderne · Post by **moderne** » Sat Feb 19, 2005 5:41 pm

This is an ANCIENT idea. It very nearly happened after the civil war. Kansas was going to purchase everything in Missouri west of the Blue River. Unfortunately the story goes, the congressman who was to introduce the legislation got drunk, missed the congressional session and the rest is (or is not) history.

Post by **KCMax** » Sun Feb 20, 2005 3:00 pm

Why doesn't KC just secede from the Union and create its own country?

kman · Post by **kman** » Sun Feb 20, 2005 6:17 pm

what a stupid article. it's not going to happen folks. dangerboy has the right idea.

Deleted User · Post by **Deleted User** » Sun Feb 20, 2005 10:25 pm

eliphar17 · Post by **eliphar17** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 12:04 am

Thank you, MichaelÂ®, for your wonderfully logical and totally objective opinions. I can really tell you made an effort to leave your trademark anti-Kansas attitude out of that post and use solid reasoning instead.

[/sarcasm]

I wish there was something I could do to help make possible an independent metro state. Imagine, if nothing else, all the national and perhaps international attention we would get for becoming the first new American state in over 55 years.

Deleted User · Post by **Deleted User** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 12:17 am

Missionite · Post by **Missionite** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 12:32 am

Just because something won't ever happen, doesn't mean we can't bring it up in discussion. Will you or I ever be a billionaire? Probably not, but we can think about what we'd do with the money right? I guess not.

NOTE TO FORUMERS: Please do not post any nonsense or discuss anything that "won't happen" on this board please. We can only talk about things that will happen in life and things that are or will be an absolute certainty. Dreams and ideas aren't allowed...no matter how far-fetched they seem, and will not be tolerated. Thank you for your cooperation.

Matt

eliphar17 · Post by **eliphar17** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 12:37 am

MichaelÂ® wrote:...but at least it's good to know you and I can finally agree on something.

There's other stuff too, if you look hard enough... for instance, the fact that we both like a downtown stadium rather than renovations at the TSC, despite the debate over the location.

Post by **KCMax** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 9:51 am

: Please do not post any nonsense or discuss anything that "won't happen" on this board please

Crap, I wanted to talk about a winning season for the Royals.

KCghettoboi · Post by **KCghettoboi** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 10:46 am

I would NEVER want to become part of Kansas, but I would like it if the Kansas Side moved over here