KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

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earthling
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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by earthling »

To draw jobs that require higher education, need a strong university. Many starting out after a degree want to get an advanced degree while working. Research universities also draw funding, which improves university overall and also typically creates startups.

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by langosta »

earthling wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 9:50 am
To draw jobs that require higher education, need a strong university. Many starting out after a degree want to get an advanced degree while working. Research universities also draw funding, which improves university overall and also typically creates startups.
A quality university is the only way we land one of those big tech office relocations that Nashville and Austin have been landing.

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by earthling »

Another challenge KC has is that it's been on the losing side of M&As. More local companies acquired than acquiring. Hallmark also has its challenges for obvious reasons, with over 300 jobs cut in KC just announced. They need to diversify even further while still standing up by acquiring smallish growing companies that are a fit. Crayola was apparently a good move but also could be threatened by kids preferring tablets for creativity.

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by FangKC »

Hallmark needs to move more into become an wider entertainment and software designing company. Not only online cards with graphics, but using Crayola to create a line of online games for kids, etc.

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by flyingember »

FangKC wrote:
Thu Jan 09, 2020 4:40 pm
Hallmark needs to move more into become an wider entertainment and software designing company. Not only online cards with graphics, but using Crayola to create a line of online games for kids, etc.
They moved into this market 6-8 years ago. There's room to do more for sure.

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warwickland
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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by warwickland »

normalthings wrote:
Sun Jan 05, 2020 5:43 pm
2. Location: IMHO The campus is located in the best place for a college in KC. UMKC is placed in a much better location than STL's Washington University (residential, not walkable) and SLU (sketchy area, not walkable). Close proximity to the Plaza job center should be capitalized off of for internship and co-op opportunities. A streetcar connection to nightlife in Westport, Plaza, and Power and Light will be a great sell for on-campus living in the future. If the 2 large dorms along CCROW ends up coming down(currently abandoned due to sewage-filled walls), I hope they are replaced with a sort of innovation center. Classrooms, startups, and established businesses would be housed in the same buildings. Businesses leasing office space would help to offset the cost to construct the new classroom spaces.
as an alumni who walked/biked to campus (UMKC) and got into great shape doing so, i beg to differ. the area around wash u is flat and there are fantastic walking/biking connections to the loop through a huge slab of nice wash u owned/rehabbed pre-war apartment stock, see:

https://goo.gl/maps/2UF1GWtmffnji37m8

https://goo.gl/maps/LNtyZFgRQ68UoneL7

its all interconnected, with very heavy foot traffic between the apartments (there are multiple real, pre war, immediately adjacent student apartment neighborhoods in multiple different locations on different sides of wash u), wash u, and the loop which has a grocery store. that being said, umkc has improved greatly but the pedestrian pleasantness still isn't as good as wash u, which also has a massive, flat bike highway going straight to forest park from/through campus. but again, umkc is better than it was in the 00s and the whole foods certainly helps. the hills around umkc are unfortunately a bit of a physical, if not psychological barrier to pedestrian life that will always be somewhat of an issue.

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by flyingember »

warwickland wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 11:27 am
flat bike highway going straight to forest park from/through campus.
That is nice. The Centennial Greenway cuts through campus.

https://greatriversgreenway.org/greenway-search/

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by davidc »

Fare Free Transit: I'm curious why folks think this is a good thing.

First issue is that it is NOT system wide - only KCMO. So any bus that crosses to the other state, suddenly need a fare. I'm sure that will lead to a good bit of confusion when some buses picking up in downtown KCMO will require a fare and some won't.

Second issue: no fare transit has been tried by others before with dubious results (see Austin, TX around 1990, for an example I'm familiar with). I haven't heard anyone on either side of the issue cite previous experiments with free fare. Why not?

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by normalthings »

davidc wrote:
Thu Jan 23, 2020 12:31 am
Fare Free Transit: I'm curious why folks think this is a good thing.

First issue is that it is NOT system wide - only KCMO. So any bus that crosses to the other state, suddenly need a fare. I'm sure that will lead to a good bit of confusion when some buses picking up in downtown KCMO will require a fare and some won't.

Second issue: no fare transit has been tried by others before with dubious results (see Austin, TX around 1990, for an example I'm familiar with). I haven't heard anyone on either side of the issue cite previous experiments with free fare. Why not?

1. I think that this could end up being an issue.

2. You can try preventing this by requiring all riders to disembark at each end of the route or promoting law enforcement to ride more often (see streetcar).

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by earthling »

Gotta start somewhere and if it succeeds it could go metro wide. The confusion shouldn't last long. Bottom line, if you are not a KCMO resident, you can use when within KCMO. But even if it doesn't go metro it still gets many people to jobs that are in the city and doesn't use up parking spaces (available spaces for others). It gets people to downtown events w/out having to deal with parking. It will hopefully get more to take bus in general. If it works long term it may encourage projects w/out much parking. Those who don't use it still benefit because those who do are using up less parking and keeping cars off road. How is that not a good thing?

Just because it failed in one city in a different decade doesn't mean it will fail in KC. That's Negative Nancy thinking. Austin had vandalism problems but also had that issue outside bus system. KC has not had that issue so far with free streetcar. KC has its share of crime but vandalism doesn't seem to be a major problem in general here.

Why not try it for a couple years? Can always end if not working out. This may be KC's only shot to get this town to seriously think about public transit. But I do think adding KCPD foot patrol would help reduce potential issues and may encourage a larger % to feel more comfortable to take bus. Of course not every one will, even in transit strong cities many still refuse to.

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by Riverite »

Exactly we’ve had free streetcar for years which is fine, and there is free bus running through paseo. I think it’ll help Kansas City become a bit of an outlier compared to its peers

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by earthling »

Yeah, KC will stand out if this succeeds and if others follow KC will be referenced as a leader in this space. The success of free streetcar is why we are talking about this. Need to keep that momentum going. Those who have no interest need to realize they still benefit if not intending to use it. The younger generations (all demographics and income levels) aren't as car dependent minded and KC is inches away from catering to them. Let's make it happen and make it work long term.

BTW, I've ridden buses in a lot of cities around US/world and regularly in KC. I see vandalism inside the buses in many cities but not much in KC. Even small things like gum in USB charging ports in other cities. Haven't seen that yet in KC's buses with charging ports. Maybe KCATA is better with upkeep.

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by flyingember »

davidc wrote:
Thu Jan 23, 2020 12:31 am
Fare Free Transit: I'm curious why folks think this is a good thing.

First issue is that it is NOT system wide - only KCMO. So any bus that crosses to the other state, suddenly need a fare. I'm sure that will lead to a good bit of confusion when some buses picking up in downtown KCMO will require a fare and some won't.

Second issue: no fare transit has been tried by others before with dubious results (see Austin, TX around 1990, for an example I'm familiar with). I haven't heard anyone on either side of the issue cite previous experiments with free fare. Why not?
Why do you think someone will suddenly need a fare when leaving KCMO? No one has announced this. All we have so far is a passed resolution to figure out how to fund free bus service. That's it.

The Austin trial lasted ~3 months. It apparently increased ridership by 75% (nearly a doubling) but increased bad riders. It's something to learn from for sure but notice how the streetcar has remained free for almost four years without major incidents. Did you ever consider that we have learned from the very lessons you mention?

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by TrolliKC »

If it increases ridership by 75% in KC, thereby reducing pollution, congestion, etc and the trade-off is increased upkeep, the need for KCPD enforcement, video recording on buses, etc - it is still a win IMO

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by earthling »

Already video recording on KC buses. Not sure if all of them, Dave would know. I think all buses have free WiFi but only newish ones have USB charging ports. I've been riding KC buses since the 90s and have run across bad behavior only a few times, though mainly taking buses through Waldo/Midtown/Downtown/North Oak stretch, only occasionally E Side or KCK buses.

If this increases ridership by 33% first year would be worth it. But would need to increase incrementally over the future to change the dynamics of future KC developments. Would be great for dependency on transit to form (rather than dependency on parking) to the point that businesses will support taxes to support the free bus fare. Even better if they freak out that free fare may come to an end. Would mean it's successful (though not a necessary measurement to continue this).

Is why I think KCMO needs to pursue a 2 year 'test'. One year may not be enough to develop some dependency on the system. And if it fails, so be it. The potential benefit far outweighs the cost of the test, at least those who use it during period will benefit.

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Steve52
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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by Steve52 »

Reduced speed limits all across the city, bring back red light cameras (heavy fines no excuses) and a major beef up of the traffic enforcement department (radar - tickets that hurt) at KCPD.

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by FangKC »

One can deal with crime on transit with having police officers coming on and off the bus/streetcar and being visible. That sends a message. Cameras do help a lot. I rode transit for years in NYC and never had a problem. The most vulnerable one was to crime was when one was in a subway station late at night when alone. That problem was mostly resolved once visible cameras were placed in subway stations.

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by FangKC »

The cost of free transit to the City might be a drop in the bucket if enough residents can be coaxed into taking transit instead of parking cars where they travel. Parking lots produce little to no tax revenue for the City. Surface lots are a net loss not only in revenue but economic activity. That's why a city block in the borough of Manhattan, New York City, produces vastly more of both than in KC.

If more parking lots can be replaced with buildings, that increases economic activity through jobs and retail activity and tax revenue. If lots are replaced with housing, that increases property taxes, earnings taxes, and buyers of goods and services in the surrounding blocks. All net gain. So $8 million the City is making up for fare loss is likely peanuts compares to the larger revenues that will likely be collected once infill occurs. Keep in mind that in some parts of the City 25-40 percent of available land is devoted to parking and car traffic.

No one yet knows what effect taking potentially thousands of cars off the city streets annually will save in street funding. Less wear and tear.

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by Riverite »

True, I think they’ll need to at least commit to a few years publicly, before developers start cutting down on parking. They will also need to lower parking minimums to reflect the new status. Even if those things don’t happen though Kansas City will have less smog, especially for the money I don’t see any real negatives to this

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Re: KC's Big 5 needs for 2020s

Post by FangKC »

Riding for Free in Kansas City

Big cities have shunned free public transit. Now, KC’s free-fares push may provide transit systems across the country with a ‘how-to’ guide.

https://prospect.org/infrastructure/rid ... nsas-city/

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