Property Tax Assessments 2019

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KCPowercat
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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by KCPowercat » Tue Jun 25, 2019 8:44 am

I bet the last to drop will be Mr library himself.

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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by kboish » Tue Jun 25, 2019 8:54 am

And he just got a tax increase too

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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by herrfrank » Tue Jun 25, 2019 10:32 am

Any increase that significantly exceeds the inflation rate has broad ramifications. Houses in Brookside, Waldo, Hyde Park have had $2000 to $3000 annual tax bills for decades. For those to suddenly jump to five figure bills is unacceptable. Does not bode well.

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Steve52
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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by Steve52 » Tue Jun 25, 2019 12:18 pm

chaglang wrote:
Tue Jun 25, 2019 6:34 am
It’s not unfair to think that Jackson County has an ethical obligation not to hike rates as quickly as they have. Residents have made life choices based on their household budget, including approving tax increases for things like the GO Bond. For most people, property taxes are a large part of that budget. The decades-long practice of below market assessments set the expectation with taxpayers that this just how things work, which is not unreasonable because very few of us are tax or county governance experts. I understand that the county is trying to come into compliance with state law, but not being in compliance didn’t seem to be a big deal to the state. The state wasn’t demanding the county comply immediately. So there’s no reason why the county couldn’t phased this in over 3-4 assessment cycles.
This whole mess is totally off the charts. On that I did see this browsing around on line but do not know if it's technically valid, correct, legal, etc.

"I just spoke with the MO State Tax Commission, and they said, unequivocally, that if your Assessment goes up more than 15%, it is required by law that the Assessor must Physically go to your property and do a walk around. This applies to ALL MO Counties.... I confirmed three times with the Tax Authority. Though there are more specifics regarding St. Louis County, she said, every which way, All MO Counties who raise their Assessments over 15%, need to go to the property and walk around, making notes. An aerial view does not count for over 15%."

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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by TheBigChuckbowski » Tue Jun 25, 2019 12:43 pm

KCPowercat wrote:
Tue Jun 25, 2019 7:49 am
After reading the background I have no issues with what the county did. It's on the ones who set the dates to lower rates now to assist taxpayers. Will any of them do it? Lol
Even when they do that, though, it's not really going to help much for the people whose property value went up 300% (or 490% in my case (and it's STILL undervalued)).

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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by flyingember » Tue Jun 25, 2019 12:45 pm

Steve52 wrote:
Tue Jun 25, 2019 12:18 pm
This whole mess is totally off the charts. On that I did see this browsing around on line but do not know if it's technically valid, correct, legal, etc.

"I just spoke with the MO State Tax Commission, and they said, unequivocally, that if your Assessment goes up more than 15%, it is required by law that the Assessor must Physically go to your property and do a walk around. This applies to ALL MO Counties.... I confirmed three times with the Tax Authority. Though there are more specifics regarding St. Louis County, she said, every which way, All MO Counties who raise their Assessments over 15%, need to go to the property and walk around, making notes. An aerial view does not count for over 15%."
rsmo 137.115 subsection 10
Before the assessor may increase the assessed valuation of any parcel of subclass (1) real property by more than fifteen percent since the last assessment, excluding increases due to new construction or improvements, the assessor shall conduct a physical inspection of such property.
It's not unequivocal but they should be able to prove the cause of the increase is from those two items.

To make it more interesting, they only need to alert you of the physical inspection if the county population is over 1 million and is a charter government. rsmo 137.115 subsection 13. From the US census, no county was this large starting in 2010.

Interestingly the rules on what a physical inspection requires also only applies to counties over 1 million too so it could have been a very brief visit and it counts.

So they might have actually done that inspection already for every property and you wouldn't know because Jackson is around 700k.

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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by KCPowercat » Tue Jun 25, 2019 2:46 pm

TheBigChuckbowski wrote:
Tue Jun 25, 2019 12:43 pm
KCPowercat wrote:
Tue Jun 25, 2019 7:49 am
After reading the background I have no issues with what the county did. It's on the ones who set the dates to lower rates now to assist taxpayers. Will any of them do it? Lol
Even when they do that, though, it's not really going to help much for the people whose property value went up 300% (or 490% in my case (and it's STILL undervalued)).
Guess it depends how much they drop it but realistically yes.

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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by DaveKCMO » Tue Jun 25, 2019 5:39 pm

https://twitter.com/MarshannaHester/sta ... 9944227840
As part of the 2019 reassessment process, @JacksonCountyMO received 21,742 informal reviews, which is approximately 7.3% of all parcels. Reminder: Deadline to file appeal with BOE is July 8.

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chaglang
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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by chaglang » Tue Jun 25, 2019 6:15 pm

I hope the Star appreciates all the research this forum does for them.

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Steve52
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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by Steve52 » Tue Jun 25, 2019 6:31 pm

DaveKCMO wrote:
Tue Jun 25, 2019 5:39 pm
https://twitter.com/MarshannaHester/sta ... 9944227840
As part of the 2019 reassessment process, @JacksonCountyMO received 21,742 informal reviews, which is approximately 7.3% of all parcels. Reminder: Deadline to file appeal with BOE is July 8.
Are we sure those numbers are correct? LOL. Anyway the BOE will likely be busy when the "heavy hitters" start lining up.

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Steve52
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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by Steve52 » Tue Jun 25, 2019 6:35 pm

KCPowercat wrote:
Tue Jun 25, 2019 2:46 pm
TheBigChuckbowski wrote:
Tue Jun 25, 2019 12:43 pm
KCPowercat wrote:
Tue Jun 25, 2019 7:49 am
After reading the background I have no issues with what the county did. It's on the ones who set the dates to lower rates now to assist taxpayers. Will any of them do it? Lol
Even when they do that, though, it's not really going to help much for the people whose property value went up 300% (or 490% in my case (and it's STILL undervalued)).
Guess it depends how much they drop it but realistically yes.
Well people can go to the bank now and cash in on some equity. Hey my $70K shack is now $370K. Make it all c-notes.

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DaveKCMO
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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by DaveKCMO » Tue Jun 25, 2019 6:55 pm

chaglang wrote:
Tue Jun 25, 2019 6:15 pm
I hope the Star appreciates all the research this forum does for them.
+1

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FangKC
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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by FangKC » Tue Jun 25, 2019 9:47 pm

Whistleblower says Jackson County did not use full MLS data on assessments

There is surprising new information about how appraisers may have determined the value of homes in Jackson County, and the lack of information they had available to them.

It comes from a whistleblower inside the county who calls the assessment a colossal mistake and decided to share inside information directly with KCTV5 News investigative reporter Angie Ricono.

When most people go to sell their house, they work with a realtor who uses the MLS system, a database of all home sales that contains pictures and details of sales.

However, Jackson County didn’t renew its subscription to this service, so during the middle of the latest assessment, they lost access to this database.

Despite not being able to check the information, the county moved forward with the assessment and appraisers just winged it.
...

https://www.kctv5.com/news/investigatio ... a76b5.html

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chaglang
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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by chaglang » Wed Jun 26, 2019 6:09 am

That’s a remarkably bad article. They probably should have led with the part about MLS not renewing the county’s subscription and directing the county to use the alternative program that JoCo does - which the JaCo did.

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Steve52
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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by Steve52 » Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:48 am

chaglang wrote:
Wed Jun 26, 2019 6:09 am
That’s a remarkably bad article. They probably should have led with the part about MLS not renewing the county’s subscription and directing the county to use the alternative program that JoCo does - which the JaCo did.

Well the current assessment process-work was remarkably bad also. The county has had six years to tweak, modify, streamline and fix the system. I'll give Coons credit for admitting mistakes were made back in 2013. The current crew at the helm isn't helping their reputation by being evasive, defensive, and cocky you would think they would know better then that but obviously not.

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chaglang
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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by chaglang » Wed Jun 26, 2019 11:06 am

I don't think they've been evasive at all. In fact they seem to be rather blunt about why this is happening.

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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by kboish » Wed Jun 26, 2019 11:15 am

I'm just curious if the "investigative" reporter followed up on the statement that

"after several emails back and forth, we were told Johnson County, KS was using the complimentary data feed alternative with certain parameters. We asked about using the same parameters and a sample of what we would receive was sent to us. On December 12, 2018 we received our login information for the data feed for the same complimentary data feed alternative as used by Johnson County, KS."

Does Johnson County follow the same process? If so, why does it matter if this is what Jackson, County is using it?

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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by KCAppraiser » Wed Jun 26, 2019 3:57 pm

kboish wrote:
Wed Jun 26, 2019 11:15 am

Does Johnson County follow the same process? If so, why does it matter if this is what Jackson, County is using it?
Johnson County can use the process described in the article because their data is vastly superior to Jackson County's and they attempt to inspect most houses after they sell. They have first hand knowledge of most sales. Jackson County's data inconsistent to the point that it really shouldn't be relied upon. A lot of their data is decades old. They attempted to update some areas of the county a few years ago, however, they sent commercial appraisers to measure houses and they included basement areas in the GLA which screwed everything up. Side splits, atrium splits, cal splits and other similar houses are now being compared to much larger houses now. So even when they try to update their data they screw it up. They have access to sale prices, permit data, etc, however, they don't use that information as much as they should. A lot of the sale information is sitting in boxes that will be put into their systems...sometime. Even when they had access to MLS data they had no idea how to consistently incorporate that data into their models. I could go on. The whole department is a complete mess.

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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by bobbyhawks » Wed Jun 26, 2019 5:57 pm

IMO, there is no single house in the Westside that could sell for $1.5 million, yet at least one brand new property on a small lot in the Westside North was valued in the assessment at $1.5+ million. The properties with homes on either side of it are both under $175k (and both of those assessments were high). $1.5+ million is just an insane number no matter how you slice it, and there is no way this was done using anything other than winging it. The land value assessment went up 3,452%, and the home assessment without considering the land price (new construction + improvements) was still over $1.4 million.

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Re: Property Tax Assessments 2019

Post by kboish » Wed Jun 26, 2019 9:04 pm

KCAppraiser wrote:
Wed Jun 26, 2019 3:57 pm
kboish wrote:
Wed Jun 26, 2019 11:15 am

Does Johnson County follow the same process? If so, why does it matter if this is what Jackson, County is using it?
Johnson County can use the process described in the article because their data is vastly superior to Jackson County's and they attempt to inspect most houses after they sell. They have first hand knowledge of most sales. Jackson County's data inconsistent to the point that it really shouldn't be relied upon. A lot of their data is decades old. They attempted to update some areas of the county a few years ago, however, they sent commercial appraisers to measure houses and they included basement areas in the GLA which screwed everything up. Side splits, atrium splits, cal splits and other similar houses are now being compared to much larger houses now. So even when they try to update their data they screw it up. They have access to sale prices, permit data, etc, however, they don't use that information as much as they should. A lot of the sale information is sitting in boxes that will be put into their systems...sometime. Even when they had access to MLS data they had no idea how to consistently incorporate that data into their models. I could go on. The whole department is a complete mess.
Thanks. Getting some information on the method they used (as opposed to what they did not use) is much more informative.

This is not encouraging info!

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